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So i was just playing my first Kill Team game today (orks, 4 burnas a spanner w/ kmb, 3 grots, 3 boyz, and a bossnob w/ pk) and we noticed something that actually completely cripples the orks and several other factions too.

The nerve test punishes numbers.

A nerve test is made when a team is broken or a model has flesh wounds. Roll a D6, and if the result is higher than the model's leadership it is Shaken and cannot do anything (literally) in the next turn.
Add 1 to the result for each friendly model shaken or out of action
Subtract 1 from the result for each other friendly model (other than shaken models) within 2" of the model.

This means that in an Ork team since we do not have access to basic Nobz for...some reason...if you lose 5 boyz you can only pass a Nerve Test if you either are bunched up in a super tight ball (remember, 2" bubble here) or you roll a natural 1.

What the crap? So when i lost a grot, 3 burnaz, and a boy i suddenly could no longer pass Nerve Tests w/o a 1 since all my models are LD6, even though i still had 7 models on the field...a majority of my team!

We went over the rulebook several times and found absolutely nothing outside of Medic (which orks dont have access to) or a CP effect (which orks are starved for since our only defense is CP related). Did we miss something? Because this actually completely and utterly kills this game for me. I cant even attempt to play unless i get lucky and steamroll.
And i thought the 7th edition ork codex was a punch in the gut for orks.... i could still play that one just not easily.

I've yet to play a game but I'm guessing this is intentional to encourage Orcs to act as a mob?

Not sure how limiting that is though it does seem to match the fluff.

If it was a wider bubble like say 6" i could see it being a mechanic to force orks into a bubble, even though blasts arent a thing so not like theres a reason to not do that anyway.

But its a 2" bubble. Accounting for enemy models in the way, assuming none of your models are shaken you can only get at best a +5 and that is a REALLY tight bubble to get that, with 2 models not even in the fight but nearby.

Even worse. Multi shot weapons can hit models within 2" so that's not a great place to hang out anyway.

I mean, yeah, it punishes numbers, though I imagine they had it in mind that more models also leaves more potential for models within 2", but I imagine it was intentional, to prevent people running massive Ork teams like last edition. They're probably hoping people will run more Lootas, Burnas, and Kommandos, instead of Boyz and Gretchin, and of they do run Boyz and Gretchin that they'll run them mobby. Also, keep in mind there's always insane bravery, and rousing transmission if you have a comm specialist.

Are not superior numbers better already? Everyone from 5th edition 40K knows how good it is when you have multiple smaler units shooting at one large units. You max remove the number of units that you yourself have, so having more units is just better. Having a rule that nerfs this sounds good.

Having a rule that keeps it in check is good
Having a rule that flatout kills you if you lost 5-6 models is stupid when you have literally NOTHING to keep you alive other than numbers

Orks are forced to run numbers, unless i run solid burnas/boss nobz i WILL have 10 models or more, and even if i did do that theyre just as easy to kill as a grot oddly enough.

Orks arent the only race that suffers from this but they are the one that suffers the most. Even IG have things to help mitigate this problem, orks have generic CP stuff which we have no way of getting extra of to actually keep us alive/not shaken.

Had they given us Nobz and 'Eavy Armor access, this probably wouldnt be as much of an issue. 8 models with 4+ and next to no shooting is fine, and w/o the Nerve Test rule 12 with a 6+ save is also fine but the Nerve Test kills it.

Your kill team isn’t broken until MORE than half the models are negatively effected, and only broken if you fail the leadership test. So with 12 models you are looking at 7 to be negatively effected (ooa, fw etc). Flesh wounds cause a check, effected by the positive and negative stated, or negated by command if necessary. The overall effect is not as bad as you stated.

Orks have low leadership, numbers do help....but if you stack Gretchin, it will cost you morale wise losing them just as much as your better fighters, lesson is don’t give away easy casualties.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
You could stack 2 or 3 grots behind your best Ork heavy to keep his morale boosted when he’s hurt, a wee green cheerleader team.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Veteran and Comms will also really help negate this whole nerve test effect, plus the leaders insane bravery ability.

You only take Nerve tests if your model has a flesh wound or your team is broken.

If your team isn't broken, then the only models you're taking nerve tests on are those that have taken flesh wounds.

It's not really that bad. Does it punish hordes? Not really. Your enemy has to chew through half your army before you start taking a bunch of tests. If they spread out flesh wounds on all of your models, things can get interesting, but a flesh wounded model isn't a removed model, so you wouldn't take negatives for that.

I played a game today, 8 Kommandos, Nob, Burna and 4 Gretchen.

The Gretchen seem like a liability, far too easy to wound, and in this instance I think Boyz would be better. But hiding a few out of LOS to keep up the casualty pool low seems like it could work on some game boards.

But we also didn't play the game using Stratagems so I didnt use Grot screen stratagem proper, more as a walking obstruction.

 Vineheart01 wrote:

A nerve test is made when a team is broken

This. Are you complaining that if you are broken you have a hard time winning? In some scenarios, you lose the second you become broken! And even when you don't, all teams have a really hard time when they are broken (always testing panic and -1 to hit cripple everyone, not just orks). If you are broken, there's a high chance that you'll lose, I see no problems with that.

Also, if Panic is a problem, create lists that mitigate that. Use Comms specialists, avoid gretchins, etc.

Yea, as fun and fluffy as the Grot Shield tactic is, wounding a single Gretchin is too easy, and you just target the Gretchin first anyway. I'm going to drop my Burna Boy and 4 Gretchen for 4 more basic Boyz instead (or 3 Kommandos, haven't decided).

Finding a way to mitigate it would be nice if we had the option to do it.

The lowest count orks can goto is 6, counting higher level specialist costs. Problem with doing that is then we have even less models with 0 defense to play and thats basically a bossnob, kommando bossnob, and 4 burnas.
This actually makes it HARDER to play because we still just have a 6+ save and a lot of weapons have atleast ap-1 or the rate of fire to not care. Again if we at least had access to 'Eavy Armor this wouldnt be as bad of a problem. All our models die to a stiff breeze and aside from spending multiple CP per model theres nothing we can do about it. Which is normally countered by having more bodies, except in kill team every dead dude is a huge penalty for you beyond just losing the model.

I never used the grot shield. The timing you spend the CP and the cost makes it useless, even though i wish i could because man thats thematic lol. You have to spend the CP before any shots are declared, which unless you only have 1 ork that can get shot at all means "ok...i'll just ignore that ork" and poof there goes 2cp.

Also you make nerve tests with flesh wounds not just if you are broken. Read the whole sentence dont just cut it halfway. No duh if your team is broken you have a harder time playing, but it shouldnt be so harsh that if you break you lose right there unless youre necrons.
I want to keep playing this game, but so far in 10 games every attempt ive done the nerve test completely screwed over the orks. I even said screw it and just went full numbers in a ball and like someone else stated that means i just got splitfired to death.

Ways to mitigate Panic: plan your list accordingly (no gretchins), keep your guys close, use Comms specialist and his tactic, your Veteran should be virtually immune to Panic too. If you're playing a campaign, a lvl 2 Leader also provides immunity within 3".

And even without those things, you are testing only for wounded models, which should be the minority of your forces (as I said, if you're broken, you should lose 90% of the times. And in some missions, you DO lose). Also, this rule affects everyone. Sure, Necrons have Ld10, Harlequins and Deahwatch 8, but everyone else has 6 or 7, so this doesn't hurt Orks more than others. You could say that Orks suffer more from it because they rely on numbers and are easy to kill, but so does Imperial Guard, for example. And you forget that in some missions, a horde has a clear advantage, so I'm fine if they suffer from morale a bit more.

I’m using Leader, Heavy, Comms, Veteran and 5 Kommandos...got a few points spare for level upgrade in the capped campaign. Not having a problem with Nerve tests.

I am using modified points list though....

Boss Kommando with Kombi weapon 16 points.
Heavy Kommando with big shoota 12 points.
Comms, Veteran and 5 vanilla Kommandos with Shootas 9 point each. 89 points.

Between leadership, Comms and veteran the nerves tests are not so bad, and 9 models gives me that 5 model break point.

We put ardcase armour at 3 points, someone else running orks with that in the campaign.

Comms is excellent and fluffy for Kommandos.

I think the rules work well but I think the lists are pretty awful. The points and options make very little sense as written, too much missing, weirdly inconsistent points and some truly useless tactics/skills in some parts.