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Hi guys,

I'm buying a few bits off of my mate, which includes the Chaos sprues from the Dark Vengeance boxed set, which includes chosen.

WYSIWYG considerations aside, what's the best loadout for them?

I was thinking about tooling them up for melee and putting them in a rhino, maybe with a character to buff them. What do you think?

BTW I play Emperor's Children.

Especially with Emperor's Children, I'd be tempted to go for twin lightning claws on all five with an icon of excess.

16 BS3+ S4 AP-2 attacks (3 per model, 4 on the champion), re-rolling wounds? Yes please.
Icon generating Death to the False Emperor attacks on 5+, as well as having a 1CP EC stratagem to generate more each time you kill an enemy? Now you're talking.
EC legion trait letting you attack first each fight phase regardless of whether or not you've charged, interrupting charging enemies for free? Ohhhh mama.

For 150 points total it might be a little steep, but (on paper, at least) the unit would absolutely shred infantry.

Second @Total’s advice

Easily Combi Plasma Guns on everyone outside the Champ, whom I am a fan of giving a Combi Flamer too for more shenanigans.

Thanks guys!

As it happens, Chosen with Combi Plasma are one of my own go-to units. Drop 'em out a Dreadclaw or Kharybdis and my opponents cry. But I play Word Bearers, not EC, and first strikes makes things a little different, there - and you'll probably have Noise Marines or Obliterators that have bagged your Endless Cacophony.

Personally, I am in the camp that Chosen are a totally redundent unit choice. I use my Chosen as Champions in Bezerker, Havoc and CSM squads, or Chaos Lords, Dark Apostles and Exalted CHampions. Basically, anything elite.

But if you're gonna go for Chosen? I think just straight Combi-Bolters are the way to go. They become super well costed for the Dakka they put out. For 18 points you get the same amount of bolter shots you normally get for 26 points out of two Marines.

 vaklor4 wrote:
Personally, I am in the camp that Chosen are a totally redundent unit choice. I use my Chosen as Champions in Bezerker, Havoc and CSM squads, or Chaos Lords, Dark Apostles and Exalted CHampions. Basically, anything elite.

But if you're gonna go for Chosen? I think just straight Combi-Bolters are the way to go. They become super well costed for the Dakka they put out. For 18 points you get the same amount of bolter shots you normally get for 26 points out of two Marines.

What makes you say they are redundant?

I think he means any role you want the squad to fill, others can do better.

Melee chosen? Why not berserkers?

Shooting? Why not Havoks or Noise Marines?

I agree that Combi-Bolters is one of the roles that they can do rather uniquely, but then they still go up against Terminators or Bikers if you broaden the spectrum a bit.

 Krusha wrote:

 vaklor4 wrote:
Personally, I am in the camp that Chosen are a totally redundent unit choice. I use my Chosen as Champions in Bezerker, Havoc and CSM squads, or Chaos Lords, Dark Apostles and Exalted CHampions. Basically, anything elite.

But if you're gonna go for Chosen? I think just straight Combi-Bolters are the way to go. They become super well costed for the Dakka they put out. For 18 points you get the same amount of bolter shots you normally get for 26 points out of two Marines.

What makes you say they are redundant?

They can take a lot of melee options. But no matter what they take, they're outclassed by Khorne Bezerkers in close combat, so why bother with Chosen. Alternatively, Warp Talons can get into CC easier than Chosen, can Deepstrike, have an invuln save, and can ALL take Lightning Claws, argueably the best option in the list for Chosen.

If you want good guns, it's more cost effective to just take Havoc squads, or Obliterators.

Chosen are fine to bring, but they're outclassed by something else in any field they try to come as.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Perth wrote:
I think he means any role you want the squad to fill, others can do better.

Melee chosen? Why not berserkers?

Shooting? Why not Havoks or Noise Marines?

I agree that Combi-Bolters is one of the roles that they can do rather uniquely, but then they still go up against Terminators or Bikers if you broaden the spectrum a bit.

Dang it, stop mind reading me!

In terms of shooting, keep in mind they do get the Special Weapons at a slightly higher rate than Havoks (5 in a squad really does help). 6 dudes with 5 Plasma Guns and a Combi-Plasma is 176 and for 5 Havocs with 4 Plasma Guns and a Combi-Plasma is 132. To get that next Plasma Gun is a minimum of 78 points. That'll add up overtime.

Chosen with plasmas and a combi plasma is the best way to run them in my opinion.
I don' think Combi-plasmas are worth the extra cost, the minus 1 to hit really diminishes the effectiveness of the plasma guns.
This doesnt apply to you as you are playing EC. But I think tjey are more effective as alpha legion as they can use forward operatives to get them into a good position. With endless carcophony they could do some real damage turn one (oblits do this better).

What does your list need and what detachments are you taking? Becuase that will help us get a better idea of how you should kit them out.

 vaklor4 wrote:
They can take a lot of melee options. But no matter what they take, they're outclassed by Khorne Bezerkers in close combat, so why bother with Chosen. Alternatively, Warp Talons can get into CC easier than Chosen, can Deepstrike, have an invuln save, and can ALL take Lightning Claws, argueably the best option in the list for Chosen.

I don’t think EC can take khorne berserkers. Even then, chosen can take power weapons, icon of excess, flawless perfection and excess of violence, which compensates somewhat, right?

I like warp talons (I’ve got ten), but they have less attacks per model and they can’t take an icon of excess.

If you want good guns, it's more cost effective to just take Havoc squads, or Obliterators.

This bit I agree with, though to be fair I think they can take more special weapons in a chosen squad than in a havoc squad.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

fishwaffle2232 wrote:
Chosen with plasmas and a combi plasma is the best way to run them in my opinion.
I don' think Combi-plasmas are worth the extra cost, the minus 1 to hit really diminishes the effectiveness of the plasma guns.
This doesnt apply to you as you are playing EC. But I think tjey are more effective as alpha legion as they can use forward operatives to get them into a good position. With endless carcophony they could do some real damage turn one (oblits do this better).

What does your list need and what detachments are you taking? Becuase that will help us get a better idea of how you should kit them out.

I thought the -1 to hit penalty only applied when firing both parts of the weapon.

In terms of what I’m taking... to be honest, the only reason I’m bothering with chosen is that I have a couple of friends who are getting rid of their old models. I’m getting the contents of the dark vengeance box, a helldrake, some daemonettes, plasma termies and the start collecting box, plus the sonic weapons upgrade sprue.

 Krusha wrote:

 vaklor4 wrote:
They can take a lot of melee options. But no matter what they take, they're outclassed by Khorne Bezerkers in close combat, so why bother with Chosen. Alternatively, Warp Talons can get into CC easier than Chosen, can Deepstrike, have an invuln save, and can ALL take Lightning Claws, argueably the best option in the list for Chosen.

I don’t think EC can take khorne berserkers. Even then, chosen can take power weapons, icon of excess, flawless perfection and excess of violence, which compensates somewhat, right?

I like warp talons (I’ve got ten), but they have less attacks per model and they can’t take an icon of excess.

If you want good guns, it's more cost effective to just take Havoc squads, or Obliterators.

This bit I agree with, though to be fair I think they can take more special weapons in a chosen squad than in a havoc squad.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

fishwaffle2232 wrote:
Chosen with plasmas and a combi plasma is the best way to run them in my opinion.
I don' think Combi-plasmas are worth the extra cost, the minus 1 to hit really diminishes the effectiveness of the plasma guns.
This doesnt apply to you as you are playing EC. But I think tjey are more effective as alpha legion as they can use forward operatives to get them into a good position. With endless carcophony they could do some real damage turn one (oblits do this better).

What does your list need and what detachments are you taking? Becuase that will help us get a better idea of how you should kit them out.

I thought the -1 to hit penalty only applied when firing both parts of the weapon.

In terms of what I’m taking... to be honest, the only reason I’m bothering with chosen is that I have a couple of friends who are getting rid of their old models. I’m getting the contents of the dark vengeance box, a helldrake, some daemonettes, plasma termies and the start collecting box, plus the sonic weapons upgrade sprue.

If you really want to use the models, you can do what I do. Just use them as counts as models for Aspiring Champions, Chaos Lords, Dark Apostles, etc. Basically anything that can take a power weapon and needs to look 'elite'. I've found the Power Mace Chosen to look vastly better than the Dark Apostle's actual sculpt, personally.

To be fair, EC lacking Berzerkers and WTs lacking access to IoE does make LC Chosen an ok option for EC.

It’s Wolf Guard that put them to shame. Entire squad with Combi Plasma, AND Thunder Hammers, AND Jump Packs, AND Storm Shields. Sorry, who said Smurfs are the Mary Sues? :(

"I thought the -1 to hit penalty only applied when firing both parts of the weapon "

That is right, but are the many situations where you would want to use the bolter instead of the plasma? The extra points just don't seem worth it.

I agree with Vaklor4, maybe use them as HQ conversions. Or use the bits to make havocs pr something that you actually need. Chosen are good in the right list. But by the sound of it your trying to put a lost together with what you have been given.
I would suggest making a draft list based on what you are getting and work our what is missing from the list or what could do better.

Feel free to post it. Im happy to help and im sure others will be too.

Four plasma guns firing full power kill 4.44 MEQs
Four plasma guns firing low power kill 2.96 MEQs
Four plasma guns firing low power at -1 to hit kill 2.22 MEQs
Four bolters at -1 to hit kill 0.67 MEQs

The combi-plasma guys firing both barrels are marginally worse without buffs. Probably similar results against other targets and with various buffs - in fact, I suspect that with higher accuracy, the gap will grow wider. Against their natural prey - Terminators and Primaris - they're going to be far worse.

So, if you've built them with combi-plasma (and this applies to Terminators as well), and you absolutely need to wipe out a unit that isn't Gretchin, be disciplined and take the careful aim.

Where they do come into their own is on overwatch. It's 1.33 extra hits. Which isn't terrible on a close ranged firefight unit. Worth 8pts? Maybe, maybe not. Worth throwing on in a Power Level game just in case? Absolutely.