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Made in au
Been Around the Block




I would be nice to see other armies get this level of detail.

It would give them the opportunity to provide new units and unique stuff for armies that are pretty sparse at the moment

Ork
Klanz

Eldar
Craftworlds
Corsairs/outcasts

Tau
Septs

Tyranid
Hive fleets
Genestealer cults?

Guard
Regiments
Genestealer cults?
Traitor guard

Dark Eldar
Covens
Cults
Sects


Necron
Dynasties
C'tan cults (old school necrons because we should have them represented)


Chaos marines
Obviously


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/07 01:05:05


 
   
Made in au
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Do you enjoy shelling out more money or something?

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The Wastes of Krieg

I'd love it for guard, but with it they would likely have to start making different sculpts for other regiments.
   
Made in ca
Courageous Space Marine Captain





Hoenstly, Marines are kinda underpowered this edition and everytime GW gives Marines some abilities that are supposed to help keep them compeitive everyone else screams "GIVE US THIS TOO!"
Guard for example got their own CTs, but did everyone else get guard orders? no.


Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend 
   
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Personally I doubt it. Marines are the golden goose of 40k so they always want them to be the ones leading the trend. At most they might revise them accordingly via errata or FAQ, maaaybe if a 2.0 dex comes for them. I could see them implementing the mix n match system they have in the next CA as a narrative option to test the waters first.

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Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut





It's foolish as heck.

The announcement said they would release a "pdf" later for chaos.
Which means there aint gonna be any new codexes for a while.

Buckle up kids, we're back to the "new codex whenever GW feels like it" trend.
   
Made in au
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Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Foolish to hope? No.
Foolish to expect GW to do it? Probably.

It'd be nice to get a "Build-Your-Own" set of rules for Craftworlds, Guard Regiments, Hive Fleets and the like, but I doubt we'll ever see those again.

   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





BrianDavion wrote:
Hoenstly, Marines are kinda underpowered this edition and everytime GW gives Marines some abilities that are supposed to help keep them compeitive everyone else screams "GIVE US THIS TOO!"
Guard for example got their own CTs, but did everyone else get guard orders? no.



Guard got the original CT's first back in 4th edition.

But as far as it goes, Space Marines have far more access to buff auras then guard.
   
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Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.
   
Made in ca
Courageous Space Marine Captain





the_scotsman wrote:
Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.


wait are you saying GW will only release stuff they can make money off?! THE HORROR!

GW is a busniess not a charity, of course they're going to focus on what makes them money

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend 
   
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the_scotsman wrote:
Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.


Or it's busieess as usual and it is start of new round of codexes as usual for gw so expect net codexes for all. Style of codexes changing is also nothing new

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Regular Dakkanaut





tneva82 wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.


Or it's busieess as usual and it is start of new round of codexes as usual for gw so expect net codexes for all. Style of codexes changing is also nothing new


See:

It's foolish as heck.

The announcement said they would release a "pdf" later for chaos.
Which means there aint gonna be any new codexes for a while.

Buckle up kids, we're back to the "new codex whenever GW feels like it" trend.
   
Made in au
Been Around the Block




Why do they bother with non marine armies at all?

Their neglect of those armies is going to be a factor in their popularity.

There are more primaris Lieutenant models that entire character model ranges for some armies.

If they don't give their products a more equal representation then the quality of the community suffers. Marines can't purge xenos when no one is buying them.

Their customers make a choice what to get, it's not a consolation prize to play as xenos. People don't play Eldar or tau because they love to be ignored and neglected in their hobby.

They sell it as a wargame, not a board game like space Hulk where you swap sides to determine who can space marine best.







   
Made in us
Awesome Autarch






That's been the chicken-and-egg conundrum for nigh on two decades though. Marines outsell other armies by an almost exponential factor. However, they also get more kits, and more releases, and have more armies making use of their model line. So which comes first?

I say this as an Eldar player who has an entire 8th edition army built from 2nd edition metal miniatures because their current finecast models are gak. I have a wave of Eldar tanks which were first cast in 1997. The leader of my army is from 1993. My "new" units are from around 2009 or so. Having said that, the future of Craftworld Eldar is irrelevant to me. I've no interest in paying $50-60 for new Eldar infantry boxes.

I'm happy for Marine players. As some of my buddies have started collecting Primaris I've continually warned them to not stockpile anything. As a marine player you can be guaranteed 5-6 kits per year, minimum. That's a good place to be - but it also means more players, and new players are quickly drawn to marines.

 
   
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Confessor Of Sins




No. It's stupid and I hate they're even doing it for marines. Like we need 500 varieties of Ork armies to keep track of.

2500pts
2500
3000


 
   
Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut





ERJAK wrote:
No. It's stupid and I hate they're even doing it for marines. Like we need 500 varieties of Ork armies to keep track of.

Oath we do.

Or at least we need a "Build a nob boss" ruleset.
Now THAT could have some hilarious gak in it.
   
Made in gb
Savage Khorne Berserker Biker




Southampton, UK

 Eonfuzz wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.


Or it's busieess as usual and it is start of new round of codexes as usual for gw so expect net codexes for all. Style of codexes changing is also nothing new


See:

It's foolish as heck.

The announcement said they would release a "pdf" later for chaos.
Which means there aint gonna be any new codexes for a while.

Buckle up kids, we're back to the "new codex whenever GW feels like it" trend.


Chaos have just had their second codex for this edition, do you not think a third might be taking the piss?
   
Made in se
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Sweden

Actually I think no. This is only because sales wise it would take up too much shelf space in their stores.
   
Made in au
Dakka Veteran




I think a quality Eldar book, with a single model for each of the craftworlds would be good. And corsairs as the addon. But the craftworlds really only need like 5 pages each at most.
I think its just put the effort in that a $70 book should have and its good, But its GW so i mean expect little and be surprised when its at least avg is the best way to go
   
Made in au
Been Around the Block




Apple fox wrote:
I think a quality Eldar book, with a single model for each of the craftworlds would be good. And corsairs as the addon. But the craftworlds really only need like 5 pages each at most.
I think its just put the effort in that a $70 book should have and its good, But its GW so i mean expect little and be surprised when its at least avg is the best way to go



This isn't aimed at you, but I really get tired of the "xenos only need a little bit" perception.

Like, no. Iyanden has a history longer than a marine chapter, with a greater scope for story simply because of its size - it rolls fleet, guard and marine stories all in one. Every craftworld, hive fleet, Klan, or Sept has that kind of capacity. A marine chapter covers 1000 dudes, who by plain numbers cannot generate as many stories as a craftworld.

If you can squirt out 90 pages of white scar background, most of which will be completely new made up at the pub, then you can damn well do the same for everyone else.


It's not that hard and it's a matter of respect for your customers.

You think that playing Orks means people don't want 300+ pages of new background to read, characters to buy or rules to use?

What is it about playing non marines that somehow changes the economics of customer satisfaction or expectation?


IMO it's actually false advertising. If they want to clearly show that they don't support some customers over others, then they should completely rebrand xenos armies.

They could call it space marine 40k, where EVERY customer chooses their chapter. You then get xenos armies as NPC packs to use when your buddies want to kill stuff and you take control of them.

But the clear message is "YOU are marines, when you play xenos you are taking on the role of badguys for your buddies to kill - then swap so you can have fun".

If it was sold like that then I'd have no issues, is very clear what the game is.

But40k is currently sold as a wargame where every army is supposedly equal choice where you can PC the army. Except when it comes to being supported by the company.

Imagine buying a car where it turned out ford only made spare parts for its SUVs and you'd bought a sedan - but they didn't tell you you'd get no support when you bought it.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/08/07 06:23:37


 
   
Made in au
Dakka Veteran




Hellebore wrote:
Apple fox wrote:
I think a quality Eldar book, with a single model for each of the craftworlds would be good. And corsairs as the addon. But the craftworlds really only need like 5 pages each at most.
I think its just put the effort in that a $70 book should have and its good, But its GW so i mean expect little and be surprised when its at least avg is the best way to go



This isn't aimed at you, but I really get tired of the "xenos only need a little bit" perception.

Like, no. Iyanden has a history longer than a marine chapter, with a greater scope for story simply because of its size - it rolls fleet, guard and marine stories all in one. Every craftworld, hive fleet, Klan, or Sept has that kind of capacity. A marine chapter covers 1000 dudes, who by plain numbers cannot generate as many stories as a craftworld.

If you can squirt out 90 pages of white scar background, most of which will be completely new made up at the pub, then you can damn well do the same for everyone else.


It's not that hard and it's a matter of respect for your customers.

You think that playing Orks means people don't want 300+ pages of new background to read, characters to buy or rules to use?

What is it about playing non marines that somehow changes the economics of customer satisfaction or expectation?


Honestly i mostly referring to the rules, And honestly i would prefer if GW just did not write anything new about Iyanden. The last book was awful and one of the reasons i Stopped Reading GW stuff for the most part D: Effort is good, The issue is they do just Squirt it out so often. No care or love for so much of the setting, if they wont do it right i would rather them not do it.
Its the reason we probably at this place with Space marines. Hot mess with no clear future for them or the game.
   
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Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot





Actually, isn't it about time they release 9th? Forcing everyone to buy new Core rules and "Temp" army books to tide people over until the next wave of Codices is released at $50 US per.

Not that I want to see that but it is standard GW practice. An edition only seems valid for 2-3 years and then you either buy new books or quit.

As for the OP. I'd like to see a Craftworld Eldar book like we had in 3rd ed, where the "big 5" craftworlds did have different force structures. GW could do this for xenos armies if they really wanted to. They have the sale numbers; they could experiment. Print something like the 3rd ed. Craftworld Eldar book for whatever xeno species sells the best. See how that effects sales numbers over a year's time. Unlikely to happen though.

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Crispy78 wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Tldr: yes it is.

With the second space marine release we gave reached Late Stage Edition. Any new rules feature from here on out will be a cash grab, and will only be aimed at factions they think they can grab cash from.

Expect a lot of marine stuff.


Or it's busieess as usual and it is start of new round of codexes as usual for gw so expect net codexes for all. Style of codexes changing is also nothing new


See:

It's foolish as heck.

The announcement said they would release a "pdf" later for chaos.
Which means there aint gonna be any new codexes for a while.

Buckle up kids, we're back to the "new codex whenever GW feels like it" trend.


Chaos have just had their second codex for this edition, do you not think a third might be taking the piss?


Considering the contents of dex2.0 which in reality is just shadowspear + termites + nerf cultists , (1.1) a 3rd one with legion trait changes would and could work.
However alot of csm players are not to thrilled, too much investment into rules allready.

Also the article stated that they along side the special chapters get shock assault, not reworked traits.


Honestly, i wouldn't be surprised if csm also will get supplements in the long run.
I also would not be surprised if nothing happens.

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What is it about playing non marines that somehow changes the economics of customer satisfaction or expectation?


Marines account for 60% of games workshop total sales.

it's like this, coca cola produces both Coke and Barqs rootbeer. Barqs is avaliable in 4 varities, regular, diet, cream soda and diet cream soda. (I don't think I've ever seen Barqs cream soda mind you)
meanwhile there's some 20 odd coke products.

now as a Barqs guy I don't complain about the varity differance because I get it, Coke outsells the other drinks in coca cola's portfolip and is the flagship brand.

Same applies here, Mariens are a big eneugh seller that niche products for marines are economicly viable, that may not be the case for other armies however

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/07 07:20:05


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Holy Terra

I actually wouldn't be too surprised if some factions did follow this formula eventually.

It's certainly possible with Eldar, Orks, Chaos Marines and Guard. It wouldn't work for every codex, however.

Also I doubt some factions would shift as many book sales. How many people would actually buy the Guard book for some less popular regiment? Maybe lots, maybe few.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/07 07:37:58


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I think every faction should get the "build your own" included in the main codex. It doesn't seem like it's hard to do, and shouldn't take up too many pages. However, I don't think every faction would need its own supplements. Unless you wanted to do like "Codex Eldar" and "Supplement Craftworld" "Supplement Harlequin" "Supplement Drukhari" or "Codex Tau" "Supplement Septs (all of them in one book)" "Supplement auxiliaries"
   
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Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Eonfuzz wrote:


The announcement said they would release a "pdf" later for chaos.
Which means there aint gonna be any new codexes for a while.

Buckle up kids, we're back to the "new codex whenever GW feels like it" trend.


Ummmm...all it means is chaos isn't going to be getting new codex any time soon. Did the GW stop making new codexes before when they changed style just because codex was released short time before? No. All it means that previously released codex isn't redone in next months.

See this is nothing GW hasn't done before. This follows existing GW release trends perfectly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Ancestral Hamster wrote:
Actually, isn't it about time they release 9th? Forcing everyone to buy new Core rules and "Temp" army books to tide people over until the next wave of Codices is released at $50 US per.

Not that I want to see that but it is standard GW practice. An edition only seems valid for 2-3 years and then you either buy new books or quit..


Eh the "temp army books" thing has happened in 40k in 2nd ed(well there were no codexes to begin with), 3rd ed(came in rulebook itself) and 8th ed. Other than that new editions have used previous codexes with new codexes coming up replacing older ones at random pattern, sometimes faction getting 2 codexes within edition.

Also it used to be edition more like every 4th year but yeah gw has sped up and yes 9th will be likely coming out sooner rather than later(next year good bet) but odds are it's more like 4-7th so old codexes will still be legal(though likely bit off compared to new 9th ed style which will follow in suit)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/07 09:30:44


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I can see specific ones getting a supplement. Farsight enclaves comes to mind. I can't see every single faction getting one that'd be a bit much. But marines are definitely a test to see how it works, as well as most likely to find out how big of a base these other chapters have for model sculpts
   
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BrianDavion wrote:
What is it about playing non marines that somehow changes the economics of customer satisfaction or expectation?


Marines account for 60% of games workshop total sales.

it's like this, coca cola produces both Coke and Barqs rootbeer. Barqs is avaliable in 4 varities, regular, diet, cream soda and diet cream soda. (I don't think I've ever seen Barqs cream soda mind you)
meanwhile there's some 20 odd coke products.

now as a Barqs guy I don't complain about the varity differance because I get it, Coke outsells the other drinks in coca cola's portfolip and is the flagship brand.

Same applies here, Mariens are a big eneugh seller that niche products for marines are economicly viable, that may not be the case for other armies however


where is the 60% figure coming from? I do not doubt space marines out perform every single faction, but would be very surprised if it was as high as 60% ( less surprised if it is including chaos and vanilla marines in one)

10000 points 7000
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5000
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2000
 
   
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 G00fySmiley wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
What is it about playing non marines that somehow changes the economics of customer satisfaction or expectation?


Marines account for 60% of games workshop total sales.

it's like this, coca cola produces both Coke and Barqs rootbeer. Barqs is avaliable in 4 varities, regular, diet, cream soda and diet cream soda. (I don't think I've ever seen Barqs cream soda mind you)
meanwhile there's some 20 odd coke products.

now as a Barqs guy I don't complain about the varity differance because I get it, Coke outsells the other drinks in coca cola's portfolip and is the flagship brand.

Same applies here, Mariens are a big eneugh seller that niche products for marines are economicly viable, that may not be the case for other armies however


where is the 60% figure coming from? I do not doubt space marines out perform every single faction, but would be very surprised if it was as high as 60% ( less surprised if it is including chaos and vanilla marines in one)

And even if it does, what part of gakking over 40% of your customers makes for good economics?

Not that GW's economics was what Hellibore was talking about, Brian seems to have deliberatly misconstrued things there.
   
 
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