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I've never really been a fan of custom characters in 40k as people tend to give them absolutely ridiculous "Mary Sue" rules with 10 S10 WS10 attacks at initiative. However, since I've delved into 30k I've really gotten into the fluff of the Iron Hands and so have started designing my own fluff for my "Clan Ichor" of the 88th Company. The Praetor of this clan is known as "Caelan" (Gaelic for Great Warrior) is supposed to be a warrior without peer amongst the Iron Hands but a poor tactician at times. His stats are as follows:

Praetor Caelan Godwinson of Clan Ichor


WS:6 BS:5 S:4 T:4 W:3 I:5 A:4 LD:10
(As you can see, nothing untoward here as he has the basic Praetor stat line)

Equipment:
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Cyber Familiar (Iron Hand upgrade that buffs our characters invulnerable save by 1, giving him a 3++)
Master-Crafted Paragon Blade
Thunder Hammer (2 specialist weapons that gives him +1 attack and allows him to deal with walkers and infantry)
Digital Weapons
Melta Bomb
(All legal upgrades, nothing custom yet)

USR:
Indomitable Will: The bionic might of Iron Hands is well known, but this is enhanced by Caelans incredible willpower, making him almost impervious to pain. Caelan has a 5++ FNP

Warlord Trait: Paladin of Glory - Allows himself and all units within 6" to wound on a roll of 1 less than what they normally would have.

Legiones Astartes Iron Hands: Caelan receives all shooting attacks at -1S than usual.


The only custom aspect of this character is his FNP and his fixed warlord trait. Would you let me field him against you, and how many points do you think the FNP and fixed warlord trait are worth?

Is that Warlord trait from one of the HH books bc it seems OP to me. I mean, you are basically giving him and anyone in 6" of him the BA Legion rule in for shooting as well as CC.

What I would do is cost out all his gear then add maybe 40-50 pts for the FNP and WL trait.

 More Dakka wrote:
Is that Warlord trait from one of the HH books bc it seems OP to me. I mean, you are basically giving him and anyone in 6" of him the BA Legion rule in for shooting as well as CC.

What I would do is cost out all his gear then add maybe 40-50 pts for the FNP and WL trait.

It is yeah and I totally agree that it is OP but I probably should have mentioned that it only has an effect in CC, not shooting.

40-50 pts just for a warlord trait and FNP? Is it that much because of the FNP or the warlord trait?

Doesnt one of the Black Books have rules for developing characters? I think it's mostly a campaign thing, but its still something to look at.

I applaud the minimalist approach to this; all too frequently people decide they need unique rules for everything and a pile of unique weapons besides, it's refreshing to see someone try to make personality happen out of a few tweaks.

Given the stack of expensive upgrades (that would have a generic character running at 225pts before the fixed Warlord Trait and the FNP came in) and given some of the crazier possible unique characters in 30k (Sigismund is all of 230pts) I'd probably play against him without any price increase for the FNP and the fixed Warlord Trait.

Though that may also be because I've read the Warlord Trait, and Paladin of Glory doesn't actually give you a 6" bubble of Blood Angels Legion Tactics, it gives you a +1 to determine who won combat in the Assault phase. Still good, but not really worth making the character more expensive than Sigismund.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Doesnt one of the Black Books have rules for developing characters? I think it's mostly a campaign thing, but its still something to look at.

They're not the greatest analogy; they give random characteristic advances and a set of random skill tables, and there's no pricing suggested.

I would only add a drawback rule to represent him being a slightly worse tactician,. A sometimes worse leader who tries to make up for it by just being rock hard is pretty nice so it should absolutely be represented.

If I were to make special characters of my own I would also go the minimalist route. Base them on an already existing character type, determine what they do that the type usually doesn't and then also determine what they don't do that the type usually does. Removing a rule, declining to take a staple piece of wargear or changing the statline somehow.

How about a Primus Medicae who's S5 T3 and spends a lot of time researching his the nature of his odd body and enters battle so much to prove his loyalty so he isn't discarded as a mutation? Or a Praevian who is particularly good at field maintenance and thus is more independent than usual but also not quite as trusted due to fears he's identifying too much with his machines?

These might not be particularly deep but if you want to get people to try playing against them then "shorty and snappy" is the perfect pitch. It's also easier for them to remember.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
I applaud the minimalist approach to this; all too frequently people decide they need unique rules for everything and a pile of unique weapons besides, it's refreshing to see someone try to make personality happen out of a few tweaks.

Given the stack of expensive upgrades (that would have a generic character running at 225pts before the fixed Warlord Trait and the FNP came in) and given some of the crazier possible unique characters in 30k (Sigismund is all of 230pts) I'd probably play against him without any price increase for the FNP and the fixed Warlord Trait.

Though that may also be because I've read the Warlord Trait, and Paladin of Glory doesn't actually give you a 6" bubble of Blood Angels Legion Tactics, it gives you a +1 to determine who won combat in the Assault phase. Still good, but not really worth making the character more expensive than Sigismund.

I absolutely agree with you, I find that a custom character has more personality when taking the minimalist approach. If a character has every special rule then that doesn't show any of the traits a character is known for. Through use of a rule like FNP, you see that they have a determined mindset. Or relentless showing all they care about is getting into the combat.

If that is the case about the warlord trait then I may owe an apology to a necron player at my LGS. Kinda destroyed his praetorians with that trait Thanks for pointing out my mistake though

Rosebuddy wrote:
I would only add a drawback rule to represent him being a slightly worse tactician,. A sometimes worse leader who tries to make up for it by just being rock hard is pretty nice so it should absolutely be represented.

If I were to make special characters of my own I would also go the minimalist route. Base them on an already existing character type, determine what they do that the type usually doesn't and then also determine what they don't do that the type usually does. Removing a rule, declining to take a staple piece of wargear or changing the statline somehow.

How about a Primus Medicae who's S5 T3 and spends a lot of time researching his the nature of his odd body and enters battle so much to prove his loyalty so he isn't discarded as a mutation? Or a Praevian who is particularly good at field maintenance and thus is more independent than usual but also not quite as trusted due to fears he's identifying too much with his machines?

These might not be particularly deep but if you want to get people to try playing against them then "shorty and snappy" is the perfect pitch. It's also easier for them to remember.

Thats actually a really good point. The first example that comes to mind in Ragnar Blackmane and his "Insane Bravado" that forces him to accept challenges. I think that would fit my character quite well, but I don't want to rehash some old rule. I'm thinking maybe something like:

Single-minded assault: Caelan often gets caught up in the joy of battle and fails to direct his battle brothers correctly. All friendly reserve rolls are taken at -1.

Or...

Trophy-Hunter: Caelan views a battle as lost unless he personally takes the enemy warlords head. If the enemy warlord is not slain, the enemy gains 1 Victory Point and you lose one.

Or...

The Flesh is Weak!: Caelan despises the weakness' of the flesh more than any of his battle-brothers and relies solely upon the bionic might of the Iron Tenth . A force with Caelan may not take allies of any kind.

Or...

Slow to action, quick to fury: Caelan was personally censured by the Lord of the 13th for his "lacklustre logistics". He rose to his rank for his martial prowess and inspiring presence alone and is an awful tactician. Caelan's force may never take first turn or attempt to seize the initiative.



How many of these rules should I take to properly express his character?

Not taking allies and worsened reserve rolls aren't very big drawbacks if you don't take allies or put units in reserve. It might be the case here that these would be appropriate, I don't know how you play, I'm just pointing out things that could be viewed as cop-outs by your opponent.

Come up with a single drawback that is kind of annoying. It has to be genuine but not so rough it makes fielding him unfun. It's probably going to take a while to playtest until it's something you think fits the character, is broadly applicable and a fair trade-off to your opponent but not crippling. Try to think of something you would accept as a cool or funny drawback if another person asked if they could field their own special character.

Like, let's say you have a character that it seems like the universe has plans for. Their sole special rule would be The Scales of Fate which grants a reroll of all the character's armour (and/or other) saves that come up a 1 but forces a reroll of all the character's to hit rolls that come up a 6. Both lucky and unlucky.

Rosebuddy wrote:
Not taking allies and worsened reserve rolls aren't very big drawbacks if you don't take allies or put units in reserve. It might be the case here that these would be appropriate, I don't know how you play, I'm just pointing out things that could be viewed as cop-outs by your opponent.

Come up with a single drawback that is kind of annoying. It has to be genuine but not so rough it makes fielding him unfun. It's probably going to take a while to playtest until it's something you think fits the character, is broadly applicable and a fair trade-off to your opponent but not crippling. Try to think of something you would accept as a cool or funny drawback if another person asked if they could field their own special character.

Like, let's say you have a character that it seems like the universe has plans for. Their sole special rule would be The Scales of Fate which grants a reroll of all the character's armour (and/or other) saves that come up a 1 but forces a reroll of all the character's to hit rolls that come up a 6. Both lucky and unlucky.

I can see what you mean about the reserve rolls, I wouldn't want anyone to feel like I was screwing them over. However, I view it as a rule that is supposed to limit his tactical ability but not cripple him as you say. I don't have a particular play style, but I usually have at least one drop pod in 50% of my games. It wouldn't screw me over too much, but there would be times that my big counter attack fails and my Vets don't arrive because of it and my opponent can nod in satisfaction and chuckle "just as planned" knowing that me bringing this character has screwed me over.

Upon revision of what you said, maybe something more like "You get -1 to your own reserves and they can re roll their own reserves and you can't go first or seize the initiative." That shows a warrior who really isn't cut out to be a leader and is just all about punching people in the face.

I wouldn't say every character needs to have a nerf in some way. They should definitely have an area they don't have a strength in, but they don't always need a nerf. Your character isn't quite so bad, a lot of the strength comes from vanilla sources. In fact, the only custom bits are FNP, and the Warlord Trait.

The FNP can be obtained by adding an Apothecary, and that would give it to the rest of the unit anyway. I'd just take off the price of a Tactical Marine from the Apothecary, giving us the price of FNP. The squad bonus is counteracted by the fact it can't be removed via killing the "Apothecary". 30 points.

The fixed warlord trait is more difficult to work. Are you keeping it as you said, or using the ACTUAL warlord trait? Assuming you're keeping the actual trait, I'd price it at about 30, or however much a Herald Consul upgrade costs, because they're the same effect, if I'm not mistaken? Nvm, I'm mistaken

Honestly dont give him FNP 5+ just give him 6+ then price up how much the character costs exactly then cost him an extra 15 for the FNP and fixed warlord trait. Your running a character at 240 that way, the points sink on him alone is enough of a drawback lol.