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I was wondering, is there any detailed information on how a new Space Marine Chapter is created? I'm not referring to what organs are implanted, but the creation of a new chapter as a whole?

Thanks

It needs a direct order from the high lords, but beyond that the exact circumstances vary. Some are created to guard particular areas (e.g. the Astral Claws), some are created to replace a dead chapter's role, some are created because some idiot feels inventive, and at least one of the Dark Angels successors (Disciples of Caliban)was created when the Dark Angels bribed/persuaded/blackmailed the High lords into it.

I was more interested in the process involved. Given that all space marines spend time as scouts while they develop. Does this mean that when a new one is created, for a time you have almost an entire chapter of scouts? Or do they wait for them to fully mature into Space Marines before declaring it a new chapter and sending it into the field?

Ok, my bad.
My understanding about that is that a bunch of marines from another chapter (ideally one with the same ancestor) provides Chapter Masters/Captains/etc. I would imagine that the regular marines would all be at about the same level, so I think they'd wait until they have 1000 full marines before sending them out.
Another possible idea would be sending the scout units out to get experience while they build the chapter up, so that when they reach 1000 marines they already have a few vets.

That's what I thought as well, or though I did wonder if they built them up a company at a time - even though the process takes 7 years or so, that is still a relatively short time in the terms of the Imperium. That's why I wondered if there was any actual fluff around it.

My understanding about that is that a bunch of

That is something that is frequently mentioned. If what you want is actual published material, then that does not exist. GW haven't specified whether they are created all at once. The one place where the "bunch of marines from" somewhere else show up has been mentioned is in Imperial Armor.

I think the case for the marines being created almost all at once is more sophisticated than the case for doing it piecemeal. I think you should read this thread if you want to read about whether they are created all at once or a little at the time.

In The Aegidan Oath, one of the xmas shorts by Gaulding.
It covers it a bit. The third founding was coming around. There was a chaplain and a veteran went looking for a original for some reason. Dont want to spoil it to much.
The chaplain was designated 73 battle brothers for the basis of a new chapter.

pelicaniforce wrote:

My understanding about that is that a bunch of

That is something that is frequently mentioned. If what you want is actual published material, then that does not exist. GW haven't specified whether they are created all at once. The one place where the "bunch of marines from" somewhere else show up has been mentioned is in Imperial Armor.

I think the case for the marines being created almost all at once is more sophisticated than the case for doing it piecemeal. I think you should read this thread if you want to read about whether they are created all at once or a little at the time.

Thanks for the link, some interesting ideas there. As a sort of extension to my question, how many terminator suits are there in existence, or more specifically, are they still being made (admittedly by artisans). In other words, could a new chapter start out with 100 brand new Terminator suits (or more if their role was to board space hulks and cleanse/salvage/destroy them).

Probably not and who knows how many.
Theoretically they should still be being made. But they may have gone back to the plasma cleaning roots and scrubbing plasma rooms is probably a bit higher on the Mechs priority's than armouring 100 guys.

the ancient wrote:
Probably not and who knows how many.
Theoretically they should still be being made. But they may have gone back to the plasma cleaning roots and scrubbing plasma rooms is probably a bit higher on the Mechs priority's than armouring 100 guys.

Hmmm, how long would a space marine vet have to dangle a mech upside down over a plasma reactor before he changes his mind about crafting more?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Can see it now, another space marine comes along 'what you doing?' he asks 'requisitioning a suit of terminator armour' comes the reply

icn1982 wrote:Thanks for the link, some interesting ideas there. As a sort of extension to my question, how many terminator suits are there in existence, or more specifically, are they still being made (admittedly by artisans). In other words, could a new chapter start out with 100 brand new Terminator suits (or more if their role was to board space hulks and cleanse/salvage/destroy them).

Possible but extremely unlikely. Like dreadnoughts, Terminator armor is still being made but it takes a tremendous amount of time and effort. I imagine most forge worlds don't when have the capability of making them from scratch.

pelicaniforce wrote:

My understanding about that is that a bunch of

That is something that is frequently mentioned. If what you want is actual published material, then that does not exist. GW haven't specified whether they are created all at once. The one place where the "bunch of marines from" somewhere else show up has been mentioned is in Imperial Armor.

I think the case for the marines being created almost all at once is more sophisticated than the case for doing it piecemeal. I think you should read this thread if you want to read about whether they are created all at once or a little at the time.

A discussion I had with Laurie Goulding here confirmed the cadre theory of training new marines to be true. He also mentioned that an upcoming story of his would make that a little clearer. Looks like Aegidan Oath is that story.

the ancient wrote:
In The Aegidan Oath, one of the xmas shorts by Gaulding.
It covers it a bit. The third founding was coming around. There was a chaplain and a veteran went looking for a original for some reason. Dont want to spoil it to much.
The chaplain was designated 73 battle brothers for the basis of a new chapter.

The Cadre theory does make sense IMO. If the new marines were trained by AdMech, IG veterans, Comissars etc then they'd surely all become Emperor-worshippers? Besides, it also makes sense in the way the IoM splits power and influence. They don't want Space Marines to rule or command large forces, but they also don't want any other party to have access to a Chapter that's somehow beholden to them. Marines are supposed to be outsiders bound by oath that come in and help when needed as a matter of tradition. Thus it makes sense to have a few experienced marines help train the newbies and tell them about SM traditions as seen by the Chapter they came from - the new Chapter will come up with their own traditions in time but they will be influenced by the Cadre in some basic fashion.

And imagine how upset the existing Chapters would be if they thought new Chapters were founded to not be "marines like them"!

Aye its to do with Sotha and the scythes founding. Hes not happy with the Ultras that come asking. I cant remember but I think they expected having a chapter within 100 years.Hes not happy with Dorn doing it.
Guilliman presented Amit with his armour chain fist thingys at the 2nd, hes not happy about it. Prolly thinking about drinking wolf blood. But Azkellion is a bitch and does what hes told.

Im surprised the Alpha fans arent complaining about Ianius tbh.

icn1982 wrote:
I was more interested in the process involved. Given that all space marines spend time as scouts while they develop. Does this mean that when a new one is created, for a time you have almost an entire chapter of scouts? Or do they wait for them to fully mature into Space Marines before declaring it a new chapter and sending it into the field?

Making space marines is extremely time consuming and requires a lot of facilities, staff and effort. It is unlikely the admech could make all 1000 marines in one go, so they will stage it into managable groups, growing 10 then 50 then 100 then additional incriments of 100 until they reach strength. It probably takes decades, which is alright as they also have to build all the guns, armor, and tanks and find a strike cruiser and a bunch of frigates no one is using.

Making a marine is no more time consuming than raising a orphan that turns into a storm trooper or commissar.
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