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As the title says. What are your thoughts?

Yes, eventually.

Hmmm, probably the driving force behind that will be what the future product range will be. GW will want to promote their new models so they can pay for the outlay on tooling costs. However, they'll have to balance that against the reduction in sales of their standard Marine line which is a much larger chunk of their profits.

The answer, sadly, is 'probably over time', which is a bugger as the new fluff really isn't up to snuff, but they'll want to do it gradually enough that they can phase out the Marine line as their product cycle ends. Judging by the current age of some of the Empire kits that'll likely be quite a while.

That's if they do actually decide to which isn't a certainty. There's not actually much reason they can't run the two product lines together if they remain profitable, which would necessitate the two to interact and coexist in the fluff. However, if you're a product planner at GW and you're given the option of paying £1m for one casting machine, or £2m for two casting machines which are aimed at the same target market you're probably going to be leaning towards the one provided it's a successful range..

t think there is much thought needed for this. GW has Truescale marines now, so they will release all cool new stuff for them. Older marines will be gone eventually. GW can make more money with cooler marines. Simple.

Take AOS. The Empire pretty much fizzled out. Can still play them and they have stats, but they wont be getting new stuff. Its all Stormcast. the newer "human" faction

str00dles1 wrote:
t think there is much thought needed for this. GW has Truescale marines now, so they will release all cool new stuff for them. Older marines will be gone eventually. GW can make more money with cooler marines. Simple.

Take AOS. The Empire pretty much fizzled out. Can still play them and they have stats, but they wont be getting new stuff. Its all Stormcast. the newer "human" faction

Which makes me very sad as the Stormcast range has very limited utility for 40k conversions compared to Empire stuff, so will sell a lot less to people like me.

TBH it'd be just like any replacement of a model range, like the new DEldar models replacing the older hair-metal ones, except they've given it some ropey new fluff to go with it which makes it feel incompatible. I'm not overly sure why they didn't just say 'Marines should have been this size to begin with. We'll eventually get round to replacing all Marines with these, but for now here's a start'.

People would have been happier with that I feel, and they'd still have kept sales of the older kits if they'd kept stuff like arms, heads and shoulderpads compatible as people would buy the kits for the wargear to use with their new Truescale bodies. People didn't stop buying metal Aspect Warriors when plastic Dire Avengers came out.

Zero chance. You might eventually see new tactical/assault/Devastator/veteran marines that are taller, but that's about it.

Not much chance that's happening any time soon through, the core kits are fairly fresh. Even fresher if you take the intended to be fully 40k compatible Mark 3 and 4 armour into account.

So we have the basic troop (Intercessors in 40k, Liberators in AoS), the shooty unit (Hellblasters in 40k, Judicators in AoS), the flying unit (Inceptors in 40k, Prosecutors in AoS). So should we expect a heavy hitting melee unit that's the analogue to the Retributors?

 frozenwastes wrote:
So we have the basic troop (Intercessors in 40k, Liberators in AoS), the shooty unit (Hellblasters in 40k, Judicators in AoS), the flying unit (Inceptors in 40k, Prosecutors in AoS). So should we expect a heavy hitting melee unit that's the analogue to the Retributors?

"Should I expect a fancy signiature melee unit in a non-tau 40k army"

changemod wrote:

 frozenwastes wrote:
So we have the basic troop (Intercessors in 40k, Liberators in AoS), the shooty unit (Hellblasters in 40k, Judicators in AoS), the flying unit (Inceptors in 40k, Prosecutors in AoS). So should we expect a heavy hitting melee unit that's the analogue to the Retributors?

"Should I expect a fancy signiature melee unit in a non-tau 40k army"

For Marines? Yes, I'd almost bet on it.

I think the Primaris marines will take the helm in the story going forward yes, they are the spearhead of the Indomitus Crusade and are bound to feature heavily.

However, I don't think they will ever say 'and all the marines are now Primaris, the end' as GW typically don't deal in absolutes. More than likely there will always be story titbits about Marines who won't accept the upgrades or who are cut off from the greater Imperium so that people are not forced to use Primaris if they don't want to.

Personally, i really like that they made Primaris separate from the normal marines as it keeps them from retconning/ meddling with the great 30k and 40k fluff to try to shoehorn the new marines into there like they did with Centurions and grav weapons. It also gives narrative games set the '41k', ie post gathering storm, a different flavour and a different style of armies than those set in the 40th millennium.

changemod wrote:

 frozenwastes wrote:
So we have the basic troop (Intercessors in 40k, Liberators in AoS), the shooty unit (Hellblasters in 40k, Judicators in AoS), the flying unit (Inceptors in 40k, Prosecutors in AoS). So should we expect a heavy hitting melee unit that's the analogue to the Retributors?

"Should I expect a fancy signiature melee unit in a non-tau 40k army"

Lol. Good point

It does look though like Primaris releases are a lot more like AoS Stormcast releases than marine releases. Units with uniform weapons, 5 model units.

I would love a group of 5 Primaris with thunderhammers in two hands and some sort of shoulder mounted ranged weapon.

 frozenwastes wrote:

changemod wrote:

 frozenwastes wrote:
So we have the basic troop (Intercessors in 40k, Liberators in AoS), the shooty unit (Hellblasters in 40k, Judicators in AoS), the flying unit (Inceptors in 40k, Prosecutors in AoS). So should we expect a heavy hitting melee unit that's the analogue to the Retributors?

"Should I expect a fancy signiature melee unit in a non-tau 40k army"

Lol. Good point

It does look though like Primaris releases are a lot more like AoS Stormcast releases than marine releases. Units with uniform weapons, 5 model units.

I would love a group of 5 Primaris with thunderhammers in two hands and some sort of shoulder mounted ranged weapon.

I'd love for 40k to not be going down the quasi AoS route it is, but that's another thread.

If it truly is all about money, I think they are being short sighted with how many people have invested thousands into regular Marines over the years

Absolutely, but over time. This won't happen in six months (or at least I doubt it will). But in 5-10 years time there will be no standard marines for sale by GW. I'd bet money on it.

Primaris Marines as the "new product to sell" surely takes center stage at new fluff...

So maybe the "old marines" aren't deleted from records, just don't get attention when something is written because the name-dropping is pretty common in GW text. ( hope i got that right...if not sorry ).

We have seen publications in the past from GW which put the spotlight on new stuff and kept the already available at the backseat of the story.
NuMarines or Adaptus Restartes or Primaris Space Marines , they get to be the primadonna. IMO.



The question is if new Marines as a line of product are going to be as compatible as the current space marines are? ( color doesn't matter that much, loyalist or traitor makes little difference, many parts are exchangable ).

The interchangeability of parts has me slightly concerned. Recent kits for AoS seem to have taken the idea of monopose plastics to heart, with arms and torsos and legs that only really fit in one combination.

I really hope they don't go this direction of travel with Numarines as they're cutting out their compatibility with existing model ranges for kitbashing.

Here's a related question. When people don't like the idea of Marines being 'phased out', what is it precisely that people don't want replaced?

Is it the Astartes model range?
Is it the Astartes fluff?

I certainly hope not

I hope not, I am fine with them being added as another part of the space marine army, not just a simple replacement. Though I do think we might see space marine scouts replaced with regular marines. Which I don't see many people caring about as most scouts aren't used that often anyway (I have two squads and I've never seen the point in putting them into space marine armies as they die so easily and are just generally worse).

It could be possible they will be the new form of marines in training.

they might just lose the "primaris" part in their name over the years ; )

Points costs too...

If you seen primus costs some ain't cheap.
16 models could add up to 5-600 points on there own.

Now things is, marines are somewhat cheaper, sell more.
Yes they are shiny n new. N cool but at end of day people might need a smaller army to make up good point total, not want that GW wise alone. Less money then.

Quite likely - they want people to buy new models after all- reselling your most popular line is one way to do it.

The bigger question is - would anybody in this thread ever stop an opponent from claiming their different shade of whatever colour their basic marines are as Primaris Marines?

There's a player who comes to our open tournaments and most of his Flyrant swarm is made of toys that he picked up at a cheap shop and made into Flyrants himself, even in bigger tournaments more people are interested in hearing about how he made them than trying to WAAC their way past him.

Here's to hoping not. I just got into this game and don't need to spend more money on new marines now that I finally have my army assembled.

We'll see them phased out over the next few years or so. Like Sigmarites, GW will slowly introduce more and more variants, new vehicles, and new characters to match. Fluff wise, it's make sense, every chapter takes losses and those losses need to be replaced. Each chapter can still make the older marines, or the newer and better ones. As I understand it, the new marines can be made faster, with a higher success rate, and with a wider portion of the base population, so why use the older methods?

The older marines will probably still be supported, rules wise, but I imagine they will go the way of the Brettonian army.

The primaris are little more than a genius way to resell the entire marine range, again, to every marine player.

Which isn't to say they're not worth the money. It's nice that GW has given us a fluffy backing for the swap (as opposed to those of us who remember every other marine line relaunch). This is how you actually resell a line in a setting where the players care deeply about the fluff.

 Kojiro wrote:
The primaris are little more than a genius way to resell the entire marine range, again, to every marine player.

Which isn't to say they're not worth the money. It's nice that GW has given us a fluffy backing for the swap (as opposed to those of us who remember every other marine line relaunch). This is how you actually resell a line in a setting where the players care deeply about the fluff.

I also care about my monetary investment

I hope not. I fear for the likes of Dante, Ragnar, Cato etc

Why create any regular Astartes, regardless of how good they have proven to be, when you can have super duper one that's even better straight off the production lines. .

I care deeply about the fluff, and I am disgusted. In fact, I care only for the fluff. GW rules have never been that great, but I have played this game for 26 years...BECAUSE of the fluff.

I have 6,500 points of Ultramarines. I have 3,500 point of Eldar (with the original lead Aspect Warriors). I have 2,000 points of every other army except Genestealer Cults. Yes, even 2,000 point of metal Sisters.

I will be looking to sell my entire collection, BECAUSE of the joke that GW just made of the fluff...all for the almighty dollar/pound...

It's sad. I've read all the books. Played all of the games. I even bought the horrible movie.

Now? I'm done. It's not an "End Times"...it's even worse...it's a "HEY! Here's nothing but an excuse to sell you more of the same stuff, only different! Don't worry, it will all make sense! Check out these new rules! They only miss on a 2! RIGHT?"

Don't lie to yourselves. It's Age of Crapmar for 40K...only they didn't blow up the setting...they just raped it...

 lord marcus wrote:
I also care about my monetary investment

Oh for sure. Look at my sig. My army dates back to the late 80s and I'm not adding anything to it.

As long as the primaris don't, by a sort of osmosis, exterminate the old marines I don't much care how shiny the new stuff is.

really I just hope the retcon it to better fluff for primaris. I do not think they will phase out the regular marines over time though as that would make a lot or people angry and they would leave for another system or find a new hobby. I would however see a point where primaris is no longer any different and they are all just marines using the new profiles and the new kits are primaris scale. older models are just short space marines with the new profile, and the new primaris equipment are just upgrade options and/ or different unit types.

Maybe the best thing to do going forwards is to just take the Primaris rules, stats and minis and have them be counts-as regular Marines in terms of fluff.