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Assuming these to be true, Wall Creeper is likely to see a change pretty fast so that it can't be used in the assault phase.
That aside, I recall reading something in a 4chan thread that claimed the 7th ed relics were going to see a return so that could be interesting, especially if they toss in a couple new ones for the new characters as well.
Cephalobeard wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if GW tossed GSC a bone and let them have pseudo-old fly as a WT. They're already going to ignore deep strike changes, likely, as an army wide rule anyway.
At the end of the day a single GSCHQ ignoring enemy models and terrain wouldn't break the game. Strong, but not as strong as two 6s on the table.
The GSC don't ignore the deep strike change (they were called out specifically in the FAQ to have to wait until turn 2 to ambush) and instead are getting something different added into the codex to make up for it(maybe the ability to get a pre-1st turn move or something).
Cephalobeard wrote: Somehow you seem to have missed what I wrote-- I didn't say they do it now, at all.
They did and are likely going to get some form of similar rule or ability. How it works, time will tell.
I was actually thinking about it last night, and Cult Ambush could change into a rule that deploys units like Space Marine Scouts do, which could be awesome as an army gimmick.
Cephalobeard wrote: Yep. Giving them "Infiltrate" as a rule for turn 1 could be super cool, or just straight up allowing Cult Ambush to ignore the rules for reserves, which they could do, so that they could continue to exit/enter past turn 3 as well, etc.
Who knows, I am but a humble dice roller at the mercy of their decisions, but they have tons of options.
Seeing as they didn't even allow Drop Pods, the poster child for ignoring reserve limitations, to come in turn 1, I doubt we're going to be the exception. No, I think the mechanic will be something different that will likely be less reserve based.
Cephalobeard wrote: Well, considering we have CA upcoming and no one are using drop pods, who knows what they'll change in CA. As GSC will be a "post CA" army, they may come with changes already taken into account. Who knows!
While your optimism is refreshing (especially on Dakka where optimism goes to die), I prefer to keep my expectations low as to prevent disappointment.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/29 19:06:28
I'd argue that while combative females might not be quite as common as combative males for the GSC, we have to remember that there would still be working females (too young or old to have kids, infertile, lose the ability due to complications raising an alien-hybrid fetus, early to mid stages of pregnancy, a planet that has a high population of women but low population of men due to the warp, ect, ect, ect). Basically, there isn't a reason not to mix some gals into the mix. Plus I like my cultists crews extra motley whenever possible.
I'm considering getting some Cawdor minis to mix into a couple of squads with some parts swapping to give me even visual variety.
Lorek wrote: I used Orlock gangers as a base for some Chaos cultists, and it worked very nicely. Cawdor is up next for my GSC!
Oh, that sounds nice. I'm definitely considering doing basically a unit of 10 from each gang to go with my regular cultists and my IG cultists. I know I could go with unit markings but I really like the idea of a motley looking mob of different groups (which allows me to tell units apart really easily too), the only concern of course is fitting the less human arms onto some of the models. I'm thinking of basically having my cult basically having infiltrated almost every level of the planet and even involving a Rogue Trader mixed into the group and using the same colors across the clothes as what ties the less uniform model design into each other.
If I can figure out a way to mix Orks in as a GSC unit (I mean they showed up on Necromunda, right?) I'd do it, the question is more how to make it work on the models without spending too much on the old metal ones.
Then again I've always assumed I'm just a little prone to deciding on projects that make my wallet cry.
Dryaktylus wrote: 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation hybrids don't have a sex. Female 4th generation? Maybe, but there's not a snippet of fluff about that.
The problem is that GW made hybrids the bulk of the GSC instead of Brood Brothers. Originally only the first-born was a hybrid, protected by parents and later human siblings.
[Citation needed] on hybrids having no sex since breeding is an important part of the life cycle of the cult and we have no evidence that Genestealers have a means of asexual reproduction like Orks or regular Nids do (and the Nids normally need a Norn Queen to do most of their breeding). Each generation gives birth to the next, and seeing as they retain traits of their parent species, for humans at least, that means some kind of sexual characteristics should still be there, even if they are all bald.
Orkstealer Cults on the otherhand get kind of nuts since they breed via spores which means they can be popping out purestrains in a few months instead of years.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/31 02:57:21
[Citation needed] on hybrids having no sex since breeding is an important part of the life cycle of the cult and we have no evidence that Genestealers have a means of asexual reproduction like Orks or regular Nids do (and the Nids normally need a Norn Queen to do most of their breeding). Each generation gives birth to the next, and seeing as they retain traits of their parent species, for humans at least, that means some kind of sexual characteristics should still be there, even if they are all bald.
Err... no. The first three generations just infect humans, male or female, in the same way as Purestrains. They don't impregnate the victim, they just alter the DNA to make the next child a hybrid. The host species breeds as normal. If you want sources, just start with Paul Murphy and his background for the Stealers.
While original lore is always interesting, since things change (a lot) I'm going to go with the most recent lore presented on this kind of thing which doesn't follow your claims. Just a preference on lore sources I guess.
And quibbles like this remind me how likely it is the Imperium would get into wars over what color the Emperor's tea doillies were.
So I went digging into the 4chan thread the WT dropped from to see if I could find some more goodies and here we go [Some of this will go a bit off topic due to the AMA style of the posts, but I like giving context to everything so I'm throwing it ALL in]:
[Regarding the ability to get more than one warlord trait or warlord] No stratagem for this. There was, however, an idea for a Primus to get a relic allowing for a WL trait (to represent the fact that in the fluff it's described as a warlord), but it was taken out last minute.
[Regarding points costs for Acolytes, Hybrids and Goliaths] Those things are indeed cheaper, combined with a stratagem or two there's much more of an incentive to take Goliaths.
[Regarding if they're the same source as the Stratagem leak]: That's another person on the GSC team I think. Either way the stratagems etc. they linked were accurate.
[Regarding if he changed any rules writer's minds on things]: I'm a new member of the team, brought in after one of the GSC playtesters complained heavily about the previous members of the GSC codex team. I worked with that guy on Tyranids. He must have got rid of the Brood Brothers rule that was making its rounds a while back - I can't see it anywhere in the codex right now.
I did some digging about that last comment, and this was what I could find regarding the removed Brood Brother rule:
Sorry about the poor image quality, I had to upsize a picture that was made for Rippers.
And then some more info from two 40k general threads later:
[Regarding identity (again): So to clarify, I'm not the same person who leaked the Stratagems and the Brood Brother leak (which has since been removed from the codex). I'm working on the same team as that guy. He's really fecking into maths and probability, he's got dozens of charts he uses, it's pretty cool.
I can't answer questions in too much detail. We did use Codex:Orks to playtest against Codex:GSC, so they are likely of a similar power level to one another. The [The post literally stops there]
[Regarding Subfaction Traits]: Yes, but for the most part they're a copy/paste of the generic subfaction traits you see in other codexes (or more specifically for GSC, from the guard and tyranid codex, e.g. jormungandr). We added in a generic <SUBFACTION> keyword, which is a first for 8e (previously indexes without them didn't get subfaction traits). Brood Brothers have their own trait (+1 Ld when within 6" of a friendly GSC CHARACTER).
[Regarding concern over the removal of "Brood Brothers"]: No, as in the awful rule that the previous playtesters implemented [see above picture]. We're not the GK rules team, we are aware of how to make a codex.
[Clarification on the Codex's Brood Brother's rule]: To clarify, the Brood Brothers rule is pretty much a copy+paste job from the index rules.
[Regarding "#ShotsFired" over the GK Team comment]: Eh, playful rivalries exist between codex design teams. The GK team get particular flakk because, well, they wrote the GK book as it is.
[Regarding the Tau Codex Team]: There are 1-2 newer designers on that team who pretty much follow the orders of the guys higher up, for better or worse. For a while they wouldn't do too much without going to ask the higher ups about it.
[Regarding a request to leak points]oints are probably the worst thing for me to leak, so screenshots of the full page at once might be tricky. There have been a large number of points reductions across the board. The head guy for GSC (the one who worked on the initial team, and to my knowledge worked on DE and Nids) put a feckton of maths behind it, and he playtests them outside of work.
[Regarding a comment about the maths guy being the good kind of neckbeard]: He's a really nice guy, just really into maths. It's an ongoing joke between us two that he's the "Anti-Crud". I've heard Cruddace has quite the reputation here? Something about "maths is just an opinion"? Not sure how true that is, but if true they're polar opposites I guess.
[Regarding posting stratagems]: I could post the stratagems, but they've been leaked previously. If you've not seen those it's worth checking them out. I can't drop leaks all at once - you might have noticed that the GSC leaks have been once every 2-3 weeks so far. I might be able to post more as the codex approaches.
[Regarding how he got the job if he isn't into maths]: I'm into maths and spreadsheets, it's just this guy is above and beyond. He taught us how to do the maths, and we basically follow his principles. Because of him our design team is known as the "Mathtropaths"
[Regarding subfaction specific strats]: There are a few subfaction specifics, but we decided it would be best not to reveal the subfaction stratagems (as it would give away subfactions existed, which might be problematic).
[Regarding the type of maths used]: It's more statistical based. Algebra and Calc are part of it of course, but more specifically we use binomial probability a lot.
[Regarding leaks and if its known if the anon is doing it]: The team are generally aware I think. The bosses do sometimes tell us to "leak a little bit", but some leaks we've done (e.g. the stratagem leak) weren't exactly authorised. As such, we didn't post screenshots, and only made it text-based, to add a layer of plausible deniability (i.e. "anyone could make these up and post them".
[Regarding Metamorphs]: Metamorphs are cheaper. Holy feck they were overpriced before. Their weapons all have AP-1 now, or better (for rending claws), and they're cheaper than Genestealers (rightfully). Hand flamers also went down from 8 points, they're about half that price now.
[Regarding a post about the army being the right pick for an anon due to the passionate people working the company]: A lot of GW design staff are actually rooting for GSC, as many have kill teams or small armies. There are a few who don't like them as much (scared of turn 1 deep strikes), but the guy who does the maths on the GSC team is widely regarded as a brilliant playtester. He's not paid enough in my opinion, but he doesn't care too much. It's slightly cheesy, but he usually says something like "actually having a balanced army is its own reward, no-one wants to play a gakky army".
[Regarding how new units are handled for playtesting and who to thank for the Abominant]: New units are handled with the codex rules, rather than index ones.
Who to thank? Thank yourself, for playing the best army out there :-)
[Regarding the work enviroment]: Pretty chill, but strict deadlines. I can see myself working here for quite some time.
[Regarding an assumption about Stateside based playtesters]: They have playtesters in the States, but for the most part the design is handled in Nottingham
[Regarding how easy it is to make fake leaks]: Exactly. Any text-based leak will generally be ignored, hence why it's easier to do unauthorised leaks that way. If they're ignored, there's less coverage of it too.
[Regarding how playtesting is handled]: It depends on the team. Some teams playtest only internally, within the same codex. Some playtest against whatever army someone can throw together on the day.
The guy on our team playtests them against loads of different builds, usually ones that seem to be doing "pretty well" in tournaments. The top tourney builds get changed quickly, so it's often not worth testing against them (all the time, at least). You don't test as often vs. gakky armies either, as then you're setting the "power bar" way too low.
[Regarding Goliaths]: We realised that if a GSC player wants to get something to the front line quicker, then they'll just cult ambush stuff. If they want to protect their Neophytes, they just get more Neophytes (which is also cheaper). We've reduced points and added a few stratagems that might help.
[Regarding the possibility of getting new units]: There are a few new units making their way in. The gunslinger model has a number of awesome rules, I imagine it'll show up in a large number of lists.
Also, if anyone wants to see the stratagems I've been referencing, most of them are here I believe:
They're paraphrased and a couple of details are missing from what I can tell, but they're pretty accurate. My favourite personally being this one:
> Sabotaged! (1CP) - When an enemy unit is destroyed and has an explosion effect, do not roll any dice - that effect automatically triggers.
[Regarding improving weapons for the army]: We did take a look at the weapons, and a number of them have been improved slightly. The mining laser is not a flat amount of damage, for example.
[Regarding the poster's vagueness about details]: To be honest it's better if there's still a high level of "needs to be taken with salt" about the leaks. We can't release the whole codex in one go, and points values/new units are the worst things for us to leak. There /is/, however, a "primus-lite" model coming to the codex, for Cult Ambush guidance (though weaker than a Primus, for example no aura of +1 to hit).
Arachnofiend wrote: The Drukhari and Tyranids codices are a pretty good pedigree for the lead designer. Everything I'm seeing about GSC makes me feel really excited for the army, which is a problem because I can not start a new project right now...
It's making me glad that I was getting burnt out on painting yellow and started working on GSC as a means of taking a break.
Cephalobeard wrote: Im really hoping Brood Brothers isn't super, super limited. Would be nice to take Heavy Weapon teams, for example, alongside Infantry squads and Neophytes and just bask in the glory of mortars.
Based on rumors, the limited version was killed and we're keeping something pretty close to the index version.
So I went digging into the 4chan thread the WT dropped from to see if I could find some more goodies and here we go [Some of this will go a bit off topic due to the AMA style of the posts, but I like giving context to everything so I'm throwing it ALL in]:
[Regarding the ability to get more than one warlord trait or warlord] No stratagem for this. There was, however, an idea for a Primus to get a relic allowing for a WL trait (to represent the fact that in the fluff it's described as a warlord), but it was taken out last minute.
[Regarding points costs for Acolytes, Hybrids and Goliaths] Those things are indeed cheaper, combined with a stratagem or two there's much more of an incentive to take Goliaths.
[Regarding if they're the same source as the Stratagem leak]: That's another person on the GSC team I think. Either way the stratagems etc. they linked were accurate.
[Regarding if he changed any rules writer's minds on things]: I'm a new member of the team, brought in after one of the GSC playtesters complained heavily about the previous members of the GSC codex team. I worked with that guy on Tyranids. He must have got rid of the Brood Brothers rule that was making its rounds a while back - I can't see it anywhere in the codex right now.
I did some digging about that last comment, and this was what I could find regarding the removed Brood Brother rule:
Sorry about the poor image quality, I had to upsize a picture that was made for Rippers.
And then some more info from two 40k general threads later:
[Regarding identity (again): So to clarify, I'm not the same person who leaked the Stratagems and the Brood Brother leak (which has since been removed from the codex). I'm working on the same team as that guy. He's really fecking into maths and probability, he's got dozens of charts he uses, it's pretty cool.
I can't answer questions in too much detail. We did use Codex:Orks to playtest against Codex:GSC, so they are likely of a similar power level to one another. The [The post literally stops there]
[Regarding Subfaction Traits]: Yes, but for the most part they're a copy/paste of the generic subfaction traits you see in other codexes (or more specifically for GSC, from the guard and tyranid codex, e.g. jormungandr). We added in a generic <SUBFACTION> keyword, which is a first for 8e (previously indexes without them didn't get subfaction traits). Brood Brothers have their own trait (+1 Ld when within 6" of a friendly GSC CHARACTER).
[Regarding concern over the removal of "Brood Brothers"]: No, as in the awful rule that the previous playtesters implemented [see above picture]. We're not the GK rules team, we are aware of how to make a codex.
[Clarification on the Codex's Brood Brother's rule]: To clarify, the Brood Brothers rule is pretty much a copy+paste job from the index rules.
[Regarding "#ShotsFired" over the GK Team comment]: Eh, playful rivalries exist between codex design teams. The GK team get particular flakk because, well, they wrote the GK book as it is.
[Regarding the Tau Codex Team]: There are 1-2 newer designers on that team who pretty much follow the orders of the guys higher up, for better or worse. For a while they wouldn't do too much without going to ask the higher ups about it.
[Regarding a request to leak points]oints are probably the worst thing for me to leak, so screenshots of the full page at once might be tricky. There have been a large number of points reductions across the board. The head guy for GSC (the one who worked on the initial team, and to my knowledge worked on DE and Nids) put a feckton of maths behind it, and he playtests them outside of work.
[Regarding a comment about the maths guy being the good kind of neckbeard]: He's a really nice guy, just really into maths. It's an ongoing joke between us two that he's the "Anti-Crud". I've heard Cruddace has quite the reputation here? Something about "maths is just an opinion"? Not sure how true that is, but if true they're polar opposites I guess.
[Regarding posting stratagems]: I could post the stratagems, but they've been leaked previously. If you've not seen those it's worth checking them out. I can't drop leaks all at once - you might have noticed that the GSC leaks have been once every 2-3 weeks so far. I might be able to post more as the codex approaches.
[Regarding how he got the job if he isn't into maths]: I'm into maths and spreadsheets, it's just this guy is above and beyond. He taught us how to do the maths, and we basically follow his principles. Because of him our design team is known as the "Mathtropaths"
[Regarding subfaction specific strats]: There are a few subfaction specifics, but we decided it would be best not to reveal the subfaction stratagems (as it would give away subfactions existed, which might be problematic).
[Regarding the type of maths used]: It's more statistical based. Algebra and Calc are part of it of course, but more specifically we use binomial probability a lot.
[Regarding leaks and if its known if the anon is doing it]: The team are generally aware I think. The bosses do sometimes tell us to "leak a little bit", but some leaks we've done (e.g. the stratagem leak) weren't exactly authorised. As such, we didn't post screenshots, and only made it text-based, to add a layer of plausible deniability (i.e. "anyone could make these up and post them".
[Regarding Metamorphs]: Metamorphs are cheaper. Holy feck they were overpriced before. Their weapons all have AP-1 now, or better (for rending claws), and they're cheaper than Genestealers (rightfully). Hand flamers also went down from 8 points, they're about half that price now.
[Regarding a post about the army being the right pick for an anon due to the passionate people working the company]: A lot of GW design staff are actually rooting for GSC, as many have kill teams or small armies. There are a few who don't like them as much (scared of turn 1 deep strikes), but the guy who does the maths on the GSC team is widely regarded as a brilliant playtester. He's not paid enough in my opinion, but he doesn't care too much. It's slightly cheesy, but he usually says something like "actually having a balanced army is its own reward, no-one wants to play a gakky army".
[Regarding how new units are handled for playtesting and who to thank for the Abominant]: New units are handled with the codex rules, rather than index ones.
Who to thank? Thank yourself, for playing the best army out there :-)
[Regarding the work enviroment]: Pretty chill, but strict deadlines. I can see myself working here for quite some time.
[Regarding an assumption about Stateside based playtesters]: They have playtesters in the States, but for the most part the design is handled in Nottingham
[Regarding how easy it is to make fake leaks]: Exactly. Any text-based leak will generally be ignored, hence why it's easier to do unauthorised leaks that way. If they're ignored, there's less coverage of it too.
[Regarding how playtesting is handled]: It depends on the team. Some teams playtest only internally, within the same codex. Some playtest against whatever army someone can throw together on the day.
The guy on our team playtests them against loads of different builds, usually ones that seem to be doing "pretty well" in tournaments. The top tourney builds get changed quickly, so it's often not worth testing against them (all the time, at least). You don't test as often vs. gakky armies either, as then you're setting the "power bar" way too low.
[Regarding Goliaths]: We realised that if a GSC player wants to get something to the front line quicker, then they'll just cult ambush stuff. If they want to protect their Neophytes, they just get more Neophytes (which is also cheaper). We've reduced points and added a few stratagems that might help.
[Regarding the possibility of getting new units]: There are a few new units making their way in. The gunslinger model has a number of awesome rules, I imagine it'll show up in a large number of lists.
Also, if anyone wants to see the stratagems I've been referencing, most of them are here I believe:
They're paraphrased and a couple of details are missing from what I can tell, but they're pretty accurate. My favourite personally being this one:
> Sabotaged! (1CP) - When an enemy unit is destroyed and has an explosion effect, do not roll any dice - that effect automatically triggers.
[Regarding improving weapons for the army]: We did take a look at the weapons, and a number of them have been improved slightly. The mining laser is not a flat amount of damage, for example.
[Regarding the poster's vagueness about details]: To be honest it's better if there's still a high level of "needs to be taken with salt" about the leaks. We can't release the whole codex in one go, and points values/new units are the worst things for us to leak. There /is/, however, a "primus-lite" model coming to the codex, for Cult Ambush guidance (though weaker than a Primus, for example no aura of +1 to hit).
And that's everything I could find. For now.
It's a shame you weren't there at the time of the leak on the boards. He posted a load more stuff, but hurriedly deleted a load of it, fearing he had posted too much (hence why a lot of the thread seems to be replying to deleted posts, and why the conversation seems to cut off and continue, as though it were skipping parts. I have a load of screenshots somewhere before a most of it was deleted, I might try fishing them out. Things like the Brood Brother regimental bonus being +1 Ld when a <GENESTEALER CULTS> character is within 6". He wasn't able to delete all of it, as 4chan has a limit to the amount of stuff you can delete at once (I think he mentions it in the thread).
It's also worth noting that the original leaker (Brood Brothers etc., back in June) is a different leaker to the one that's more recent.
Sadly my work schedule doesn't let me be on all hours of the day and night like I could kind of do in the past. I snagged the Brood Brothers thing though:
[Regarding Subfaction Traits]: Yes, but for the most part they're a copy/paste of the generic subfaction traits you see in other codexes (or more specifically for GSC, from the guard and tyranid codex, e.g. jormungandr). We added in a generic <SUBFACTION> keyword, which is a first for 8e (previously indexes without them didn't get subfaction traits). Brood Brothers have their own trait (+1 Ld when within 6" of a friendly GSC CHARACTER).
Cephalobeard wrote: Im really hoping Brood Brothers isn't super, super limited. Would be nice to take Heavy Weapon teams, for example, alongside Infantry squads and Neophytes and just bask in the glory of mortars.
I hope it is. It means we have room for a revamp of the Guard codex without having to worry about whining from GSC players who "buy in" specifically to bring CP batteries.
Even if we did buy in to run a CP battery, the Loyal 32 (I guess in this case, the Disloyal 32?) are the basis of an allied Brigade so it's not like it's a bad shake up for us anyways.
Cephalobeard wrote: Im really hoping Brood Brothers isn't super, super limited. Would be nice to take Heavy Weapon teams, for example, alongside Infantry squads and Neophytes and just bask in the glory of mortars.
Based on rumors, the limited version was killed and we're keeping something pretty close to the index version.
It actually sounds like the guy who came up with that idea got kicked off the GSC team. That's probably good news for GSC players.
Sounds like he had a bad attitude about something or someone. Sometimes personalities clash and that can cause stuff like that to happen.
Cephalobeard wrote: Im really hoping Brood Brothers isn't super, super limited. Would be nice to take Heavy Weapon teams, for example, alongside Infantry squads and Neophytes and just bask in the glory of mortars.
I hope it is. It means we have room for a revamp of the Guard codex without having to worry about whining from GSC players who "buy in" specifically to bring CP batteries.
Why would GSC need CP batteries? Neophyte Hybrids are about as cheap for Cult Ambush.
My guess is you'll be able to take any model with the <Regiment> keyword, so everything that's not Storm Troopers, Commissars, Priests, Ogryns, etc.
That's basically what we already do. I'd kind of like to see GSC Priests and Ogryn options though (representing infected Ecclesiarchy and mutants in a hive for example).
Cephalobeard wrote: Im really hoping Brood Brothers isn't super, super limited. Would be nice to take Heavy Weapon teams, for example, alongside Infantry squads and Neophytes and just bask in the glory of mortars.
Based on rumors, the limited version was killed and we're keeping something pretty close to the index version.
It actually sounds like the guy who came up with that idea got kicked off the GSC team. That's probably good news for GSC players.
Sounds like he had a bad attitude about something or someone. Sometimes personalities clash and that can cause stuff like that to happen.
Yeah, before he deleted the comments, the anon said stuff along the lines of:
The people he worked with were really salty about GSC being able to use guard stuff, as they felt it was unfair and made guard not special any more.
Honestly? They're not wrong. Skitarii did something similar.
I have no qualms with GSC having units that utilize the same stuff as Guard, but when it's literally a book with several instances of units that are Guard+ and then they get another option to just throw Guard into the mix as well?
They hated the idea of first turn charges and wanted to make Cult Ambush a deployment option (so you'd have to put your models in front of the enemy gunline and get shot off the board before you could act if you didn't go first), and no Ambush beyond it (aside from return to the shadows).
None of them played GSC, and considered anything they got was overpowered.
This all kinda sounds like "anon" also had personality clashes in that they thought first turn charges were a-okay and not potentially problematic.
With regards to mathhammer--this is something I keep trying to hammer home. It's great and all to have statistics but people can make statistics 'fit' their viewpoints.
ClockworkZion wrote:
That's basically what we already do. I'd kind of like to see GSC Priests and Ogryn options though (representing infected Ecclesiarchy and mutants in a hive for example).
The Iconward, Abominant, and Aberrants say "hi".
The anon replaced the guy who wanted to restrict what you could ally in from Guard more heavilly than what you currently can.
Also the Iconward and a Priest aren't the same thing. The Iconward is a banner bearer, and he doesn't let you reroll melee attacks like a Priest. Abominant and Aberants are cool, but the Ogryn have other options than them which could work well in a GSC army (because let's be honest, GSC are more melee focused than ranged focused with a lot of units).
The anon replaced the guy who wanted to restrict what you could ally in from Guard more heavilly than what you currently can.
Yes, and from what was posted it sounded like the anon had a personality clash too in regards to members of the team thinking that GSC shouldn't get as much Guard stuff since it feels like they replace them.
Also the Iconward and a Priest aren't the same thing. The Iconward is a banner bearer, and he doesn't let you reroll melee attacks like a Priest.
You're referring to tabletop roles. I'm not.
Iconwards are referred to as "a focus both religious and military" by GW.
Also worth noting that while he "doesn't let you reroll melee attacks like a Priest", a Priest doesn't grant a FNP bubble.
Abominant and Aberants are cool, but the Ogryn have other options than them which could work well in a GSC army (because let's be honest, GSC are more melee focused than ranged focused with a lot of units).
I mean this in the nicest way possible here, but so what? Because your army is melee focused you should get the melee units from Guard?
I truly do hope the GSC book is good. Really, I do. But I also don't want to see GSC become Guard 2.0--which it already has to some effect.
Personality clash guy was the guy who was removed and the anon replaced. He was a member of the team who wanted GSC to be worse basically.
Bullgryns are melee if you take a power maul and a shield, but they also have shooting options (grenade launcher) and the Ogryns are more of a mixed bag of kinda shooty/kinda punchy but mostly tanky.
And as for why? For those sweet conversions mainly.
ClockworkZion wrote: Personality clash guy was the guy who was removed and the anon replaced. He was a member of the team who wanted GSC to be worse basically.
Just because there might be some confusion with those that read the thread (I'm fairly sure you understand it anyway, Zion), it's worth mentioning the different anons so when they're discussed people have a good idea as to who they're talking about:
The "initial team", which lasted up until about August 2018.
1x Anon (referred to as "Broodscribe" by 4chan), who is the maths-loving designer, who worked on DE and Nids beforehand. He leaked the restrictive Brood Brothers rule and gave the first leaks about the codex back in July/August.
2+ Anons, who are the "lazy ones", who were kicked off the GSC design team after dragging the codex to the ground.
The "current team", from about August 2018 onwards.
1x Anon (Broodscribe from before, who is now GSC's lead designer, and the only member left from the original team).
1x Anon (referred to sometimes as "GSC bro" or "Broodbro" on 4chan), who leaked the stratagems and Warlord Traits a week ago. I believe he worked on the Nids codex with Broodscribe, hence why he was invited to join the GSC team (they had worked together before).
1+ Anons, who are also new to the GSC team.
That should help quite a bit.
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Galas wrote: To be honest I see the argument for Genestealer Cults not having access to 90% of the Imperial Guard codex, is the same with DA, BA and SW having all the Space Marine Codex + their special units. I disagree with that, just as I disagree with people that ask for literally everything loyalist marines have with their chaos marines+chaos proper options.
"But they are renegades, what kind of sense does for renegade chapters to lose all of their equipement?!" The same reason for a full terminator force to not be able to full-deepstrike in matched play.
I mean, if they just give us straight up mutants that have been pulled into the cult I'd be pretty happy. Ogryns were more of a stand-in for that idea. And let's be honest, the Guard nicked the Priest from the Sisters, so it's not like we're really stealing him from them. I know the Iconward is the center peice of the cult's faith, but the cults pull in members across the entire spectrum of society, from mutants, to gang members to nobles they drag everyone in, and as such actually serve as one of the best ways to give the game a cross section of larger Imperial life that isn't just covered in spikes (oh, hai Renegades and Heretics).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/31 22:56:55
Cephalobeard wrote: I'm actually hoping the Goliath's get cheap enough to be worth using. Would be fun to have them work with lots of them and position themselves well for the open topped nature, etc.
Idk
Maybe that's just me, but I love the idea of just tons and tons of Neophytes.
He mentioned a points drop and some kind of stratagem(s) that would help them.
I hadn't considered using Tyranid models, likely because I was thinking of more human statlines, but the idea of a massive mutant GSC thing with a big ol' feck off melee weapon is cool.
Cult Ambush took a bat to the knees with the change to reserves via matched play though, so while it was a strong alpha strike option making it a beta strike option means losing some of your punch on turn 1 in hopes of counter-punching on turn 2. It's a risk/reward trade off, especially if you drop a lot of points into big hordes to ambush with.
I'm hoping that if we pay to ambush things we pay like the Orks do: if it's under a certain PL it's 1, if it's over it's 2. That way we can ambush basically everything (ambushing Leman Russ anyone?) but we have to weigh the benefits based on the points costs.
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