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The new Abaddon is here! and he's.........not really the 10000 year old master of warfare I was hoping for.

for 240 points (tha's more than a Daemon Prince with Wings who is tougher, has better movement and has greater Strength) you get:

M6 WS2+ BS2+ S5 T5 W8 A6 Ld 10 Sv 2+


So he has alot of attacks like he always did.....

Now special rules for him:

Dark Destiny: He has a 4+ inv save (noice) and all damage on his is halved (double noice!)

Death to the False Emperor. Yup got that

Lord of the Black Legion: Reroll hits for Black Legion units within 6"

Mark of Chaos Ascendant : Heretic Astartes auto pass morale tests within 12!

Teleport Strike. Yup got that..


Hang on, this guy is the WARMASTER of chaos, the biggest baddy below the Daemon Primarchs....and he hasn't got one special rule that a chapter master like Calgar doesn't have. One that truly makes him worth 240 points.....!!!


Ok his weapons are ok

Drachnyen is +1 S AP-3 D3 and every time you fight roll a D6. On a 1 Abaddon suffers a mortal wound and cannot fight with the sword in that phase. On a 2+ he can make that many additional attacks with that weapon. So you can potentially get 12 attacks if you roll a 6!

Talon of Horus. Shooting 24" Rapid Fire S4 AP-1 D3 botler dakkadakkadakkadakkadakkdakkadakka

Talor on Horus Melee S X2 Ap-4 D3 Now that's better. a S10 slicey claw.


But i'm still disappointed...

Abaddon is meant to be the most gifted powerful avatar of chaos. I'd hope he'd have a special rule to empower all units in the force or something. Or Terminators.

Instead he's a moderately tough, CC oriented tank who allows those round him to reroll to hit if they're black legion..


In effect he is a 240 point CHAPLAIN

I'm sorry where you expecting him to grant a auto win on a roll of 6?

no i was expecting him to have rules that reflect his position as Chaos' greatest general and architect of 13 Black Crusades.


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Even Calgar has a rule that allows you to get 2 more CP if you have him as your warlord!

Never was and never will be.

He makes tzaangors fearless. Just saying.

Not 100% sure as I don't have the Vigilus ablaze book to hand, but didn't he get buffed with a +2 Command point rule in his new datasheet?

1) Your comparison to a Daemon Prince is misleading. Abaddon has better saves than a Daemon Prince and halves all damage, meaning he is functionally much harder to kill out of the two. Additionally, while a Daemon Prince has a higher base Strength value, Abaddon strikes at Strength 10 with the Talon of Horus, negating that advantage.

2) You actually forgot two special rules; the first - and most important - is he gives Morale immunity to all friendly Heretic Astartes (NOT just Black Legion - this also includes Death Guard and Thousand Sons) within 12" of him, and the second is that he - like Calgar - provides a bonus 2 Command Points for you if he is the Warlord.

3) Thanks to his Warlord Trait, wargear, stats and special rules, Abaddon absolutely obliterates Imperium units, characters, vehicle and even Knights with little difficulty. He is a walking engine of close-quarters destruction against Imperium armies. Against non-Imperium factions, he still hits like a truck and is one of the deadliest, most efficient special characters in the game.

4) He is not just "moderately tough". Halving damage, 2+ armour save, 4+ invulnerable save and the potential to be buffed by ALL mark-specific buffs - from fighting twice with Khorne, being -1 to-hit thanks to Nurgle, gaining a 5+ to ignore wounds and mortal wounds through Slaanesh, to a 3+ invulnerable save because of Tzeentch - means you can super-charge him into an absolute monster. Of course, even without all those potential buffs, he still chews through almost anything he gets into combat with and is very difficult to take down.

5) He has been the lynchpin of competitive Chaos Space Marine tournament builds since the codex came out. His morale immunity alone is incredible, and while Cultists - the choice unit to pair him with - have been hit hard with nerfs, he got buffed up in Vigilus Ablaze and he absolutely still makes an otherwise mediocre Legion a top contender for getting the most out of the faction. If you don't see the value of a character that; can teleport, beat up near anything in melee solo, super tough, provides extra command points, one of few sources of full re-rolls to hit in an army that can absolutely put out a nasty shooting phase, provides a 12" morale immunity bubble regardless of Legion and has a Warlord Trait geared for maximising damage output against the most common faction type in the game, you're out of your mind.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tristanleo wrote:
Not 100% sure as I don't have the Vigilus ablaze book to hand, but didn't he get buffed with a +2 Command point rule in his new datasheet?

Already had it, only his stats got buffed in Vigilus Ablaze.

Also his re-roll hits ability is significantly better than chapter masters (or even the hit portion of Gmans reroll aura), as it doesn't specify misses, so you can re-roll those 3s when you move (with heavy weapons), or suffer any other -1s to hit.

Not sure if serious.

I mean this is Failbaddon the Armless. Who failed to kill a bunch of humans on a planet at the edge of chaos 12 times in a row.

But as others have said, his page is pretty beast. He's essentially a tougher to kill Trojan Valoris with an even better melee. So yeah, he costs 250. But he's worth it when your Tzangors and Plaguebearers aren't dropping to moral and he's bitch slapping knights.

Well literally the only models that can take him in HTH are the primarchs. He is slightly better than Calgar (and the cost shows that).

Not sure I see what to complain about. That 1/2 damage mechanic makes him a beast.

Could use him on a bike

Like, you are the boss of the bosses. You can just commandeer a freaking guy's bike. Just take it, they won;t say anything.

Abaddon is flat out worth his 240 points.


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 Corennus wrote:
no i was expecting him to have rules that reflect his position as Chaos' greatest general and architect of 13 Black Crusades.


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Even Calgar has a rule that allows you to get 2 more CP if you have him as your warlord!

So does Abaddon... Have you read his whole datasheet?

I'm honestly thinking of buying the model for my friend's birthday present. He runs 1k sons/daemons. Throw him in a supreme command det and get him in with some bloodletters/Tzangors, and he's charging/wrecking everything.

as a Calgar player - I am totally jealous of Abaddon....That should tell you something. In fact I think he is overbuffed...Just the change to the wording of his aura is insane. Plus he does way more damage now? For 0 additional cost?

 Xenomancers wrote:
as a Calgar player - I am totally jealous of Abaddon....That should tell you something. In fact I think he is overbuffed...Just the change to the wording of his aura is insane. Plus he does way more damage now? For 0 additional cost?

Yea the S5 helps a good bit. Wound GEQ on 2s (with the +1) and Knights on 3s.

Not sure if OP is trolling? Abaddon is amazingly good.

Anyone with experience from both sides want to compare him to guilliman?

 Xenomancers wrote:
as a Calgar player - I am totally jealous of Abaddon....That should tell you something. In fact I think he is overbuffed...Just the change to the wording of his aura is insane. Plus he does way more damage now? For 0 additional cost?

I tend to agree here, however, I almost never field Abaddon in any serious lists. I think he's really good, but he usually ends up on the cutting room floor, either because I decide Black Legion sucks, or I decide he's too expensive for what I'm trying to do with a given list, or I decide I don't need that level of ass-kicking out of my Chaos Lord. It's possible I'm just a cheap bastard.

Cheeslord wrote:
Anyone with experience from both sides want to compare him to guilliman?

Vs most targets Abaddon will out damage. Vs Imperial Target...Abaddon does about double. OFC Gman can do mortal wounds and has a 3++. So head to head Gman probably still has the advantage.


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 TwinPoleTheory wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
as a Calgar player - I am totally jealous of Abaddon....That should tell you something. In fact I think he is overbuffed...Just the change to the wording of his aura is insane. Plus he does way more damage now? For 0 additional cost?

I tend to agree here, however, I almost never field Abaddon in any serious lists. I think he's really good, but he usually ends up on the cutting room floor, either because I decide Black Legion sucks, or I decide he's too expensive for what I'm trying to do with a given list, or I decide I don't need that level of ass-kicking out of my Chaos Lord. It's possible I'm just a cheap bastard.

Yeah. I think the real struggle with Abandon it is hard to figure out what to do with him other than beatstick and keep cultists alive. He is great for that I guess. It's just the presence combo with reroll 1's is actually a better hitting buff most of the time and most of the time abaddon is overkill in melle.

I think the best way to run him is actually with a lot of BL terminator squads and cultists I don't have any chaos terminators right now though...

Hes not terrible for buffing daemon engines ether.

 Xenomancers wrote:
I think the best way to run him is actually with a lot of BL terminator squads and cultists I don't have any chaos terminators right now though...

I agree, run him in a Vanguard with 3 squads of minned out Terminators is pretty reasonable at 675 points and is spitting out a very respectable amount of troop killing shots, still hasn't made the cut yet though, but someday, probably, maybe.

 TwinPoleTheory wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
as a Calgar player - I am totally jealous of Abaddon....That should tell you something. In fact I think he is overbuffed...Just the change to the wording of his aura is insane. Plus he does way more damage now? For 0 additional cost?

I tend to agree here, however, I almost never field Abaddon in any serious lists. I think he's really good, but he usually ends up on the cutting room floor, either because I decide Black Legion sucks, or I decide he's too expensive for what I'm trying to do with a given list, or I decide I don't need that level of ass-kicking out of my Chaos Lord. It's possible I'm just a cheap bastard.

I can't toss BL after Vigilus. There is just too much in there that I like now.

You are a cheap bastard.

Abby v. Bobby G? Isn't Bobby G a Superheavy, and Abby is an HQ? That should make the match right there,.,,,

Edited for clarity: Bobby G is harder to get into lists, while Abby is almost auto-include on some lists.

 Corennus wrote:
architect of 13 Black Crusades.

12 out of 13 failed, and the last was kind of a draw (albeit enough to get Cadia relegated).

So I'd expect him to not be great

You have to build an army around him. Otherwise, you aren't using him to his full potential.

Eldenfirefly wrote:
You have to build an army around him. Otherwise, you aren't using him to his full potential.

I asked this question over in the chaos tactics thread but while Abby is good, he needs some amazing synergy for the cost which I can't seem to figure out.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
You are a cheap bastard.

Alpha Legion ROI consistently comes out on top, then Huron showed up with a briefcase full of CP, Black Legion showed up with a bunch of interesting tools and craptastic legion trait. Not sure what to tell you, cheap bastard is my guiding light.

 TwinPoleTheory wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
You are a cheap bastard.

Alpha Legion ROI consistently comes out on top, then Huron showed up with a briefcase full of CP, Black Legion showed up with a bunch of interesting tools and craptastic legion trait. Not sure what to tell you, cheap bastard is my guiding light.

Yea I usually find room for RC in my list. The rest of it leans heavily towards CQC, so, little room for AL to shine.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Abby v. Bobby G? Isn't Bobby G a Superheavy, and Abby is an HQ? That should make the match right there,.,,,

Edited for clarity: Bobby G is harder to get into lists, while Abby is almost auto-include on some lists.

IDK if that is correct. 400 points for super heavy aux with gman. Insert into any imperium list to get decent returns. Great with IK. Great with Ultras. He is basically plug an play. Make warlord to get 3+ CP and return on 5 +.

Abaddon requires you take other units. What other units do you take though? CSM? They are bad. Cultists? Ehhh - they start to add up in points for what you need to make them worth it. I find it difficult.

 Xenomancers wrote:


Hes not terrible for buffing daemon engines ether.

Do you mind elaborating this?

I'm thinking of going hog-wild with demon engines in my next army (think venom crawlers, maulerfields and LoD).

 Xenomancers wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Abby v. Bobby G? Isn't Bobby G a Superheavy, and Abby is an HQ? That should make the match right there,.,,,

Edited for clarity: Bobby G is harder to get into lists, while Abby is almost auto-include on some lists.

IDK if that is correct. 400 points for super heavy aux with gman. Insert into any imperium list to get decent returns. Great with IK. Great with Ultras. He is basically plug an play. Make warlord to get 3+ CP and return on 5 +.

Abaddon requires you take other units. What other units do you take though? CSM? They are bad. Cultists? Ehhh - they start to add up in points for what you need to make them worth it. I find it difficult.

So, it all depends on play style IMHO. I can see some very enterprising play styles using rushdown tactics with Abby. It's not hard to surround him with cheap good cqc troops that eat gun lines for breakfast.