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Thousand Sons - Traitor Legion List - Revised

Thousand Sons: Traitor Legion - 1,850 Points List

HQ:

Exalted Sorcerer - ML3, Astral Grimoire, Disc - 245 Points

Exalted Sorcerer - ML3, Helm Of The Third Eye - 205 Points

Troops:

Rubric Marines - Add Four Rubric Marines - 242 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Chaos Space Marines - Add Five Chaos Space Marines, Two Plasma Guns, Mark of Tzeentch - 190 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Chaos Space Marines - Add Five Chaos Space Marines, Two Plasma Guns, Mark of Tzeentch - 190 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Elites:

Chaos Terminators - Three Chain Fists, Mark of Tzeentch - 146 Points

Heavy Support:

Havocs - Four Plasma Guns, Mark of Tzeentch - 145 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Havocs - Four Melta Guns, Mark of Tzeentch - 125 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Havocs - Four Auto Cannons, Mark of Tzeentch - 125 Points - Rhino - 35 Points

Nice to see heresy thousand sons, tho list list does look more like a 30k list (minus the cool FW tanks )

- hellbrutes have been corrected in an errata to be 100 points base.

To be a 'thousand sons detachment' you need the Mark of tzeentch on every unit. Now I admit in your list that's not great, but there are some benefits for doing so, which is that blessings give you a bonus 1 to your invulnerable and the veterans of the long war upgrade is free. You also gain access to some very good artefacts.

- you should absolutely mark the terminators as a 4++ is much more durable.

- with a sorcerer of tzeentch rubric marines are troops.

- no mastery levels on the sorceror? Or spell familiar? It feels like you aren't trying to be psychic dominant, which is the one thing Tsons are good at.

- there are a lot of upgrades on units that aren't really worth the points. It's a good idea to include as few upgrades as possible so you can fit more units in.

Footslogging isn't generally a good idea. But the thousand sons have an item called the astral grimoire which allows infantry to move like jump infantry which you should absolutely take.

darkstar6783 wrote:
The force I put together was designed to challenge Space Marine Armies specifically. I do not know how it would do against any other Army in the War Hammer 40'000 Universe.

Not great, even against marines.

darkstar6783 wrote:

HQ -

Sorcerer - Sigil Of Corruption, Mark Of Tzeentch, Plasma Pistol & Veterans Of The Long War - 120 Points (1 Model)

I'm not sure even where to begin here. The SIgil is good, MoT is theme, plasma pistol is terrible (you've only got 2 wounds and you're almost certainly going to lose 1 to perils in addition to being 15 points for maybe 1-2 plasma shots a game) and VotLW is bad when you're paying points for it, especially since you're already LD10.

darkstar6783 wrote:

Elites -

Chaos Terminators - Add Two Chaos Terminators, x 5 Chain Fists, Reaper Autocannon & Veterans Of The Long War - 257 Points (Five Models)

Helbrute - Multi-Melta, Power Fist, Combi-Bolter - 105 Points (1 Model)

Termies aren't great normally but are passable as meltacide. 5 guys for >250 points? No. Back to the drawing board. Do they really all need chainfists? The reaper AC is terrible and if you're running these guys as TS, why don't they have MoT? If you really want to spend 250 points on 5 termies, at least get some scarab occult and get some mastery levels in there (to be clear, Scarabs are still terrible, just less terrible than 250+ points for 5x normal termies)

The helbrute is the only thing with armour and that means it's going to be exploded first turn. As mentioned in the previous post, they're only 100 points (still pretty bad).

darkstar6783 wrote:

Rubric Marines - Add Five Rubric Marines, x 4 Warp Flamers, Soul Reaper Cannon, Warp Flame Pistol & Melta Bombs - 328 Points (Ten Models)

Troops -

Chaos Space Marines - Add Five Chaos Space Marines, Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Plasma Gun, Heavy Bolter, x 9 Close Combat Weapons & Veterans Of The Long War - 233 Points (Ten Models)

Chaos Space Marines - Add Five Chaos Space Marines, Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, Plasma Gun, Heavy Bolter, x 9 Close Combat Weapons & Veterans Of The Long War - 233 Points (Ten Models)

Again, as mentiond before, Rubricae are troops with MoT sorcs (or Ahriman) or in a Thousand Sons detatchment. 4x warp flamers are terrible as is the pistol and the lack of a rhino is bordering on criminal for such a slow expensive unit. These guys are going to be thoroughly underwhelming, don't expect them to achieve much, but they're the main flavour of your list.

The marines also have a pretty bad loadout. You don't need the fist and again, plasma pistols are bad, especially on 1 wound models who cost 63! points and not only don't have an invulnerable save, but also strike last and MUST challenge. Plasma gun is fine, heavy bolter is not and I'd also question the point of the extra CC weapons when you can't charge due to the plasma being rapidfire and the heavy bolter being heavy. VotLW again is bad unless you're not paying for it.

darkstar6783 wrote:

Heavy Support -

Havocs - Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, x 4 Plasma Guns, x 4 Close Combat Weapons & Veterans Of The Long War - 190 Points (Five Models)

Havocs - Power Fist, Plasma Pistol, x 4 Plasma Guns, x 4 Close Combat Weapons & Veterans Of The Long War - 190 Points (Five Models)

Havocs - Power Fist, Combi-Plasma, x 4 Plasma Guns, x 4 Close Combat Weapons & Veterans Of The Long War - 185 Points (Five Models)

You can't charge with rapidfire weapons, so the fists and CCW's are a bad idea, not to mention that the plasma pistols are always a bad plan, nor that you're outside a transport and needing to get within rapidfire range to really do any damage. VotLW is still bad when you have to pay points for it.

You've also got 1 multimelta that will be lucky to fire once beore it's destroyed and then the only anti tank you have is 5 chainfists and a melta bomb and relying on punching vehicles to death is generally a terrible plan.

165 - Sorc, MoT, ML3, Sigil, Familiar -> This should be your baseline HQ with plenty of options for flavour (like trading the sigil for terminator armour, adding the Grimoure, taking an Exalted Sorcer instead with ML3 and Familar)
282 - 9x Rubricae, Melta Bombs, Rhino -> Add a 10th guy with a cannon if you don't intend on putting your HQ here
205 - 10x CSM, 2x Plasma, Rhino -> Add 20 points for mark of Tzeentch if you're taking a Thousand Sons detatchment, otherwise, don't bother since a 6++ isn't going to save anyone.
139 - 3x Terminators, 3x Combi-meltas, 2x power axes, 1x chainfist (not on the champ though), MoT -> They drop in and pop a tank and then they must be dealt with or they can just go around terrorising tanks and bullying squads. Add more combi/axe chumps depending on how bad your rolling to hit is (mine's pretty bad)
170 - 5x Havoks, 4x Plasma, Rhino -> Drive them up, disembark them into rapidfire and then hope they get another round of shooting. Can take the same unit 20 points cheaper with meltas instead of plasma if you need more anti tank.
115 - 5x Havoks, 4x Autocannons -> Park them in a ruin and target light vehicles like rhinos

That's not a list to run, that's just some suggested unit builds.

Thank You for Your help Drasius! I will try using some of the unit builds that You have suggested. I was thinking at 1,850 I was probably going to be facing a Land Raider & that was why I went crazy with the Chain Fists. I had thought that spamming Plasma Guns was the only way I could go about defeating Wolf Guard Terminators, Grey Hunters & Blood Claws.

I was not thinking when I constructed My Thousand Sons Rubric Marine model kit. I followed the example on the front of the box and put four Warp Flamers in the hands of the Rubric Marines. Then there was the Warp Flame Pistol. I have at least four spare Bolt Gun Model Bits & a Bolt Pistol so I can remove all the Warp Flame Weapons & get them back to being AP3 Bolt Gun Rubric Marines.

I have plenty of Rhino Tanks so I believe I definitely should be putting Squads of slow or units that need to be close up to be effective into APC's to get the two shots per model.

I'll will for certain drop the Helbrute & use those points to get enough Rhino Tanks to move My models to the front.

I will not be playing in Tournaments/Competitive Games. My Friend who plays Space Wolves is the only guy left from My ancient gaming group who will still have a game of 7th Edition War Hammer 40'000. Everyone else is playing Infinity or Magic The Gathering.