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Gurus,
Came up in my game today. Trukk with 3 MegaNobz, and a Pai nBoy. Trukk goes to zero wounds but doesn't explode. It's a friendly teaching game, and I like to let my opponent roll in general, but then I realized after he killed a MegaNobz by rolling one 1 that I couldn't Reroll it with a CP... I mentioned it but I just let my poor Bullyboy die. Now I'm curious. Who rolls that roll?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 05:38:25
Stratagems paragraph on page 242 of Warhammer 40,000 wrote:
If a player has a Battle-forged army, they may spend Command Points (CPs) to use the following Stratagems in any mission they play.
Command Re-Roll wrote:You can re-roll any single dice.
Where's the part that limits me to only re-rolling my own dice?
Stratagems paragraph on page 242 of Warhammer 40,000 wrote: If a player has a Battle-forged army, they may spend Command Points (CPs) to use the following Stratagems in any mission they play.
Command Re-Roll wrote:You can re-roll any single dice.
Where's the part that limits me to only re-rolling my own dice?
It is literally right there. "You can re-roll" not force your opponent to re-roll...
Because you can not re-roll a die that you did not roll.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 07:30:30
Designers Commentary. We’ve had that advice for about a year now...
Stormonu wrote: For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
Ginjitzu wrote: Where's the part that limits me to only re-rolling my own dice?
It is literally right there. "You can re-roll" not force your opponent to re-roll...
Yes, but what's stopping me from re-rolling my opponents dice? (Aside from not being an utter of course. )
Because you can not re-roll a die that you did not roll.
Where does it say this? I mean, it must say it somewhere, but where?
In the English language... If you did not perform an action, you can not perform that action again. (That is what's stopping you from re-rolling your opponents dice).
Of course the Designer's Commentary clarifies it as well.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 09:40:03
Ginjitzu wrote: Where's the part that limits me to only re-rolling my own dice?
It is literally right there. "You can re-roll" not force your opponent to re-roll...
Yes, but what's stopping me from re-rolling my opponents dice? (Aside from not being an utter of course. )
Because you can not re-roll a die that you did not roll.
Where does it say this? I mean, it must say it somewhere, but where?
In the English language... If you did not perform an action, you can not perform that action again. (That is what's stopping you from re-rolling your opponents dice).
Of course the Designer's Commentary clarifies it as well.
"Dave ordered a pizza. The pizza had been cooked, presumably by a chef working at the pizza place. When the pizza arrived, it turned out to be much too big for Dave to eat all at once, so he only ate half. The following morning, Dave decided to have the pizza for breakfast, but he didn't want to have it cold, so he decided to re-heat it in the microwave. Unfortunately for Dave, he had never heated the pizza in the first place - that had been taken care of by the pizza chef - and due to the vagaries of the English language, it was impossible for Dave to re-heat his pizza. Poor Dave's breakfast was ruined."
Ah, I'm just kidding. As others have pointed out, it says it in the designer's commentary, and besides, only the absolute worst kind of would even attempt to interpret re-rolls any other way.
As for who rolls explodes. I agree as others have suggested that the rule belongs to the model, and that therefore the roll should be made by the model owner and can be re-rolled, and I'm pretty sure that's the way I've seen it played in every single battle report I've ever seen.
Ginjitzu wrote: Where's the part that limits me to only re-rolling my own dice?
It is literally right there. "You can re-roll" not force your opponent to re-roll...
Yes, but what's stopping me from re-rolling my opponents dice? (Aside from not being an utter of course. )
Because you can not re-roll a die that you did not roll.
Where does it say this? I mean, it must say it somewhere, but where?
In the English language... If you did not perform an action, you can not perform that action again. (That is what's stopping you from re-rolling your opponents dice).
Of course the Designer's Commentary clarifies it as well.
"Dave ordered a pizza. The pizza had been cooked, presumably by a chef working at the pizza place. When the pizza arrived, it turned out to be much too big for Dave to eat all at once, so he only ate half. The following morning, Dave decided to have the pizza for breakfast, but he didn't want to have it cold, so he decided to re-heat it in the microwave. Unfortunately for Dave, he had never heated the pizza in the first place - that had been taken care of by the pizza chef - and due to the vagaries of the English language, it was impossible for Dave to re-heat his pizza. Poor Dave's breakfast was ruined."
Ah, I'm just kidding. As others have pointed out, it says it in the designer's commentary, and besides, only the absolute worst kind of would even attempt to interpret re-rolls any other way.
As for who rolls explodes. I agree as others have suggested that the rule belongs to the model, and that therefore the roll should be made by the model owner and can be re-rolled, and I'm pretty sure that's the way I've seen it played in every single battle report I've ever seen.
Re-heat does not have any definition in the 40k rules. Re-Roll does.
So that does not work because Re-Roll is defined as...
Page 2 40K Battle Primer wrote:Warhammer 40,000 uses six-sided dice, sometimes abbreviated to D6. Some rules refer to 2D6, 3D6 and so on – in such cases, roll that many D6s and add the results together.
This shows that you roll a number of D6s.
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
As you can see you can only Re-Roll dice which you have already rolled. you get to roll dice you previously rolled. Not dice rolls that your opponent makes.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 10:26:45
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls
Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
Shouldn't it say, "Some rules allow you to re-roll your dice roll?" A dice roll could be anyone's dice roll.
I'm joking by the way. Of course you can't re-roll your opponent's dice; that would be stupid! (Although, could be an interesting stratagem for Tzeench/Alpha Legion. )
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls
Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
Shouldn't it say, "Some rules allow you to re-roll your dice roll?" A dice roll could be anyone's dice roll.
I'm joking by the way. Of course you can't re-roll your opponent's dice; that would be stupid! (Although, could be an interesting stratagem for Tzeench/Alpha Legion. )
Well, there is a large body of people who do believe you can re-roll your opponent's dice under the RAW (I was one of them), which is why GW felt the need to answer it, and I don't see anything wrong with that view either from a rules standpoint OR a player courtesy standpoint. I've honestly never met people so picky about who touches what on a game board as I have in the 40k community.
Whoever owns the transport rolls for both explodes and to see how many models inside are slain. As the designers commentary says, the rules assume you're always rolling your own dice (e.g. you roll you duded to hit and to wound, your opponent rolls for his dudes to save, etc).
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls
Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
Shouldn't it say, "Some rules allow you to re-roll your dice roll?" A dice roll could be anyone's dice roll. ...
"...you to re-roll a dice roll..." you can not roll the dice roll again if you did not roll the dice in the first place.
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls
Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
Shouldn't it say, "Some rules allow you to re-roll your dice roll?" A dice roll could be anyone's dice roll. ...
"...you to re-roll a dice roll..." you can not roll the dice roll again if you did not roll the dice in the first place.
As others have mentioned, it's perfectly acceptable to re-something you didn't something in the first place in the English language. I can reheat a pizza that was originally heated by someone else just as I can re-roll a die that I didn't roll in the first place.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 20:29:25
Page 4 40K Battle Primer wrote: Re-rolls
Some rules allow you to re-roll a dice roll, which means you get to roll some or all of the dice again. You can never re-roll a dice more than once, and re-rolls happen before modifiers (if any) are applied.
Shouldn't it say, "Some rules allow you to re-roll your dice roll?" A dice roll could be anyone's dice roll. ...
"...you to re-roll a dice roll..." you can not roll the dice roll again if you did not roll the dice in the first place.
As others have mentioned, it's perfectly acceptable to re-something you didn't something in the first place in the English language. I can reheat a pizza that was originally heated by someone else just as I can re-roll a die that I didn't roll in the first place.
It is not. since you can not roll something again that you did not roll in the first place. Since the rules talk about YOU making a roll, the re-roll is referencing the roll that you made and as such is the reason you can not re-roll a die roll that your opponent made.
It doesn't matter what the English language says in this instance, we have a definition both via rules and FAQ that state the game assumes you roll and re-roll your own dice and that you cannot re-roll your opponents dice.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/01 20:58:49
BaconCatBug wrote: Whoever owns the transport rolls for both explodes and to see how many models inside are slain. As the designers commentary says, the rules assume you're always rolling your own dice (e.g. you roll you duded to hit and to wound, your opponent rolls for his dudes to save, etc).
Finally! Thank you BaconCat. No wonder there are so many rules arguments. Reading comprehension is not a strong point among us wargamers apparently (myself included). You're the only one who answered my question.
Finally! Thank you BaconCat. No wonder there are so many rules arguments. Reading comprehension is not a strong point among us wargamers apparently (myself included). You're the only one who answered my question.
Kastelen and fe40k actually answered your question right away, to be fair. The only one going on douchey tangents was me. Beg your pardon.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/03 14:39:59
of course. 
)
)
Beg your pardon.