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Made in us
Been Around the Block





Hi there.

Just as the title says, I'm thinking about getting into this particular wargame. Maybe not right away, but somewhere down the line. I've heard through the grapevine that Cygnar, Khador and the Trollbloods are the most newbie friendly factions in the game. Out of those three factions I just mentioned, Khador appeals to me the most, since red is my favorite color and I hear they have a great selection of infantry. Trollbloods come in second place for me because I love the Scottish Orc vibes that they give off. Though I am open to suggestions if those factions allow you to field more troops than the usual Warmahordes army can.

Thank you and have a good day.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Baltimore, MD

Make sure it's still played locally. While the game shows signs of rebounding, it crashed hard in 2015-2016.

the game has a punishing learning curve. It can be fun, but it's a game with turn independent win conditions, so games can end fast if you make errors.

My Painted Armies
: Co. B, 37th Praetorian IG: 11,000pts
Cygnar: 350pts
KOW Ogres: 4500 points
Loyalist Emperor's Children: 2500 points 
   
Made in ca
Boom! Leman Russ Commander





London, Ontario

Hi there!

I enjoy WMH. Unfortunately I wasn’t able to swing my garage gaming buddies to the system, they feel “committed” to 40k.

I haven’t played a game in a year-ish. While I have a gaming store nearby with a reasonably strong group that plays Friday nights, I’d rather spend my “night out” with my long-time friends, even if I play games I enjoy less.

So while I really enjoy the game, I have few opportunities to prioritize it, and I feel like it’s a game you need to stay on top of or you fall behind. I think it takes more of a commitment to get / stay good than other games I’ve played. Which might suit you, but takes too much of a commitment for me to stay “into”.

Anyhow, I hope you are able to find a group to game with!
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




My advice as a long term WM/H player is to use the WM/H FB pages as all the official talk happens there. Don't come to DakkaDakka for anything WM/H related.

Look for the following groups on FB:

Warmachine and Hordes General.
Privateer Press
Warmachine and Hordes (you country or state) - to find your local metas

Have fun!!
   
Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman




Illinois

Unless you have a healthy local meta don't. The game has crashed hard and is dead in a lot of places it used to thrive. I literally just threw models away since you can't give them away and it's not worth the money to ship them. If you'r determined to anyway I would expect big changes to the game in the future if PP wants to remain solvent.
   
Made in us
Dangerous Outrider






I am going to have to agree with most posters that look at your local area. Finding opponents might be a big problem. In my area WM/H was the largest game in a number of shops being played more than GW stuff. Now the most I have seen go away except for one shop that has about six players
at three tables playing at one time..That's because the organizer always gives out prizes..no matter what kind of game is being played and don't matter how many show up to play.

With that.. Also look at the faction play style.. I was Khador back in the day because it matched my play style and I liked the miniatures. Watch YouTube videos to get ideas on list builds and tactics, but again the WM/H players I still know are very "curb stompy"

 
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




Welcome! Khador is a fun faction. Honestly, though, I wouldn’t be concerned with which faction is the easiest for newbies because aside from a couple (Grymkin, Infernals, Convergence), they all have similar base rules. As such, if there is a faction outside of those three that appeals to you, I would go for that.

Checking your local community to see if there are other people playing is always a good idea. You also might be able to find deals from a local selling his army to get started quickly. However, you can also try to build a community if you either don’t have a large community locally, or your local crowd isn’t to your taste, but that is harder.

The game did have some serious hiccups in the transition to Mk.III and lost a lot of players with a mishandled edition change, but it is in a pretty good state right now and upcoming releases are super exciting. I would say the game itself, just from a rules perspective, is in a great place and promises to get better very soon.

Also, I don’t want to discourage you, but Oblivion, a new campaign setting and rule book, is coming out very soon, so I would maybe just start with a battlebox and hold off on too many additional purchases until Oblivion drops. It is going to really open up theme lists, which are the road maps to building your armies.

Finally, I would see if there is someone you know that is also interested in getting into the game. I’ve done the tournament thing, playing 75 point steamrollers and trying to stay ahead of the meta, but right now I’m getting a coworker into the game and I’m enjoying the game much more playing 35 point games with him than I did doing tournament play.

Also, dakka isn’t really the place to talk about WMH. There are some Facebook groups, subreddits, and forums specific to Warmachine, but to be honest, a lot of the Warmachine internet can be very salty and make you miserable.
   
Made in no
Regular Dakkanaut




I would only invest into warmahordes If you have friends already playing or there is a strong local community. The game seems to be in a downspiral with less players and PP is using more time on other new lines.

I would not choose cygnar unless you really like their models, because:

1. Its not a newbie friendly faction. Its in a weird place with combined force and good casters, but lack good spammable infantry/warjacks.

2. Its one of the weakest faction at the moment

3. A lot of the players/community hate cygnar ( a left over from mark.2 when control casters and shooting trolled everyone)
   
Made in us
Member of the Ethereal Council




USA

For those of us under a rock, what happened? I remember the game doing great a few years ago, but I've definitely seen a drop off of players. Never really thought about it before.

   
Made in us
Second Story Man




Astonished of Heck

 LordofHats wrote:
For those of us under a rock, what happened? I remember the game doing great a few years ago, but I've definitely seen a drop off of players. Never really thought about it before.

An accumulation of an edition change, focus on Themes for army building, the CID testing process, AoS becoming workable, 40K becoming simpler, and a certain penchant for aggressive tournament-only types to begin dominating metas. A lot depends on the individuals.

Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





The only community turned toxic and self destructive more than anything. I've honestly never seen a group so consistently react so extremely negative towards change, but I think a lot of it was just that a lot of people had been burning themselves out for years and saw the opportunity to get out.
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




So, I thought it was important to counter some of the negative sentiment towards Warmachine in this thread, just because if someone is excited to get into the game, bombarding him with reasons not to may not be helping.

First, checking to see if there is an existing local community, or if you have like-minded friends who are interested in getting into it with you, is a good idea for any miniatures game, not just Warmachine. None of us can really help you on that front.

Yes, there were issues and Warmachine has taken a hit. Some of that was of their own doing, while some of it had to do with the resurgence of their competitors.

The launch of the new edition was not done well, but the game has improved a lot since then to the point where I would argue that from a strict rules perspective, it’s the best it has ever been. Far better than it was in Mk.II where you were sold a game about big stompy robots and then pushed to play infantrymachine.

The negative reputation that Mk.III got had to do with a few things. First, there is the usual “they changed it so it sucks now” you get from a vocal portion of the player base when you have any edition change in any game. Second, there were lots of issues at launch with balance and rules not working properly, so they had to fix those. Third, there were also issues with supply, with people not getting their new battleboxes in release. Finally, some people thought they were hot poop because they were playing an army probably 25% above the average power curve. When the rules changed and they were now 10% below the curve, suddenly balance became a huge problem for them, even though as a whole (aside from a few outliers that were broken from the get-go and eventually got fixed) balance was overall a lot better.

As for the focus on themes, that actually changed drastically only a few hours ago with a massive theme update, changing the building blocks of how the “free points” in themes work. Themes still have model restrictions, but this opened up a lot of army builds so it is no longer about chasing free points.

CID, their public beta-testing process, is also slowing down, with PP reducing the pace of CID and spreading their new released for Warmachine out more as they have to intersperse them with MonPoc and Riot Quest releases. As for PP spending more time on other lines like MonPoc and Riot Quest, I actually think that is a good thing. It is good for PP to have additional revenue streams beyond Warmachine, and since a lot of the community has identified the pace of change as being too fast, interspersing new WMH stuff with MonPoc and Riot Quest can help out on that front. Plus, there is some crossover between RQ and WMH models.

Now, as for the issues with overly toxic, competitive communities, I actually agree with a lot of that. Most of the WMH internet is cancerous, and a lot of local communities have a single-minded focus on competitive play. However, if you can find people who are willing to do things differently (and there is some appetite for that out there, IMHO), you don’t have to play WMH competitively in 75 point Steamroller tournament hard no-takebacks mode on mousepad terrain with unpainted proxy models. I’ve been getting a coworker into the game lately, and I’ve been having way more fun playing 35 point games with him and with a couple others in a “basement meta” than I ever did playing in competitive tournaments. We are all very much psyched for the campaign and narrative content in the upcoming Oblivion release.

So, there are definitely good things about the game, and rumours of PP’s impending death are greatly exaggerated – they are likely down from their high point, but they just moved their office and they have a lot of future releases on the horizon, so I don’t think they are planning on shutting down.
If you like steampunk combat, like the rules, and have some people to play with who aren't toxic, try it out!
   
Made in us
Second Story Man




Astonished of Heck

As a side note, they will be introducing a future version of Warmachine sometime next year. It is currently called Warcaster: Neo-Mekanika which is to be based 5000 years in Warmachine's future.

Aside from a noted lack of magic and the known worlds falling out resources, there is little else known about this new game of theirs, story-wise. Game-wise, it is to be a bit smaller, with units being 3-5 models instead of the 3-15 currently, and there will be some ability to loadout warcasters and 'jacks 40K style.

I don't think it will kill WarmaHordes anytime soon (we'll see after launch and after their first revision), so it wouldn't hurt if you have a good local group and like a set of models..

Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
 
   
Made in us
Cog in the Machine




 K9ofChaos wrote:
Hi there.

Just as the title says, I'm thinking about getting into this particular wargame. Maybe not right away, but somewhere down the line. I've heard through the grapevine that Cygnar, Khador and the Trollbloods are the most newbie friendly factions in the game. Out of those three factions I just mentioned, Khador appeals to me the most, since red is my favorite color and I hear they have a great selection of infantry. Trollbloods come in second place for me because I love the Scottish Orc vibes that they give off. Though I am open to suggestions if those factions allow you to field more troops than the usual Warmahordes army can.

Thank you and have a good day.


You heard correctly Cygnar, Khador and Trollbloods are good starter armies for Warmachine/Hordes. They are pretty straightforward play without a lot to keep track off tactically. Most difficult would be Grymkin, and Infernals when it comes down to tracking all the rule machinery thats in the background.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sunno wrote:
My advice as a long term WM/H player is to use the WM/H FB pages as all the official talk happens there. Don't come to DakkaDakka for anything WM/H related.

Look for the following groups on FB:

Warmachine and Hordes General.
Privateer Press
Warmachine and Hordes (you country or state) - to find your local metas

Have fun!!


True, that is like going to BoLS for non-GW related news. Good luck!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Genoside07 wrote:
I am going to have to agree with most posters that look at your local area. Finding opponents might be a big problem. In my area WM/H was the largest game in a number of shops being played more than GW stuff. Now the most I have seen go away except for one shop that has about six players
at three tables playing at one time..That's because the organizer always gives out prizes..no matter what kind of game is being played and don't matter how many show up to play.

With that.. Also look at the faction play style.. I was Khador back in the day because it matched my play style and I liked the miniatures. Watch YouTube videos to get ideas on list builds and tactics, but again the WM/H players I still know are very "curb stompy"


Maybe, when I started playing warmachine back in the day, we didn't go to a shop and play. We were just buds who met up and painted/played together from a friends house. Home groups are a thing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 LunarSol wrote:
The only community turned toxic and self destructive more than anything. I've honestly never seen a group so consistently react so extremely negative towards change, but I think a lot of it was just that a lot of people had been burning themselves out for years and saw the opportunity to get out.


This is true. When Warhammer had a player dip, I could understand it. The core rules were essentially table flipped and while AoS has recovered it really has drawn a lot of players who got into 8th and then dropped 8th for AoS. Players who were hard rank and file have moved to other pastures.

With Warmachine/Hordes, I have never seen so much upset over so little changes over core rules.

I can see upset over unit specific rules, in which there were a lot of changes, but CID fixed a lot of that. I think you hit the nail on the head LunarSol, most of the toxicity is coming from burnt out players who feel it necessary to express their trauma into the world instead of just saying "I feel like taking a break and trying something else".

Which is still strange to me. I play different games for this reason, from O.G.R.E. to Shadespire and I really don't feel the necessity to trash one game and exalt another just because I am taking a break.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/08/13 14:53:32


 
   
Made in ro
Storm Trooper with Maglight





 LordofHats wrote:
For those of us under a rock, what happened? I remember the game doing great a few years ago, but I've definitely seen a drop off of players. Never really thought about it before.

It was 'trendy' to get into 40k again.

For all people say it was due to PP's decision making... yes, that certainly didn't help, but do people really think they upped and went back to GW because they produce better rules? Of course not, but the 2013-2015 exodus to other systems was always a temporary separation. 90% of wargamers have too much time, effort and money wrapped up into 40k, coupled with it consistently being a 'safe bet' (for that reason), that people flocked back.

Every other wargame that saw a surge in popularity - Malifaux, Infinity, King of War etc - have also seen a large dropoff and all these other companies didn't just synchronise to blow their feet off at the same time.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/20 16:03:32


 
   
Made in ca
Boom! Leman Russ Commander





London, Ontario

GW put a momentary pause on rules bloat, and *obvious* haves and have-nots with the indexes. That was my key issue with 7th edition, and why I came back.

They also did a good job of leveling the rules by eliminating "unit types" and making Vehicles and Monstrous creatures play by the same rules. For me, that was a quality of life improvement.

They've made an effort towards ongoing balance issues, even if that's just to shake the meta up once a year and create new purchases. (Cynical!)


For myself, that Silver Age has become tarnished. Constant release of "optional" rules that nobody really treats as optional. So many "paid" updates that feel like being charged for the "proof read" copy of a book already paid for.

That simultaneous feeling of being force-fed and milked at the same has put me off of 40k again. These days I'm running Kill Team as my go-to. Quick, fun, more tactially interesting than 40k proper. I'm not anticipating a Chapter Approved -esque book anytime soon. Maybe a $20 points update with a few new missions, maybe. Even then, Battle Scribe has been great for making lists.

I'd play WMH if I could get my gaming buddies to play. Just so happens I started up at the beginning of 3rd edition and the mass exodus that coincided with. There are people that play at the FLGS, and a healthy group at that, I just would rather play games with known friends rather than make new. Introverts unite! Then disband quickly so we can go back to our homes.
   
Made in ca
Three Color Minimum






I never played any GW games since the 90s and was never invested in WH or 40k.
Yet, I still quit WM and Hordes because of the bloated rules, and focus on themes. It had nothing to with being invested in anything else. It was more that PP was too fearful to do a hard reboot and really shake things up.
Plus MK3 was rushed, incomplete, and had poor balance. Also an anecdote, no not everyone quit because of being so 'invested' in any other games. I was fully invested in WM with 3 fully painted armies which I sold right after the new rules dropped. I was heavy invested in PP's games and I still quit regardless.

GW may not have better rules. But their games are more fun. And there I think is the crux of the problem with PP. The meta is so competitive and oriented around specific styles of game and list building, coupled with massive bloat and a plethora of 'Gotcha!' tactics that make playing it very unfun for anyone not fully invested in the games and following every change every month or so.

It became too much to keep up with, let alone play and that makes for a very unfun experience.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/08/20 16:18:59


 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Baltimore, MD

 Ghool wrote:
GW may not have better rules. But their games are more fun. And there I think is the crux of the problem with PP. The meta is so competitive and oriented around specific styles of game and list building, coupled with massive bloat and a plethora of 'Gotcha!' tactics that make playing it very unfun for anyone not fully invested in the games and following every change every month or so.

It became too much to keep up with, let alone play and that makes for a very unfun experience.


I second this, at least for myself. I threw myself into Warmachine, and built a huge army, played in tournaments and leagues... and then found myself playing less and less. Looking back, I rarely remember having fun playing Warmachine.

My Painted Armies
: Co. B, 37th Praetorian IG: 11,000pts
Cygnar: 350pts
KOW Ogres: 4500 points
Loyalist Emperor's Children: 2500 points 
   
 
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