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Stormatious wrote: Is he supposed to be as big as he is as a model compared to a marine?
Cheers.
Yes.
What people don't realise is the original Abaddon model was HUGE compared to the Terminators and SMs of its time - the problem is that when the Terminators were scaled up in 4th edition, he wasn't so got progressively smaller and smaller as SMs and Terminators got larger and larger.
He was a little bigger, but not that much bigger. Compare the models at the feet, I raised my Abaddon up on some plasticard to make him look more "current", but he's not that much bigger than the 2nd Ed Terminator beside him.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/16 19:46:11
Quasistellar wrote: It’s correct in the sense that the model is awesome and he’s the biggest non Primarch human.
The scale in 40k isn’t anything close to true scale. For example, rhinos are way too small. In fact just about every space marine vehicle with transport capacity is too small.
They’re gaming models, not archival blueprints of stuff. People get too caught up with scale. I’m more concerned with the model looking cool and not having weird and ugly proportions.
I'm concerned about the army looking cool, most of all. Imo it looks less cool when it looks less believable, and Abaddons scale is just absurd to me.
Same with Guilliman. I don't like the scale of the non-daemon Primarchs in general. Magnus is super cool though, I have no problem with the Daemon Primarchs being absolute monsters.
Ishagu wrote: If scale is one of your top priorities you picked the wrong wargame. Scale has never been accurate at any point in any edition.
Depends on what models you're looking at. 2nd ed Abaddon next to 2nd ed Terminators looks great.
Yes, and in the same edition we had tiny, clown car Rhinos that apparently fit 10 Astartes.
Concessions are made for certain larger models, and vehicle scale is often built around presentation and playability. Additionally, the original Rhino was released in the RTB01 era, so it was scaled for smaller passengers. Nor is this about exacting 1:1 "accuracy", it's about consistency between "like" models in a given range. Abaddon is a Terminator, how does he look next to other Terminators? In 2nd, he was slightly larger than his contemporaries. Current model is stupid-big. He doesn't even fit with his expected cohorts, looking totally out of place in his own army, imo.
2019/07/19 07:50:18
Subject: Re:Is abaddon's newest model scale correct?
Jidmah wrote: I don't get why you have a problem with that. The novels clearly tell us multiple times that this is actually how tall Ezekyle Abaddon is, even before Horus even started doubting the emperor. I'm pretty sure that there was a scene where the Justaerin were trying out a new suit of Terminator armor and Abaddon didn't get one because he needed a larger one custom-made for him.
Making Abaddon the size of a terminator would be would be wrong according to the background.
Really? He's like 12 feet tall? Does he still only take up two spaces in a Land Raider? Do you need to redesign your architecture so your heroes can walk around? Are Space Marines the same as Orks and just keep getting bigger as they age? Or is Black Library perhaps full of over-exaggeration?
The "embiggening" of Black Library is dumb, and I hate that it's seeping into GWs model design.
Jidmah wrote: So you are complaining about models matching the background. Cool. Please file a complain to GW that every model should match your head-canon, and only yours.
People are taller than other people. There is no reason why space marines shouldn't be different sizes either, especially when they are drawn from different planets with different amounts of gravity.
I am a feet taller than the average person, I fail to see how its a problem that Abaddon is a feet taller than the average terminator.
A: Some background is better than other background. That should be self evident. I also get to choose what parts I like.
B: Some height differences are more acceptable than others. A tall Abaddon I have no issue with, thank you for misrepresenting my point. A 40% taller than average marine I have a problem with.
Insectum7 wrote: Some height differences are more acceptable than others. A tall Abaddon I have no issue with, thank you for misrepresenting my point. A 40% taller than average marine I have a problem with.
He is not 40% taller, neither in model, nor in lore. The model is about a head taller than the regular terminator, just like I am a head taller than most regular people. That's normal size difference.
And Abbadon isn't even the tallest of the Lunar Wolves, Tarik Torgaddon would be taller than Abbadon, if not for his top-knot.
Use your eyeballs. That model is not "a head" taller.
2019/07/19 20:19:18
Subject: Re:Is abaddon's newest model scale correct?
Crimson wrote: In any case, I don't think Abaddon is ridiculously large for a Primarch-scale guy, he is a bit taller than a Primaris. Granted, it is shame that GW didn't fully rescale the CSM to be Primaris-sized. which is a good SM size. Guilliman on the other hand is ludicrously large, and has bizarre proportions.
Agree on Guilliman, obviously disagree on Abaddon. I'm not fond of the primaris size either.
Crimson wrote: A bit more, yes. The terminator is more hunched though.
If you want to go that route, Abaddons legs are splayed. Both models could "stand" taller.
The Terminator is also behind Abaddon. They're not on the same 3D Plane/centerline. The top of the Termie Head is likely to be even with the top of Abaddon's gorget if he's pulled to the same Depth.
The image is a composite using base size to guage scale, neither model is in front of the other. It was just the image I could find. Feel free to post your own.
The image is a composite using base size to guage scale, neither model is in front of the other. It was just the image I could find. Feel free to post your own.
You took two different pictures with potentially two different Distance-To-Lens scales, tried to compare them, and you're mad someone pointed out that's not how photographic comparison works? Do you know which base the Chaos Terminator is on? Did you measure the size of the base in the photo to figure out what % the Terminator has been shrunk/enlarged? Then do the same thing with Abaddon who may have more Zoom to show off more detail, in addition to having a shorter distance-to-lens?
Put this another way- you're not comparing known quantity/quality. That Terminator is probably on a 40mm base. Probably. But it could be zoomed out so the base is only 30mm on the screen because it was part of a unit photo. Or that's where the zoom on the camera was from the last photo. Meanwhile, the Abaddon base is probably officially a 60mm base. But it could be zoomed in for selling the detail on the sculpt so it's 90 mm across. This would result in an image of a Terminator 75% of it's actual height being compared to Abaddon 150% of his actual height. Playing with zoom is an easy way to throw this off, playing with distance to lens and camera angle is how Peter Jackson make Elijah Wood look like a hobbit.
A: They're obviously the stock GW images, and thus on their respective stock bases. The author of the image presumably measured their ratios to do the composite, as accuracy was what they were after.
B: I'm not mad. I'm shocked you couldn't see the obvious. There are clear cutout lines in the image and you're talking about one model being "behind" the other.
B2: Given the above, I'm less shocked that you cant tell these are GW stock images of the models, straight off their website, and thus are making claims about "unknown quantities".
C: If you don't accept the image, post your own as I've invited multiple times. Aka, Put up or shut up.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/20 11:08:48
Well my take on it was always that at least on the older kit, the Rhinos had running boards and those bars on the top, so even if you figured only 4 guys could fit in the tank, another 6 could hang on the outside to get where they gotta go. I think theres even a couple beakies built for it.
I also think the tank scales are pretty deceptive. If you look at a model and determine that one inch is roughly 6 ft, most 40k tanks are absolutely massive compared to their real world counterparts. The modern Rhino kit comes to ~10 feet tall and 28 feet long. An Abrams tank is 8 feet tall and 26 feet long. Like, that little marine APC is bigger than a real MBT. If the model was designed less for aesthetics and more for function, I think it'd be trivial to pack 10 Space Marines into that volume, with hardware.
A: They're obviously the stock GW images, and thus on their respective stock bases. The author of the image presumably measured their ratios to do the composite, as accuracy was what they were after.
B: I'm not mad. I'm shocked you couldn't see the obvious. There are clear cutout lines in the image and you're talking about one model being "behind" the other.
B2: Given the above, I'm less shocked that you cant tell these are GW stock images of the models, straight off their website, and thus are making claims about "unknown quantities".
C: If you don't accept the image, post your own as I've invited multiple times. Aka, Put up or shut up.
A) They are, which is why I used a stock GW photo of a Warlord Titan when I made my own composite.
B) The grey lines blended into the white background for me.
B2) Stock photos are not scientifically accurate, that's not the point - I'm shocked you didn't figure this out when I pointed out The Terminator may have been at one zoom level for the unit photo, and Abaddon may have been at another to sell the details.
C) I did post my own. Look at how much bigger Abaddon is than the Stock image of an Adeptus Titanicus Warlord Titan. Do you suppose zoom and distance to lense makes a difference now? The stock photos are zoomed to take up a given space on the webpage and provide a given sculpt detail, not to accurately convey model size.
That's true, you posted an irrelevant image while making irrelevant claims. You could have spent your time making an image that compared the base sizes to check if they were accurately in scale with one another, instead you spent your time posting something that superfluously illustrated that it could be inaccurate. And you still seem to be going down that path, for some unknown reason.
That's true, you posted an irrelevant image while making irrelevant claims. You could have spent your time making an image that compared the base sizes to check if they were accurately in scale with one another, instead you spent your time posting something that superfluously illustrated that it could be inaccurate. And you still seem to be going down that path, for some unknown reason.
You're kidding, I reposted your irrelevant image with another irrelevant image? And you still don't know the reason even after I've explained it to you several times and your response was... "I'm sure the guy who made it did all that" instead of "I never thought of that, maybe patching two different images together isn't the most scientific thing to do, does anyone have the models to put them into one photo at the same time?"? Which someone then did so we now have a relevant accurate photo while you still complain someone pointed out your Frankenstein didn't really establish anything?
Crimson wrote: A bit more, yes. The terminator is more hunched though.
If you want to go that route, Abaddons legs are splayed. Both models could "stand" taller.
The Terminator is also behind Abaddon. They're not on the same 3D Plane/centerline. The top of the Termie Head is likely to be even with the top of Abaddon's gorget if he's pulled to the same Depth.
The image is a composite using base size to guage scale, neither model is in front of the other. It was just the image I could find. Feel free to post your own.
So, let the record state:
I gave you the frame of reference used to scale the models in the image, the base size. - You could have checked against that frame of reference, but instead you post a lecture and a scaled down Warlord Titan.
I've asked for further reference multiple times in the thread. - But you now say I never invited further reference
Given the fact you couldn't tell the original was a composite in the first place, and your weird assumption that the stock GW images wouldn't have the models on their respective stock GW bases to be used for size comparison. . . you're at least 0 for 4 by now.
I would suggest that instead of ignoring what is written, assuming incompetence and going on some tirade, you do a little deductive reasoning and research first.
