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2018/11/20 21:09:29
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
I do not have a lot of experience. But Deathguard can be very difficult. Unless you have a lot of resources to dedicate to it they are almost impossible to kill. On topp of that they have top notch ranged weapons and melee weapons. They even have cheap models to camp objectives.
Playing against the T'au player in my campaign proves frustrating every time. I win with my AdMech but barely each time. One game he played just 3 Stealth suits and just jumped everywhere because he managed to survive in CC each time, he killed me one model and and killed two, very frustrating. Or when the mission is Take Prisoners and he just holes up in a building with his whole team and decimates you when you dare declare a charge.
40K: Adeptus Mechanicus
AoS: Nighthaunts
2018/11/21 18:56:52
Subject: Re:Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
I was the one using them but deathwatch was very frustrating to my opponent. The special ammo gave me a solution to pretty much everything his Tau could bring and it was a one sided curb stomp. Neither of us found that very fun.
2018/11/21 22:50:59
Subject: Re:Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Really, I think it's more matchup dependent than anything. Deathwatch with multiple frag cannons is really obnoxious if you're running a melee focused team, for example, but wouldn't be nearly as bad for a shooting heavy squad.
Something nice and balanced won't have as many bad matchups and won't be as annoying to face for anyone else, so that might be a goal if you're looking to start a new team.
2018/11/21 23:59:05
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
I play Necrons and what I find the most annoying to face is Deathguard or Deathwatch.
Deathguard because they T5 accros the board, 3+ saves and 5+ fnp. Plus they are 2 wounds a piece.
Deathwatch can field 4 fragcannons and 1 tax leader in a 100pt game. Thats 8 S7 -2 2 (S9 -3 if within half range) dmg shots or 8d6 S6 -1 1 auto hitting shots. It's not even fun to play against and I have 3 times during the Killteam campaign.
Every other army is alright. Maybe T sons at a push but that's cause they are 2+ flat.
Deathguard because they T5 accros the board, 3+ saves and 5+ fnp. Plus they are 2 wounds a piece.
Nothing that isn't a Commander has more than 1 wound in Deathguard.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/11/22 09:25:56
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Deathguard because they T5 accros the board, 3+ saves and 5+ fnp. Plus they are 2 wounds a piece.
Nothing that isn't a Commander has more than 1 wound in Deathguard.
I need to start playing against people who actually know their models. Them being played as 2 wound models makes a big difference. Can't believe I was playing against them as if they had 2 wounds.
It‘s strongly mission dependend and what you‘re playing.
The one I find always annoying are DG. They‘ve got it all and for the price of a Tactical Marine. It makes you wonder whether Chaos has infiltrated the studio already.
That‘s not whining on behalf of the Ordinary Maines, but whining about very resilent models which come comparable cheap.
Add the 3 point unshakeable Poxwalkers and you get a Kill Team that is frustraing to play against.
Nekron can be frustrating because of the injury roll natural 6 rolls combined with T4 and Sv4+ or 3+. Any weapon with high DS may prove to be a liability. If you play with Levels, the Necron Player may get lucky and gets -1 on Injury rolls. Than you can‘t kill a model on the first wound, if obscured.
Flyers can be annoying for CC armies. On the other hand, if you have a second wave, you can keep them „charged“. Even a Gretchin can lock them in combat. So frustration, that you potentially can avoid.
Psykers, because if you do not have one you receive a mortal wound on a 2+ (5+ on 2W6) every turn and can‘t do anything against it. Especially a CC army might find that frustrating in a game against GK.
Ok, I admit it all only annoying, except the DG, which are not unbeatable, but frustrating.
2018/11/23 16:39:24
Subject: Re:Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
I will second that matchup and mission matter a lot-what is hard for some armies to beat is a joke for other armies.
If I am playing harlies, I would LOVE to see the 4 frag cannon deathwatch list. I can easily charge them from cover and killing 5 MEQ in CC with clowns is nothing. That said, it can be very tough to deal with for a lot of armies. GK can be annoying but you are always looking at 5 single wound MEQ, so a couple good rolls on your side or a couple bad rolls on the GK side mean the game is over.
Deathguard of course, not just because of their undercosted models, but the fact that anything you can do they can do as good or better. With a good roster, they can be a better shooty, melee, or horde army than anything brought against them.
Flying models(tau) are incredibly frustrating for most melee armies. Playing harlequins, my worst matchups are any kind of horde-poxwalkers, guardsmen, cultists, bugs, anything that is 15+ models is just too many things to kill for harlies.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/23 16:39:32
The most important rule of 40K-Page XVII of the 6th edition rulebook, the figure at the top right of the page. "Shake hands with your opponent and thank them for a good battle and fun experience." Then go out for a beer.
Shine bright like Iyanden
2018/11/24 00:47:37
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Death Guard. T5, 3+, 5+ FNP is very difficult to get through. They have access to just about any specialism, and can take multiple blight launchers and cleavers against elite teams or flamers and flails against hordes. There's almost no matchup or mission where you don't have the upper hand before the dice even start rolling if you build your command roster properly.
2018/11/24 20:27:43
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
stratigo wrote: Tau are always annoying as their main way to play is the try and make you not able to do things
Tau are still kinda non interactive since they're only doing one thing, shooting and maybe moving a bit. That said, the nearly constant -1 to hit and long range shooting penalty hurts them a lot and that combined with a few missions being based around melee hurts them.
2018/11/25 04:06:27
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
brumbaer wrote: Add the 3 point unshakeable Poxwalkers and you get a Kill Team that is frustraing to play against.
Poxwalkers don’t have that rule in Kill Team.
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
2018/11/25 09:54:00
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
No, they don’t. It’s not in the printed rulebook, errata, or designer’s commentary. It was apparently added to the digital rulebook mistakenly after an update but it was quickly removed.
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
2018/11/25 15:34:26
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
It is in all revisions of the iBook incl. the current one, which incorporates the changes published in the errata.
So it's a bonus for iBook-users only
Are you sure you have the most current version? It was removed less than a week after it was added. The same update also corrected the fail of corruption’s damage to 1.
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
2018/11/25 20:24:29
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Yes, i‘m sure.
To make sure I deleted the book and reinstalled.
Now I checked the iBook Store and some other user commented about not all changes of the errata being in the iBook and refers to mindless and flail of corruption.
2018/11/26 06:30:50
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Tyranids can be pretty frustrating in an objective-swarming mission; as long as the warrior(s) stay(s) alive (or just hides behind a building for a crafty digestion pool latte) then the kill team is functionally unbreakable as the lil' gribblies auto-pass nerve tests within what's actually a pretty large chunk of the board.
It is very matchup dependent - watching a mechanicus team who'd come loaded for Death Guard trying to clear half a dozen gaunts huddling on an objective with a one-shot-a-turn arquebus was kind of painful
Termagants expended for the Hive Mind: ~2835
2018/11/26 09:28:57
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Obvious caveat: None of these armies are a problem if the opponent doesn't go all-in on cheese builds/tactics. I.E. Guard are perfectly fine if you've got a mix of special weaponry, some regular guardsmen, some regular scions whatever. Also, everything is matchup-dependent. GK are in no way frustrating if you are a horde, but if you're a non-prmiaris power armor....ew...
-GK as an Elite faction. Mortal wounds, almost unstoppable, every turn. at least with Thousand Sons you can shoot the sorceror to stop it.
-Deathwatch as a horde faction. 4x Frag Cannons and a cheapo sniper leader spamming the tactic from the Deathwatch special box that lets you retreat 6" is hideous.
-Death Guard as a horde faction. Some like orks and nids can successfully swarm and swamp them in melee but if you don't have access to mass high str high damage weaponry, death guard are a bear to deal with.
-Imp Guard as an elite faction. They can have like 7 plasma guns that reroll 1s to hit. That is annoying as flippity flip if you are space marines.
-Harlequins as a shooty faction. Much less irritating now that the fall back ruling is a thing, which allows a lot more counterplay against them, but if you're playing something like non-cheesy Tau (with models that aren't stealth suits or drones) harlequins can be a real headache.
Factions that pretty much never cause tilt, because they are relatively balanced between melee/range and don't have hyper durability: Astartes, Chaos Marines, Orks, Drukhari, GSC, Tyranids, Admech.
Factions that don't cause tilt because they're super underpowered: Eldar, Necrons.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
2018/11/27 16:08:46
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
I play DG and my friend play T'au. He built the perfect list to counter the high toughness of plague marines. His sniper hits on 2+ and deals an extra mortal wound on a 4+. His demo spec practically does the same thing paired with a comms spec. They deal 2 wounds each on my plague marines. Pretty demoralizing
2018/11/27 16:20:08
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Deathguard. It costs a lot in CPs, but they can re-introduce the character targeting rule. It's a pretty good combo to take your leader, pack him with a massive plasma weapon, and stick him behind some cheap zombies. A kill a turn can quickly turn the tide and not seeing your expensive leader/plasma model take a shot in the face for his troubles is amazing.
Next up is probably Imperial Guard. Their troops are dirt cheap, they can do a decent plasma alpha strike, and orders is a powerful tool. Being able to pack a powerfist in the middle of massive rifleman blob is pretty good is the terrain is placed thickly enough.
I really want to see how GSC performs as I haven't faced them yet.
Bender wrote:* Realise that despite the way people talk, this is not a professional sport played by demi gods, but rather a game of toy soldiers played by tired, inebriated human beings.
bouledepoisson wrote: I play DG and my friend play T'au. He built the perfect list to counter the high toughness of plague marines. His sniper hits on 2+ and deals an extra mortal wound on a 4+. His demo spec practically does the same thing paired with a comms spec. They deal 2 wounds each on my plague marines. Pretty demoralizing
Mortal wound from rail rifle is resolved first and then ends the attack sequence. A plague marine is more likely to live through that then the regular hit.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/11/27 23:06:21
Subject: Most frustrating Killteam to play against?
Shine bright like Iyanden 
