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CAD

HQ
Kharn the Betrayer
160

Elites
Chaos Terminators-
1 Terminator Champion with a Combi-bolter and a Power Axe
3 Chaos Terminators with Combi-bolters and Power Axes
Land Raider with a Dirge Caster, Extra Armour, and a Combi-Flamer
398

Troops
Khorne Berzerkers-
1 Berzerker Champion with a Plasma Pistol, Power Fist and Melta Bombs
9 Khorne Berzerkers with Chainaxes, 2 with Plasma Pistols
Icon of Wrath
Chaos Rhino with a Dirge Caster, Extra Armour, and a Combi-Flamer
382

Khorne Berzerkers-
1 Berzerker Champion with a Plasma Pistol, Power Fist and Melta Bombs
9 Khorne Berzerkers with Chainaxes, 2 with Plasma Pistols
Icon of Wrath
Chaos Rhino with a Dirge Caster, Extra Armour, and a Combi-Flamer
382

Fast Attack
1 Helldrake with a Baleflamer

Formation
Mayhem Pack
3 Hellbrutes with Missile Launchers and Reaper Autocannons
345

Totals out to 1837

Pretty straightforward list, plan is to put Kharn with the Termies in the Land Raider, and just have each transport go up, dump out the guys and charge. Have the Hellbrutes drop in from behind and shoot things, the Helldrake will come in and do Helldrake things, etc. I honestly just wanted to throw my Kharn in a list.

Hmm. Is there a reason you're not planning to run this as a Butcherhorde? All that extra movement is pretty friggin' awesome for a WE list, especially for delivering Termies.

I suspect you're going to have issues with that LR too. You only have that one target that needs attention from better than S7, and I think most shooting lists will rock it pretty hard.

Generally speaking I think your model count is light considering that you only have one choppy character and only so-so punch at range. It's probably ok for TAC store games, but it's going to struggle against optimized lists. That's not to say that every list need to be WAAC, but I think this could tightened up.

 Fenris-77 wrote:
Hmm. Is there a reason you're not planning to run this as a Butcherhorde? All that extra movement is pretty friggin' awesome for a WE list, especially for delivering Termies.

I suspect you're going to have issues with that LR too. You only have that one target that needs attention from better than S7, and I think most shooting lists will rock it pretty hard.

Generally speaking I think your model count is light considering that you only have one choppy character and only so-so punch at range. It's probably ok for TAC store games, but it's going to struggle against optimized lists. That's not to say that every list need to be WAAC, but I think this could tightened up.

Is the butcherhorde a thing from traitor legions? I haven't been able to get it yet, so I don't really anything out of it.

And yea, this was basically just made so I could throw kharn in something and have fun with him. That being said, what could I do to make it better?

There's no way those points costs are right, surely ... Oh sweet zombie jeebus, they are.

No. Just, no.

Loading up fragile melee units with pointless expensive wargear is bad and putting them in expensive fragile transports that they can't charge out of is worse.

Plasma pistols on expensive, fragile 1W models is never a good idea (your berzerker champ is 74 points!), let alone on models that will only ever fire 2, maaaaaybe 3 shots all game. You're going flat out first turn, so no firing then. You move 6", disembark 6" and probably shoot turn 2, maybe run if you're still a bit too far away and then you're shooting and charging turn 3 if you haven't been vapourised.

Chainaxes? Name a single thing outside of necron warriors or maaaaaybe 'Ard Boyz that has a 4+ save that isn't going to get obliterated immediately if it's in combat with 'zerks? Hell, I'd wager even 'Ard Boys are still going to get absolutely wrecked even without chainaxes for that matter.

You've got a single land raider and 2 rhinos on the board first turn and then you're making 2 reserve rolls turn 2 (with no reserve manipulation and no scatter reduction for the 'brutes). Those rhinos aren't going to last a single shooting phase, not at 1850.

Speaking of the transports, why the combi flamers? The extra armour I can understand, getting stunned is a critical failure on a transport, but the flamers don't serve any purpose. The rhinos already have a bolter and the raider has 3 guns already, so it's not for when you have weapon destroyed --> immobilised protection. To make it worse, you're missing out on dozer blades. you've got a 1 in 6 chance that you immobilise your ~400 point units every time you drive over a picket fence! Spend the 5 points for a dozerblade instead of those combis, please, I beg you!

I've tried the mayhem pack a few times myself and was never impressed. They've got a 1/3rd chance to not shoot every turn and that 1/3rd chance also means that they MUST try and charge the closest target where they are going to be str6 ap- and tarpitted forever. Again, I beg you, if you must take them, drop the missile launcher and stick the powerfist back on. You won't miss that single str8 shot, but you will damn sure miss the powerfist when you have to charge. Think about this though - those 3 helbrutes and the two rhinos are 465 points. That's enough for 2 heavy support land raiders to replace the rhinos so your berserkers can charge turn 2 instead of standing around getting shot to death.

As for the heldrake - If you actually manage not to get your guys blown off the table, then you're in combat from turn 2/3 onwards, so what's the 'drake going to shoot at? You'd be much better off with 5 spawn (which is 180 points vs the 170 on the drake) running up the table locking things into combat and generally being a nuisance and since they're T5, they're going to have to divert some heavy weapons fire away from your rhinos/land raider to deal with them.

If you don't already own Traitor Legions, beg, borrow or steal a copy (note: don't actually steal a copy) and have a look at the chaos warband for a world eaters army. Hell, you can even run the maelstrom of gore as the core for your butcherhoarde if you absolutely must have berserkers, but they both enable world eaters infinately better than a CAD does that it's not even funny anymore.

So drop the chainaxes, the plasma pistols, the combo-flamers on the rhinos, and the Hellbrutes, and replace the rhinos with Land Raiders, and put dozer blades on them. I don't really like Spawn, is there anything else I could replace the helldrake with? Maybe Raptors or Warp Talons?
The main reason I'm using berserkers is honestly cause I just like thematically Kharn running in with berzerkers, idk how good it is or not.
I had actually planned on getting TL tonight ironically enough, and I do have Traitors Hate, if that helps at all.

Traitor legions makes world eaters a force to be reckoned with. At minimum free VOTLW and adamantium will on everything for free.
Done right you should be able to make turn 1 charges.
On foot.

 Kizuke21 wrote:


Is the butcherhorde a thing from traitor legions? I haven't been able to get it yet, so I don't really anything out of it.

And yea, this was basically just made so I could throw kharn in something and have fun with him. That being said, what could I do to make it better?

It's from the Kharn dataslate , and you need to get a copy. Just the highlights - your units get a free 2d6 move after deployment, almost everything gets fearless and furious charge for free, berserkers are still troops, you get to re-roll failed charges, and most of your units get +1 LD and hatred of most Imperial Marines.

There's minimal tax on the formation too, other having to take 1 each Elite, Fast, and Heavy. MOstly it doesn't feel like a tax.

It's sweet. Makes WE pretty competitive IMO.

Here's what I propose, take the butcherhorde decurion and take a warband, two of the berserk squads are swapped to csm squads, add a CCW and a mark of Khorne and they essentially are the same as berserkers (Fearless, furious charge,admantium will, re-roll charges) swap the pistols for plasma guns and your squad will have bolters to work with the plasma guns and ccw+pistols too! Drop the banner, you have re-rolls and furious from world eaters, drop chainaxes(can't take em) and drop the melta bomb since you have a power fist. Drop the combi on the rhino, you have obj secured and will use it for objectives not flamer duty.

Hopefully you have some more berserkers or marines to equip as havoc's, equip them the same as the berserkers (CCW,bolter, bolt pistol) and they'll still function the same, if you don't have enough models just remove since from the other two squads.

Terminators are fine and are needed, but you'll have to drop the Drake, mayhem pack wargear may want to be changed but keep the formation it's needed as an auxiliary choice.

Hopefully this trims some points, and now your whole army is obj secured!

 hiveof_chimera wrote:
Here's what I propose, take the butcherhorde decurion and take a warband, two of the berserk squads are swapped to csm squads, add a CCW and a mark of Khorne and they essentially are the same as berserkers (Fearless, furious charge,admantium will, re-roll charges) swap the pistols for plasma guns and your squad will have bolters to work with the plasma guns and ccw+pistols too! Drop the banner, you have re-rolls and furious from world eaters, drop chainaxes(can't take em) and drop the melta bomb since you have a power fist. Drop the combi on the rhino, you have obj secured and will use it for objectives not flamer duty.

Please don't put Plasma Guns on your assault units. CSM become assaulting monsters in World Eaters, there is no reason to give them expensive guns that can kill them and will most likely never be fired. Keep the point cost low and replace your bolters with CCWs. If you want to bring special weapons, bring Flamers. Your other fast units are going to be in the enemy deployment zone turn one/two, meanwhile CSM squads are going to be in the mid field by then. If you sit on objectives mid field objectives with CSM and back field objectives with Rhinos, any deep striking enemy units will need to split their forces to deal with you, and when they do they will be easy pickings.

So I got Traitor Legions, and redid my list quite a bit. I did indeed make it a Butcherhorde. It's up to 2000 points now

Core: Maelstrom of Gore - 680 points
Kharn the Betrayer - 160 points
4 Khorne Berzerkers (5), MoK, VotLW, Champ has bolt pistol and Power Fist - 130 points apiece

Auxiliary: Raptor Talon - 645 points
1 Chaos Lord; MoK, VotLW, Jump Pack, Power Fist, Combi-flamer, Sigil of Corruption - 135 points
1 Raptors (5 models); MoK, VotLW, 2 flamers, Champ with Power fist and Combi-flamer - 150 points
2 Warp Talons (5 models); MoK, VotLW - 180 points apiece

Auxiliary: Hellforged Warpack - 675 points
1 Warpsmith; MoK, VotLW, Power Axe, Bolt Pistol - 120 points
1 Defiler; Combi-bolter, Dozer Blades - 205 points
2 Forgefiend - 175 points apiece


I'm mainly wanting to stick to the Berzerkers cause I just really like the idea of Kharn running with them.
I have the Raptors equipped with so many flamers cause I want them to be like anti-infantry, just hoppin around flaming people. I know it's probably not that good, but I think it's decent.
I was debating between a Hellforged Warpack and a Terminator Annihilation Force, someone else said to run the Warpack so that I could have some back line tanks and it made sense to me.
I'd run the 'Zerkers up with Kharn being in one of them and charge, have the Raptors bounce around burning infantry, and have the Warpack stay back and bombard people. I'm still debating on whether or not I wanna run the Warp Talons up to charge people or wait and Deep Strike them in.
I figured I'd post my updated list here instead of starting a new thread, felt like it'd be taking up space.

If I were forced to choose between the two, I'd go terminator force over the warppack. Min squads of terminators are a real threat in World Eaters. Start them on the board and you have a good chance of getting at least one squad into charge range turn one. At the very least it's more tArget saturation for your opponent to deal with.

I've run the MoG Kharn with a Raptor talon several times now and here is what I've learned. Kharn squad is going to get all of the shooting directed at it and a 5 man squad wil melt and Kharn dies to everything outside a squad. So I like to run 3 small squads and one bigger squad for Kharn or sometimes sticking a TobB lord in there as added protection.

For the raptor talon. Warp talons have failed me every time. While melta Raptors are amazing. You already have berzerker squads to wipe infantry it's like the only thing they are good at. So you don't need raptors performing double duty. Give them melta and get rid of the talons for more raptors. I still need to replace a warp talon squad because I thought they would be good so I know the feeling.

MonumentOfRibs wrote:
If I were forced to choose between the two, I'd go terminator force over the warppack. Min squads of terminators are a real threat in World Eaters. Start them on the board and you have a good chance of getting at least one squad into charge range turn one. At the very least it's more tArget saturation for your opponent to deal with.

I second this, but if you -do- decide to keep the Warpack, I'd suggest going for Maulerfiends and a Hlebrute. Make the Helbrute the alpha for that 4+ invuln and let the Maulerfiend help with target saturation when your Berserkers are moving up-field.