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Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

The General's Handbook: Meeting Engagements on Warhammer Community. Here's the basics:

Meeting Engagement forces are small, highly focused and generally based around the core Battleline units of your army. A Meeting Engagement army must be 1000 points, and consists of three main elements – each of which contains at least 1 unit.

* The Spearhead: An advance force made up of 0-1 Leaders, 0-2 Battleline units, and 0-2 other units
* The Main Body: The primary element of your force, which includes 1-2 Leaders, 1+ Battleline units, 0-1 Behemoths and any number of other units
* The Rearguard: A reserve force that arrives last, and includes 0-1 Leaders, 0-1 Behemoths, 0-2 Artillery, 0-2 Battleline units, and 0-2 other units

Additionally, some unit restrictions apply…

* Your army may include no more than 2 units from the same warscroll (unless they’re part of a Warscroll Battalion).
* Units in the spearhead can only be taken at their minimum size. One Battleline unit in the main body and any number of Battleline units in the rearguard can be taken at up to double their minimum size.
* You may only include one Warscroll Battalion.
* You may only include one allied unit.
* You may only include one endless spell.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/06/11 16:18:08


'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Grisly Ghost Ark Driver




New York

I've been excited for this since they've announced it as I love smaller/faster games and I'm hoping this catches on for tournaments.

Hopefully they tease some of the battleplans and deployment types soon. Maybe we'll even see battalions that are aimed at one of the three groups in future books.

Artillery are rearguard only? I feel like Celestar Ballistas are fine with this and not too much else.

Regardless, I look forward to playing this format.
   
Made in us
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






I will have to see if there are additional restrictions to address the numerous scaling issues which crop up at 1000 points. My response is definitely going to be more critical since they are pushing this as a tournament option. As it stands these rules barely put a dent in the problem.

"Putting a statement in quotations makes it seem more legitimate."
--Bette R. Withname

Imagine three people with the same set of values but radically different emotional states, each of them believes their position is more valid than the other two, they all post using the same account, and your job is to make it coherent. 
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





First obvious one comes to mind is summoning. Summoning without additional restrictions at 1000 pts is horrifically optimal.

In 2000 pt game, summoning a 250 pt unit is useful.

In a 1000 pt game, thats 25% of the other side in one go. Double your army up in 1000 pts, which is doable by a few factions. Even the 600-750 pts which I see as average is horrific in 1000 pt games, the equivalent of getting 1200-1500 free points in a 2000 pt match.

Thats just getting the powergaming engine warmed up if 1000 pt is supposed to be a legit game level.

GW points don't bring balance. They exist purely for structure. You can get more balance from no points than you do from GW points. You however can get no structure in your game without points. 
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

Someone asked about summoning on Facebook. The answer was 'this is all we know right now'. I imagine we'll find out if there's any restrictions on summoning for playing a Meeting Engagement when the reviews go up this weekend (or sooner).

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

It's double the unit's minimum size, so 20 Plague Monk maximum.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/11 18:31:36


'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

 Ghaz wrote:
Someone asked about summoning on Facebook. The answer was 'this is all we know right now'. I imagine we'll find out if there's any restrictions on summoning for playing a Meeting Engagement when the reviews go up this weekend (or sooner).

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

It's double the unit's minimum size, so 20 Plague Monk maximum.


I got too excited reading. My bad.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





Yeah my comments are based on what little we know right now. I'll just leave it at that. We're already having this internal discussion with the campaign group. The competitive guys have already unholstered their bottles of jergens for the shennanigans they think they will get to pull.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/11 18:35:43


GW points don't bring balance. They exist purely for structure. You can get more balance from no points than you do from GW points. You however can get no structure in your game without points. 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

 obsidiankatana wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
Someone asked about summoning on Facebook. The answer was 'this is all we know right now'. I imagine we'll find out if there's any restrictions on summoning for playing a Meeting Engagement when the reviews go up this weekend (or sooner).

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

It's double the unit's minimum size, so 20 Plague Monk maximum.


I got too excited reading. My bad.

Honestly their wording is not entirely clear as they never say that all units can only be taken at minimum size, just that units in the spearhead can only be taken at minimum size and a certain number of Battleline units in the others can be taken at double their minimum size. It wouldn't be GW if there wasn't some ambiguity there

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Androgynous Daemon Prince of Slaanesh





Norwalk, Connecticut

 auticus wrote:
Yeah my comments are based on what little we know right now. I'll just leave it at that. We're already having this internal discussion with the campaign group. The competitive guys have already unholstered their bottles of jergens for the shennanigans they think they will get to pull.


I didn’t realize ALL your competitive guys were Slaanesh players.

Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.

Manchu wrote:I'm a Catholic. We eat our God.


Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.  
   
Made in us
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






 Ghaz wrote:
 obsidiankatana wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
Someone asked about summoning on Facebook. The answer was 'this is all we know right now'. I imagine we'll find out if there's any restrictions on summoning for playing a Meeting Engagement when the reviews go up this weekend (or sooner).

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

It's double the unit's minimum size, so 20 Plague Monk maximum.


I got too excited reading. My bad.

Honestly their wording is not entirely clear as they never say that all units can only be taken at minimum size, just that units in the spearhead can only be taken at minimum size and a certain number of Battleline units in the others can be taken at double their minimum size. It wouldn't be GW if there wasn't some ambiguity there
As it stands;
-All units in the spearhead can only be minimum size
-All units in the rearguard can be up to double minimum size.
-Battleline units in the main can be up to double minimum size
-Non-battleline units in the main can be as large as they want.

I am hesistently guessing that last one is an error in the article and no unit can be taken at larger than double minimum.

40-man clanrat units will wreck face pretty hard at any rate.

"Putting a statement in quotations makes it seem more legitimate."
--Bette R. Withname

Imagine three people with the same set of values but radically different emotional states, each of them believes their position is more valid than the other two, they all post using the same account, and your job is to make it coherent. 
   
Made in si
Steady Stonecleaver







Right now it sounds like page filler with no thought behind it to me.

Posters on ignore list: 33

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

Also the text doesn't match the table.

Text says Spearhead allows 0-2 Battleline, Table claims Spearhead allows 0-1 Battleline.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Spoiler:
 Ghaz wrote:
 obsidiankatana wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
Someone asked about summoning on Facebook. The answer was 'this is all we know right now'. I imagine we'll find out if there's any restrictions on summoning for playing a Meeting Engagement when the reviews go up this weekend (or sooner).

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Double battleline unit limit in main body and rearguard?

80-strong unit of Plague Monks. My body is ready-prepared, yes-yes.

It's double the unit's minimum size, so 20 Plague Monk maximum.


I got too excited reading. My bad.

Honestly their wording is not entirely clear as they never say that all units can only be taken at minimum size, just that units in the spearhead can only be taken at minimum size and a certain number of Battleline units in the others can be taken at double their minimum size. It wouldn't be GW if there wasn't some ambiguity there

As it stands;

-All units in the spearhead can only be minimum size
-All units in the rearguard can be up to double minimum size.
-Battleline units in the main can be up to double minimum size
-Non-battleline units in the main can be as large as they want.

I am hesistently guessing that last one is an error in the article and no unit can be taken at larger than double minimum.

40-man clanrat units will wreck face pretty hard at any rate.

They've updated the article...

* Units in the spearhead can only be taken at their minimum size. Any Battleline units in the main body, and any units in the rearguard, can be taken at up to double their minimum size.

... I would venture to say that a unit can only be taken at minimum size unless specifixally noted that it can be taken at double their minimum size.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






The way it is written only says battleline units in the main body face that restriction, and does not include non-battleline, which seems strange and incongruous to me.

"Putting a statement in quotations makes it seem more legitimate."
--Bette R. Withname

Imagine three people with the same set of values but radically different emotional states, each of them believes their position is more valid than the other two, they all post using the same account, and your job is to make it coherent. 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
The way it is written only says battleline units in the main body face that restriction, and does not include non-battleline, which seems strange and incongruous to me.

I agree, which is why I believe that all units can only be taken at minimum size unless noted otherwise. It wouldn't be Games Workshop without some ambiguity in the rules. Hopefully when the reviews roll in this weekend we'll get some clarification from the General's Handbook that's missing in the article.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






I think you hit the nail on the head there.

"Putting a statement in quotations makes it seem more legitimate."
--Bette R. Withname

Imagine three people with the same set of values but radically different emotional states, each of them believes their position is more valid than the other two, they all post using the same account, and your job is to make it coherent. 
   
Made in be
Raging Rat Ogre






As long as people can go stomping around in 1000p battles with VLoZD with ethereal amulets, GKoTG, KoS, or other 300+ behemoths, I don't think these restrictions are enough.

The boy, I say, the boy is as sharp as a sack of wet mice... 
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





I would agree with you. The general consensus last night on my group's discord was "every game is broken and bent so this will be fine".

I don't really pay this much attention though because I am doubting 1000 points becomes a thing in the first place and to be honest, 2000 points has just as many issues in the same vein.

GW points don't bring balance. They exist purely for structure. You can get more balance from no points than you do from GW points. You however can get no structure in your game without points. 
   
Made in be
Raging Rat Ogre






I would personally love for a 1000p game to become a more interesting and engaging mode of play.

If only for the sheer logistical nightmare that a 2000p can be. Dragging that large an army to my FLGS isn't an easy thing (let alone the limited amount of space we often have to deal with there).

That being said, these restrictions seem like a half measure. They are limiting death star style units in 1k games, but don't really touch on heavy behemoths... Feels a bit like "taking away the natural predator" for one of them.

The boy, I say, the boy is as sharp as a sack of wet mice... 
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant




Tampa, FL

I was very excited about this, but the approach they went with seems a little odd and, like most things, already wide open to abuse. Just like Skirmish which was an amazing idea done so poorly as to be nearly unplayable, I get the same vibe with this. It's going to be busted wide open almost immediately so as to be all but useless due to how broken it can be. The extra oddball restrictions seem to, as usual, gimp some armies and not others with forcing minimum sizes other than in certain cases. I get the point, but the minimum size for Army A might be way better than min size for Army B.

What a shame, I was really really hoping this would be the new hotness. I hate 2k point games. Also if I recall isn't it on some weird size board too, rather than the expected 4x4 table?

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/06/12 14:19:15


- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in ie
Virulent Space Marine dedicated to Nurgle






Wayniac wrote:
Just like Skirmish which was an amazing idea done so poorly as to be nearly unplayable


What happened with Skirmish?

 
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant




Tampa, FL

 nurgle5 wrote:
Wayniac wrote:
Just like Skirmish which was an amazing idea done so poorly as to be nearly unplayable


What happened with Skirmish?
Completely busted out of the door. Within minutes (of the original booklet) people were figuring out how to game the missions, including a way to win one of them in one round, prevent your opponent from winning another (like not normal trying to win, I mean gaming the scenario so it was impossible for your opponent to win), no summoning gimps armies, things like that.

It was an amazing idea and executed so horribly.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/12 16:11:02


- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in us
Mighty Chosen Warrior of Chaos





The Wastes of Krieg

I don't like the concept. Just play 1000 points without restrictions.
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





Playing without restrictions is open play, which is also a format. Matched play restrictions and matched play in general is supposed to be about a "balanced play experience" which unrestricted play is the farthest from.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/13 02:02:43


GW points don't bring balance. They exist purely for structure. You can get more balance from no points than you do from GW points. You however can get no structure in your game without points. 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins




Morathi can go into the spearhead.

2500pts
2500
3000


 
   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

played two games based on the articles and YouTube reviews of the GHB. Both games were close. We didn't make optimized armies but I suspect as long as you and your opponent are on the same page in terms of how optimized to make the army it should be fine.

Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better. 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

Watched the Twitch feed today where they were discussing the General's Handbook with Jervis Johnson and Sam Pearson. It looks like summoning will be unchanged for Meeting Engagements. Jervis feels that the shorter games (four battle rounds) and smaller armies will mitigate what you'll be able to summon. We'll see...

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





*laughs in FEC*

GW points don't bring balance. They exist purely for structure. You can get more balance from no points than you do from GW points. You however can get no structure in your game without points. 
   
Made in us
Numberless Necron Warrior




Wilton, CT

No reserves?
   
 
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