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Made in gb
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon






How do?

Many many moons ago, when I was young and you were younger, we all played 2nd Edition 40k. See Young Ones, there was pretty much bugger all else to play.

As fond as my memories were, the game was completely hatstand. You think 40k has balance issues now! Oh bless your cotton socks, you’ve no idea in that youthful mind of yours

Up to a certain point, specific armies could be utterly undone before the first turn started proper. Yep, I’m talking Virus Bomb. This was a card you played at the start of the battle. If you were in Power Armour, it did basically nothing at all to you. If not? Well. Might as well redeploy because it’s Next Game O’Clock! A card so notoriously crap and unbalanced, Andy Chambers apologised via White Dwarf and asked everyone to cut their copy up.

2nd Edition, where I typically spent more time working out what my various grenades did between turns that actually taking my turn (I’ll never forget a Master Librarian legging it away from a particularly dogged Vortex template in a near Benny Hill style). If you’d lobbed the unholy four (smoke, blind, plasma and Vortex) you had to make a roll for each grenade (not type mind you) to see what happened. And entire squads could throw them back then. Happy, but very, very silly days.

Another example? Hey kid? Ever seen 16 War Walkers taken out by a single Bolt Pistol? I have. Whole mob of them coming down one flank. They’d just cleared a bottleneck of terrain, so were inevitably bunched up tight. Single Blood Claw takes a crack, and kills a pilot (to be fair, they had a 2+ invulnerable save. They whiffed it). That sent the bipedal menace spiralling...right into two more. Collision damage took them out, and the rest fell like dominoes. Utterly cool, but also very, very silly.

One last example before I open the floor to others you ask! Well. I shall indulge you. Back then, any character could have Combat Drugs. Whilst not without risk, they turned your chosen benefactor into a raving psycho loony. Pop them on a Chief Librarian, and cast some choice powers? All but unstoppable. To the point they were also unfunny to face down. Which is why I regularly made judicious use of Vortex Grenades. Expensive, yes. But a ‘nope hole’ when you needed was worth the points!

Ok. Enough from me for now. What’re your memories of those crazy, hatstand halcyon days?

   
Made in us
Wicked Warp Spider





Golly, I started in 3rd and I only had chance to have a look at the 2nd edition weapons book, but I am so curious to hear more!
Thanks Doc!

Generic characters disappearing? Elite units of your army losing options and customizations? No longer finding that motivation to convert?
Your army could suffer Post-Chapterhouse Stress Disorder (PCSD)! If you think that your army is suffering one or more of the aforementioned symptoms, call us at 789-666-1982 for a quick diagnosis! 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Springfield, VA

Oh man. Don't get me started on the fuss placing the Immolator flametank's templates.

On the plus side, then end looked like boobies, and I was like 11 at the time.
   
Made in gb
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon






But you shall go into exacting detail of such template placement.

Also.....boobies....fnarr.

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Our group almost never used grenades (Mostly I think, because we forgot we had them)

Most of our battles were pretty standard, we ignored the silliness and played RAI

I don't think we ever used combat drugs and used a vortex grenade maybe once.

We're gonna need another Timmy!

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Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh




I always liked how long it took to deal with a unit shooting at a vehicle.

1) Everyone shoots. Take each hit individually through;
2) Now let's see where the hits hit the vehicle.
3) Now let's see what type of weapon was used.
4)Check that against the armor of the vehicle.
5) Now roll to see what type/how much of damage you did.

I honestly can't remember if vehicles got a saving throw or not but I tend to think that they did.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 15:48:12


 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Springfield, VA

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
But you shall go into exacting detail of such template placement.

Also.....boobies....fnarr.


Okay so if I recall correctly...

... you had to place the template so that the edges were touching (think of two cones [the flamer templates] sharing the same vertex). They could nether be split apart nor overlap. But, of course, you wanted to cover as many models in the target unit as you could with each template - and at the time, the printout/copied templates caused all kinds of issues, between warping, resizing for printers, etc. AND GOOD LUCK IF YOU DIDN'T HAVE TWO TEMPLATES YOU NINCOMPOOP.

There was even a diagram in the 2nd edition SOB codex (were Canonesses were WS7 and T5) that I still remember vaguely.
   
Made in us
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade





cedar rapids, iowa

Can someone explain vehicle movement? Because looking at the 2nd ed sisters codex it looks hilariously over complicated compared to 8th.

 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





I remember there was a turning template (GW loved their templates) and IIRC if your turn stayed under the template, movement was normal, if you turned more than, up to 90 deg your movement was halved or something like that.

We're gonna need another Timmy!

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut







I sadly missed out but was able to have a look at some of the rules.

2nd ed had a LOT of markers. Plasma that had not dissapated, blind grenades, Destructor templates (unlike 3rd-7th where Destructor was a Heavy Flamer, it was a slow-moving "wave" that traveled in a straight line across several turns), Buzzer Squigs, Blight Grenades, oh my!

Orks had a Psychic Power called Kop Dis, which could pushed a model d6+1" inches away from the Weirdboy. However, it also had the addendum "Kop Dis can also be used on area templates such as Vortex, Hellfire and Plasma bursts. If an Area effect template is moved, it will score a hit on anything it moves over."

So Orks could bring a few Plasma Cannons, have their blasts stay in place for a turn, and have Weirdboyz move the resulting bursts forward in a Kamehamewaaaagh!
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





I was wrong about vehicle movement (go figure, it was over 20 years ago LOL)

While people say it was complicated, it really wasn't.
Normal vehicles could not move and fire all weapons, move 6" and fire 1 or move 12" and fire none. Could turn as much as they wanted.

Lumbering vehicles could only move 6" in a straight line, but could fire all their weapons

Fast vehicle could move 6" and fire all weapons, 12" and fire 1 or 24" and fire none

walkers could move 6" and fire 2 weapons or stay stationary and fire all


We're gonna need another Timmy!

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Made in gb
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 sfshilo wrote:
Can someone explain vehicle movement? Because looking at the 2nd ed sisters codex it looks hilariously over complicated compared to 8th.


I honestly don’t think anyone can.

You had three speeds. Slow, Combat and Fast. And yet another template.

Beyond that, no idea!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
There was also daft little know rules. Like for ever put 12or 24 inch over the first, you knocked one off your penetration roll.

Who the hell knew that at the time?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 16:35:46


   
Made in us
Morphing Obliterator





I played three different armies in 2nd edition (I'm down to Chaos, my original, my only from now on though).

Dark Angels - Ravenwing bikers supported by Predators. Back then Ravenwing jink provided -1 to hit, movement provided penalties to hit based on how far you moved, cover provided penalties to hit as well. My attack bikes with Multi-Meltas would run up at max speed behind cover and be -5 to hit for my opponents. So glad you mentioned the grenades, I had totally forgotten the Blind grenade phase, it was critical to my DA predators, because you'd launch them out after firing to limit the return fire your tanks took, but they wandered, and honestly after about 3 tanks fire off Blind, it became it's own phase. Of course, you also had the two techmarines on bikes with Vortex grenades and Bionic Arms (+1 to hit with grenades) because Chaos Lords didn't die without Vortex in 2nd edition (more on that later).

Chaos Space Marines - Chaos Lord in Terminator Armour (which was a 2d6 save back then), Mark of Khorne and Tzeentch with a Displacer Field, Favor of Khorne (re-roll armor saves), Lightning Claw (S8, D3 damage, -5 save back then), and Combi-Flamer (lighting things on fire was important, because Eldar), Combat Drugs, usually tried for Teleport and the Quickening optimally, with Bolt of Change from Tzeentch (2d6 over T dead regardless of wounds), only Vortex killed him (except once, freakishly he died to a Shuriken Cannon). Sorcerer Terminator Lord, Inferno Bolts, Power Field, Warp Jump Generator, Daemon Weapon, Inferno Bolts back then bypassed armor and vehicle crew could be killed by it, so he'd teleport around, killing all the crew inside vehicles and leaving them derelict on the field, he'd usually go for Iron Arm to double his S/T, make him really hard to kill. Basically these two would run around the field and destroy everything. Oh Daemonic Possession on vehicles was insane back then, the Daemonically Possessed Rhino could only be killed on a penetrating hit of a 6 and you could put as many combi-bolters on it as you cared to model.

Orks - Pulsa Rokkits. Looted Hellhounds. Nobz in Powered Armour. This was easily the most broken army I played in 2nd edition, bar none. Knock opponents down with Pulsa Rokkits (literally rob them of a movement phase, auto-leg hits on walkers), light them on fire with flamers, shoot them with Nobz, thanks for playing.

Note: Flamer rules, if you got wounded by a Flamer, you were set on fire, being on fire meant you moved randomly until the flames went out (unless you had Frenzon) and did nothing else. Flames went out on a 1, on a 2-6 you rolled to wound them again and they ran around like idiots. Only Terminator armor allowed you to ignore this.

"In relating the circumstances which have led to my confinement in this refuge for the demented, I am aware that my present position will create a natural doubt of the authenticity of my narrative."  
   
Made in gb
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon






Oh gods I’d forgotten Setting Things On Fire.

The only downside to an IG opponent failing to kill stuff with a flame weapon was having to work out where all the by then burning dudes went. Random direction, random distance for all of them.

And when you’d torched yet failed to kill 10Guardsmen, life got dull!

Much as I loved that mechanic....just, no need for that level of detail. Just gimme a damage re-roll or leadership knacking debuff. Same effect more or less. Much less faffage!

   
Made in us
Morphing Obliterator





 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh gods I’d forgotten Setting Things On Fire.

The only downside to an IG opponent failing to kill stuff with a flame weapon was having to work out where all the by then burning dudes went. Random direction, random distance for all of them.

And when you’d torched yet failed to kill 10Guardsmen, life got dull!

Much as I loved that mechanic....just, no need for that level of detail. Just gimme a damage re-roll or leadership knacking debuff. Same effect more or less. Much less faffage!


Agreed.

At the same time, few gaming experiences have ever lived up to the unadulterated joy of watching a Swooping Hawk Exarch run around on fire for an entire game. Mostly it was about setting skinnies on fire and watching them run around like idiots.

"In relating the circumstances which have led to my confinement in this refuge for the demented, I am aware that my present position will create a natural doubt of the authenticity of my narrative."  
   
Made in gb
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon






As for Pulsa Rokkits....

If memory serves, aiming and firing one was in the region of ‘roughly that way, hope for best’.

90% of the time Orky support weapons did naff all. But when they did what it said on the tin? Gods help your opponent!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 TwinPoleTheory wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh gods I’d forgotten Setting Things On Fire.

The only downside to an IG opponent failing to kill stuff with a flame weapon was having to work out where all the by then burning dudes went. Random direction, random distance for all of them.

And when you’d torched yet failed to kill 10Guardsmen, life got dull!

Much as I loved that mechanic....just, no need for that level of detail. Just gimme a damage re-roll or leadership knacking debuff. Same effect more or less. Much less faffage!


Agreed.

At the same time, few gaming experiences have ever lived up to the unadulterated joy of watching a Swooping Hawk Exarch run around on fire for an entire game. Mostly it was about setting skinnies on fire and watching them run around like idiots.


There was that, true. Definite abject joy inwatching anything even slightly hard flail about whilst on fire

Cheekiest thing I ever pulled off? Master of the Ravenwing in a Landspeeder. He was the pilot, pilot fired the Assault Cannon. Load that bad boy you with Armour Piercing Ammo, and watch *anything* evaporate in a deluge of ungodly firepower.

Could even fire the Assault Cannon once the Land Speeder had been shot down and stacked it.... caught more than a few foes out with that!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 17:06:29


   
Made in us
Morphing Obliterator





God I can't believe how good my memory of this is, Pulsa Rokkits had a variable fuse. You chose a number of d6s to get range, up to 12d6, the Rokkits themselves had a 2d6 inch blast radius. Typically, you were around 24-36 inches from your opponent and you didn't have to get that close, generally 7-10d6 range got you close enough that the 2d6 inch radius handled the rest. They were deadly reliable once you knew the numbers to use with them.

All infantry were knocked down and lost their movement phase the next round.
All vehicles took automatic leg/track hits.
If you rolled doubles on the radius the Rokkit pulsed again in the next turn.

They were absurdly broken.

"In relating the circumstances which have led to my confinement in this refuge for the demented, I am aware that my present position will create a natural doubt of the authenticity of my narrative."  
   
Made in be
Fresh-Faced New User





Is it true that the Fight fase in the LotR SBG was based on 2nd edition 40K?

"Honour, Compassion and Self-sacrifice" 
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Not really.

2nd ed. was great, but more breakable than almost any edition. This was of little concern being in high school as none of our budgets would afford 20+ Wolf Guard terminators with assault cannons, etc.

I still play a modified version of 2nd, and it's excellent. We skip the majority of time-consuming stuff, but if you want an exceptionally narrative detailed Hollywood movie of a game? 2nd is right up your ally.

Also, believe it or not - despite all of the crazy rules it was much easier to play then today's game (simply because everyone abided by the same rules - most armies used similar weapons, and far fewer units had special rules of their own).

The biggest issues which sucked? A lengthy Psyker phase (something we've fixed), and close combat was very dynamic but uselessly complex for large units and became a nightmare - never intended really for th scale the game was growing to, even in 2nd ed..

If anyone is interested here is my blog for 2nd ed. --- lots of resources available:

http://projectanvil.blogspot.com/

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 17:37:53


 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

Huzzah



Also parries, fumbles and crit hits. I literally re-weaponed my blood claws with all power/chain swords just for parries.

Also voltage fields on Nid creatures. Would short out any other inv save on a 4+. Lethal as hell.
Oh and Nids having 3 classes of creatures for shooting at, monsterous, normal and small.


Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





2nd ed wasn't that bad if you left out grenade effects that stay. We still play 2nd ed and with that + sensible players it's still best 40k edition so far.

Sure it's not suitable rulewise for big battles but then again with rules allowing that ala current our 6'x4' board is way too small for big battles to make sense so that was less of an issue than one would think.

It was also edition that while characters were super killy yes they still could be controlled...Unless opponent was idiot or tried risking best they could really kill was 1-2 models a turn so any character without grunts to provide numbers struggled to kill more than 5 models in a game.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in gb
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend





TL; DR

But you are forgetting a classic. Playing as Orks and having someone drop the virus bomb!

If that thing existed today conscript spam would be laughable in its scale of mediocrity!

Dammit - virus bomb was the first one you mentioned, doh!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 18:18:31


Please note, for those of you who play Chaos Daemons as a faction the term "Daemon" is potentially offensive. Instead, please play codex "Chaos: Mortally Challenged". Thank you. 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

Dont forget Librarians in termy armor with Iron arm, Quickening and Teleportation cast on them.
M4d6 Str10 T10 I10 8 attacks with a 3+ on 2d6 backed up by a 4+ inv. Throw in a sword for a parry and bye bye pretty much anything outside of a greater daemon/avatar in the game (Yes Avatars were actually amazing beatsticks back then!).


Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





 Ratius wrote:
Dont forget Librarians in termy armor with Iron arm, Quickening and Teleportation cast on them.
M4d6 Str10 T10 I10 8 attacks with a 3+ on 2d6 backed up by a 4+ inv. Throw in a sword for a parry and bye bye pretty much anything outside of a greater daemon/avatar in the game (Yes Avatars were actually amazing beatsticks back then!).



Then opponent feeds him squad of orks or grots one at a time. Have fun smashing grunts one guy at a time

We stopped using expensive characters when we realized if enemy lacked expensive characters they struggled to make an impact. S10 A10(btw attacks after ~5 was more of disadvantage) WS10 isn't as hot when you still can't kill anything but what's on b2b and opponent obviously doesn't ram as much stuff into b2b as possible unless he feels he benefits from that(so either he's making misjudgement or by definition you don't WANT him to come in such numbers).

Worse than that was flying eldar exarch with missile launcher. Guns were bigger threat than sword.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 18:38:52


2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Being unable to charge said greater daemon because it caused terror and you just couldn't pass your psychology test LOL

We're gonna need another Timmy!

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Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
How do?

Many many moons ago, when I was young and you were younger, we all played 2nd Edition 40k. See Young Ones, there was pretty much bugger all else to play.

As fond as my memories were, the game was completely hatstand. You think 40k has balance issues now! Oh bless your cotton socks, you’ve no idea in that youthful mind of yours

Up to a certain point, specific armies could be utterly undone before the first turn started proper. Yep, I’m talking Virus Bomb. This was a card you played at the start of the battle. If you were in Power Armour, it did basically nothing at all to you. If not? Well. Might as well redeploy because it’s Next Game O’Clock! A card so notoriously crap and unbalanced, Andy Chambers apologised via White Dwarf and asked everyone to cut their copy up.

2nd Edition, where I typically spent more time working out what my various grenades did between turns that actually taking my turn (I’ll never forget a Master Librarian legging it away from a particularly dogged Vortex template in a near Benny Hill style). If you’d lobbed the unholy four (smoke, blind, plasma and Vortex) you had to make a roll for each grenade (not type mind you) to see what happened. And entire squads could throw them back then. Happy, but very, very silly days.

Another example? Hey kid? Ever seen 16 War Walkers taken out by a single Bolt Pistol? I have. Whole mob of them coming down one flank. They’d just cleared a bottleneck of terrain, so were inevitably bunched up tight. Single Blood Claw takes a crack, and kills a pilot (to be fair, they had a 2+ invulnerable save. They whiffed it). That sent the bipedal menace spiralling...right into two more. Collision damage took them out, and the rest fell like dominoes. Utterly cool, but also very, very silly.

One last example before I open the floor to others you ask! Well. I shall indulge you. Back then, any character could have Combat Drugs. Whilst not without risk, they turned your chosen benefactor into a raving psycho loony. Pop them on a Chief Librarian, and cast some choice powers? All but unstoppable. To the point they were also unfunny to face down. Which is why I regularly made judicious use of Vortex Grenades. Expensive, yes. But a ‘nope hole’ when you needed was worth the points!

Ok. Enough from me for now. What’re your memories of those crazy, hatstand halcyon days?


2nd threads are just the best threads on this forum. 2nd was by far the best edition conceived by the designers. Just imagine a 40K game without offenders like super-heavy vehicles, flyers and primarchs. Other boons were an interesting psychic phase like the magic phase in WHFB and a Hiding & Overwatch (full BS with some modifiers) mechanic. You basically had in most cases two characters (beatstick & psyker), two to four infantry squads, an APC, Dreadnought and a tank.

Virus Bomb (Virus Outbreak):
Virus Outbreak is a strategy card and the set encompasses 26 cards. Each player draws one card for each 1000 pts.of his army. Most games are played with 1500 pts. So the chance to get this card is quite slim.
Effects: Play this card at any time. Place a 2´´ blast template anywhere on the table and treat it as a Virus grenade template. The template remains in play for the remainder of the game.

Army special rules:
Tyranids: Opponent must remove the Virus Outbreak card from the deck at the start of the game.
Vaxxine Squig (wargear card; Painboys only; limited: 2 per army; 50 pts.): All Ork troops on this side are immune to the effects of any viruses (e.g.: Virus Grenade & Virus Outbreak).

The Virus Grenade is a wargear card (50 pts.) and is limited (2 per army). Only characters can equip wargear cards (e.g.: SM Sgt. 1 card, SM Cpt. 3 cards).
Effect: 2´´ blast radius, immediate. Models affected by the template had to roll, if they were affected.
The following models are immune:
SM, Eldar Aspect Warriors, Dreadnoughts, Terminators and enclosed vehicles.

All others have to roll a 1 or 2 to avoid the effects. Affected models are effectively slain - but are left on the battlefield. Lie affected models on their sides, and roll a D6 - this is the contact range for the virus in inches. Any normally vulnerable model within the contact range of a victim of the virus is slain on D6 roll 4+. Each time a model is slain by the effects of the virus, lay it on it´s side and roll for the contact range again. It is possible that a single model may have to test to see if it is slain several times because it lies within the contact range of more than one victim. Once there are no more victims within the contact range of all slain models, the virus has no further effects.

War Walker incident:
16 War Walkers? This is a lot even for a multi-player game. A War Walker costs 80 pts. without weapons. The usual loadout is lascannonen & scatter laser and then the unit costs a total of 150 pts. Anyway, are you sure there was a Space Wolf to blame? Sounds to me like an Ewok job.

Barbecue:
Roll a D6 for each model surviving a hit; on a 4+, that model catches fire. Models on fire must roll on the following chart at the beginning of each turn:
1-5: Another automatic hit. If the target survives, it will move randomly and is unable to do anything else this turn. Normal coherency rules are suspended for troops on fire.
6: Flames are put out.

Any model within 1´´ may attempt to beat out the flames (instead of shooting); roll aD6 - on 6+, the flames are put out. If more than one model is assigned to beat the flames, the roll is given a bonus of +1 for each additional model. The following models may choose to ignore the flames and continue to fighting as normal:
Vehicles, Dreadnoughts, Terminators, Frenzied troops and Tyranids.

Source: Battle Bible Version 1.5.1


Grenades with long lasting effects:
Yes, they are a pain in the ass. Common sense is required for both players to restrict their use.

   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




2nd ed had too many games that ended before the other player got a turn.
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





 Strg Alt wrote:

2nd threads are just the best threads on this forum. 2nd was by far the best edition conceived by the designers. Just imagine a 40K game without offenders like super-heavy vehicles, flyers and primarchs. Other boons were an interesting psychic phase like the magic phase in WHFB and a Hiding & Overwatch (full BS with some modifiers) mechanic. You basically had in most cases two characters (beatstick & psyker), two to four infantry squads, an APC, Dreadnought and a tank.


Actually 2nd ed had super heavies. Pretty nasty firepower but while tougher than say leman russ still not THAT tough. You could with bit of luck oneshot baneblade with lascannon. Albeit preferably you would want more than one lascannon pointed at it or preferably bit beefier gun.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




"2nd threads are just the best threads on this forum. 2nd was by far the best edition conceived by the designers. Just imagine a 40K game without offenders like super-heavy vehicles, flyers and primarchs. Other boons were an interesting psychic phase like the magic phase in WHFB and a Hiding & Overwatch (full BS with some modifiers) mechanic. You basically had in most cases two characters (beatstick & psyker), two to four infantry squads, an APC, Dreadnought and a tank. "

And it was still a white hot dumpster fire. 3rd ed was MUCH better.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Springfield, VA

2nd Edition had superheavies. I still have Inquisitor 16, with the rules for Baneblades, and the Armourcast Baneblade that went with.

Spoiler:

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/07 18:58:28


 
   
 
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