Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Commissars exist outside of the formal rank system precisely so they can execute whomever they see fit.

Private, Sergeant, Lieutenant, Lord High Commander, Warmaster. Doesn't matter. You cannot outrank your Regimental Commissar because he doesn't have a rank. And he doesn't have a rank precisely because he's there to keep everyone, even you, perhaps especially you, in line.

They're also charged with maintaining fighting Morale. Here, we see a legendary being (second only in the Emperor's creations to the mythical Primarchs) saying 'nope. Not yet. Leave him be for the moment'.

This is a Demi-God. A walking representation and expression of the Direct Will of Him On Earth.

You gonna pull rank there? You gonna get our your little Black Book and start demanding his name, rank and serial number? Of course not.

First, you're going to besmirch yourself over the mere fact he's noticed your existence, let alone has been paying attention to you.

Next, as someone with a crucial role in Morale, realise 'I could still pull the trigger, but them I'm going to get sliced into tiny bits, which will be an open challenge to the Commisarriat in the eyes of the troops'.

Finally, you find your Aide and arrange fresh undergarments and dress trousers, with the previous pair being burned.

Sure, you could put in an official protest. But again, who in the entire Imperium is going to gainsay a Custodes. About the only person with any authority to do so is another Custodes, or Guilliman himself. No one else is going to dare.

pm713 wrote:
Feels like Two Face from Batman. The Warmaster will -flips coin- die!

 AndrewGPaul wrote:

Spectral Ceramite wrote:
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The commissar is the type a person who is like what you are doing is against the Emperor so out you go etc, ...

... and the subject of their justice has been picked out for a purpose by one of that same Emperor's holy guard.

If Gabriel descended from the heavens to tell the Spanish Inquisition to stop burning that heretic because he had a purpose for him, I don't think the priests would have bothered to quibble.

locarno24 wrote:

bibotot wrote:


Two, how do Commissars execute a Warmaster? There is a limit as to who the Commissars can execute. They can't execute Space Marines, Sisters of Battle, Custodes, Mechanicus personnel and Inqusitorial Troops as these belong to different organizations which the Commissar have no authority over. Likewise, a Warmaster is designated by the Lords of Terra. Without authorization from the Lords of Terra themselves, Commissars can't execute a Warmaster.

A warmaster or lord solar is appointed by the high lords, but remains a Guard officer and as such subject to commissarial discipline. They'd need to explain themselves to the high lords, but that's not the same thing - that's the benefit of them being outside the rank structure; no one within the Militarum or Battlefleet can ever be 'to high a rank' for them to sanction.

The Custodes cannot make a Warmaster out of someone and expects all the Guardsmen, Space Marines and Imperial Navy would just go with it. That is literally the US army installing a general in the Saudi army.

Horus was the first Warmaster and he was appointed by the Emperor himself. Then you have Slaydo and Macharius, both appointed by the Lords of Terra.

No, because they have Imperial (as in 'speak-with-the-voice-of-the-Emperor', much like inquisitors) authority. It's more like the President of the USA wandering into a US Army lieutenant's court-martial and saying "Case adjourned, here's some general's stars. You're not going to enjoy this mission."

Voss wrote:

bibotot wrote:

Deathwatch101 wrote:
Where does it say that a Commissar cant execute a Warmaster? Commissars are the authority of imperial Law within the
In this example, the High Lords didn't make him a Warmaster, the Custodes did (who exist outside the High Lords), so it could be argued that he was a condemned man under the protection of the Custodes. And once that protection was gone......

The Custodes cannot make a Warmaster out of someone and expects all the Guardsmen, Space Marines and Imperial Navy would just go with it. That is literally the US army installing a general in the Saudi army.

No, it isn't even figuratively close to that. (That is also a bad example, as the US Army has actually installed a few foreign generals in some parts of the world)

Who has precedence in the Imperium can be confusing, but it is all one system, and the Guard (or Imperial Navy) is almost never on top. Astartes usually have precedence in whatever theatre they're operating in, though Titan Legions and other Ad Mech outfits are usually off to the side somewhere (as the Mechanicus is an independent ally of the Imperium in most of the ways that matter), and have to be asked, not ordered, to participate.

The big question isn't if Custodes or Astartes can mess about with Guard ranks and command authority, but if they'd notice or bother. General opinion of novels, codexes and other background material is they can, but generally don't as long as the guard units are pointed in the correct direction, shooting enemies and soaking fire. If they aren't doing that, the Marines may not even wait for the Commissars to cull the officer corps, they may just preemptively do it themselves. Most chapters won't care if a general or a lieutenant is giving the advance order, as long as someone is giving it and the troops are obeying.