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Ok I want to try having a mature and informed discussion about hemp, not marijuana. Hemp contains so little THC it's basically impossible to use it as a drug.

I have heard hemp produces paper faster than wood based plants, produces useful fabric faster and for far less water than cotten and produces more oxygen per acre than trees. Its advocates tout a laundry list of benefits to industrial use of hemp and do emphasize people will not be "getting high" on it.

There are claims it can make plastic sthat are as useful as any petroleum based plastic and far more eco friendly to make and use.

Personally I favor its use in industry as I believe its banning in america was foolish and a hysterical kneejerk reaction to "reefer madness", the overhyped fear of marijuana created by ignorant alarmists in the 1920s

I'm interested in what real people, not organizations with a vested interest in the matter, have to say here.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here is an article from a site that has a clear bias in he matter, but having a bias does not automatically make an advocate of a position a liar.

https://www.treehugger.com/environmental-policy/perfect-plant-7-great-uses-for-industrial-hemp.html

The bottom line with those that oppose hemp seems to bve "But think of the children who will get high on it and have their lives ruined!!! "

Iv heard that its super useful for making fibers and ropes, im sure it has very good applications in paper and paper packaging, but once start adding all these other "super" benefits its starts sounding over hyped

not saying the benefits are unfounded or anything though.



also i highly doubt anyone really cares about the children and hemp drugs anymore. family guy touched on it but its probably some flavor of industry that is lobbying to keep certain things banned as a way to protect their interests at the expense of the environment which was pretty on par at the time. its possible that attitude has shifted a little bit and just proving the profitability of hemp may actually persuade companies and the government to looking into it. (but that's my tinfoil hat theory)

I'm willing to see and evaluate whatever evidence the advocates of these claims have to offer. If they can produce a piece of hempcrete or hemp plastic and demonstrate itcs usefulness I would be willing to accept it


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Desubot wrote:
Iv heard that its super useful for making fibers and ropes, im sure it has very good applications in paper and paper packaging, but once start adding all these other "super" benefits its starts sounding over hyped

not saying the benefits are unfounded or anything though.



also i highly doubt anyone really cares about the children and hemp drugs anymore. family guy touched on it but its probably some flavor of industry that is lobbying to keep certain things banned as a way to protect their interests at the expense of the environment which was pretty on par at the time. its possible that attitude has shifted a little bit and just proving the profitability of hemp may actually persuade companies and the government to looking into it. (but that's my tinfoil hat theory)

I see nothing unreasonable about your post. The only unreasonable aspect here is the short sighted foolish greed and selfishness of those who are willing to destroy the ecology they and their descendants need to survive for short term material gain.

 Desubot wrote:
Iv heard that its super useful for making fibers and ropes, im sure it has very good applications in paper and paper packaging, but once start adding all these other "super" benefits its starts sounding over hyped

Same here.

I'm ok with Hemp being a legal crop. It has no realistic use as a recreational drug. The only issue it has is it can be tough to distinguish it from the actual drug producing strains. I'm also ok with actual weed being legal, though heavily regulated. IE: If you use it medically, you can only get it from a Pharmacy, not grow it yourself or from a 'dispensary'. If it is legalized recreationally, it should be heavily taxed and only licensed growers allowed to produce it. No home growing, no self-medication, zero tolerance on driving under the influence or for use by minors. All taxes from it would support rehab programs and fund research into the problems of smoking it. We're just now realizing that weed actually has some very bad, if subtle, effects on the body.

Hemp has a lot of good profitable uses that should be exploited. We just need to take steps to ensure anybody growing it is only growing hemp.

Does anyone know what sort of restrictions there are on growing tobacco? Seems relevant to the discussion.

Far as I can find, there are no restrictions on growing tobacco at the federal level. Local laws regulating gardening may have prohibitions or restrictions on growing tobacco. However, if you sell any quantity of tobacco you are subject to a slew of federal, state, and local laws. Namely collection of taxes and making sure you aren't selling to minors. Because of the high taxes, there is a large illegal tobacco industry in the US. Both importation and domestic production.

However, unlike tobacco, marijuana is a hallucinogen that also causes brain damage, and is not properly studied so we don't know what other long term issues it can cause might be. The main danger from cigarettes specifically is the nasty chemicals that commercial cigarettes contain. If someone is smoking pure unprocessed tobacco, as a home grower would be doing, the danger is significantly less, though it is still a long term cancer and addiction issue. Tobacco is well documented and has known issues which don't necessarily make someone growing it a threat. Marijuana is not the same.

I've always found it amusing.

Alcohol, despite it's myriad known addiction and health problems and very limited health benefits, is legal. Tobacco, despite it's myriand known addiction and health problems and no known health benefits, is legal. Pot, despite it's known health benefits and as-yet unproven health problems... is not.

And if you're going to tell me pot being a) addictive, and b) having unknown health complications, are overwhelming problems preventing it being legalized even for properly supervised health care uses, let me introduce you to the modern opiod crisis....

Closest thing might be alcohol. which doesn't prohibit home brewers but it is still heavily regulated.

 Vulcan wrote:
I've always found it amusing.

Alcohol, despite it's myriad known addiction and health problems and very limited health benefits, is legal. Tobacco, despite it's myriand known addiction and health problems and no known health benefits, is legal. Pot, despite it's known health benefits and as-yet unproven health problems... is not.

And if you're going to tell me pot being a) addictive, and b) having unknown health complications, are overwhelming problems preventing it being legalized even for properly supervised health care uses, let me introduce you to the modern opiod crisis....

Long term brain damage and hallucinogenic properties are far from unproven, they're just the tip of the iceberg. We'll see what happens in a few years after we've researched it more. Its medical benefits are there, but they are relatively minor pain relief. It's less problematic than the opioid crisis for sure, that doesn't mean that it's a good thing to be having people smoke themselves out of pain when there are several known, and potentially many unknown, side-effects. Weed is an unproven and untested drug. No government body in any country would approve a medical treatment that is as unproven and untested as Pot. As it is now, Pot is just another part of the greater problem of substance abuse.

Alcohol and Tobacco are definitely extremely harmful. In an ideal world, they should be banned completely. However, for practical reasons that can't be done. We even actually tried it with Alcohol. The trouble with banning it was way more than it was worth. The same is probably true for Pot.

When I worked as a plumber we used it on heater, respectively a tar/fibre mixture.
It's usefull.

Got a house about a 100yards down the road from me apparently built from hemp blocks. It’s used as some some of insulation I believe ?

If I remember correctly hemp was outlawed in the US because of some rich wood pulp owner pushed for it to be outlawed, fear that it would be cheaper product and lose them money. Think they greased some hands in Congress to push their agenda

It was also a racist issue, marijuana was associated with people of color and it was feared it could make "decent" (white) people act like the coloreds supposedly did.

That was the main impetus for banning marijuana and hemp was tacked onto it likely for the reasons cited above.


https://www.britannica.com/story/why-is-marijuana-illegal-in-the-us

Which is funny. Nowadays at least in CA its almost exclusively the domain of white trash yokels.

It's worth remembering that for the entire Age of Sail, each and every sailing ship used a couple miles worth of hemp rope in it's rigging.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Vulcan wrote:
I've always found it amusing.

Alcohol, despite it's myriad known addiction and health problems and very limited health benefits, is legal. Tobacco, despite it's myriand known addiction and health problems and no known health benefits, is legal. Pot, despite it's known health benefits and as-yet unproven health problems... is not.

And if you're going to tell me pot being a) addictive, and b) having unknown health complications, are overwhelming problems preventing it being legalized even for properly supervised health care uses, let me introduce you to the modern opiod crisis....

Long term brain damage and hallucinogenic properties are far from unproven, they're just the tip of the iceberg. We'll see what happens in a few years after we've researched it more. Its medical benefits are there, but they are relatively minor pain relief. It's less problematic than the opioid crisis for sure, that doesn't mean that it's a good thing to be having people smoke themselves out of pain when there are several known, and potentially many unknown, side-effects. Weed is an unproven and untested drug. No government body in any country would approve a medical treatment that is as unproven and untested as Pot. As it is now, Pot is just another part of the greater problem of substance abuse.

Alcohol and Tobacco are definitely extremely harmful. In an ideal world, they should be banned completely. However, for practical reasons that can't be done. We even actually tried it with Alcohol. The trouble with banning it was way more than it was worth. The same is probably true for Pot.

Fair enough. I can't argue with any of your conclusions here, especially the last one.

 Grey Templar wrote:
, unlike tobacco, marijuana is a hallucinogen that also causes brain damage, and is not properly studied so we don't know what other long term issues it can cause might be. The main danger from cigarettes specifically is the nasty chemicals that commercial cigarettes contain. If someone is smoking pure unprocessed tobacco, as a home grower would be doing, the danger is significantly less, though it is still a long term cancer and addiction issue. Tobacco is well documented and has known issues which don't necessarily make someone growing it a threat. Marijuana is not the same.

You sound like a spokesman for a vaping company.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
, unlike tobacco, marijuana is a hallucinogen that also causes brain damage, and is not properly studied so we don't know what other long term issues it can cause might be. The main danger from cigarettes specifically is the nasty chemicals that commercial cigarettes contain. If someone is smoking pure unprocessed tobacco, as a home grower would be doing, the danger is significantly less, though it is still a long term cancer and addiction issue. Tobacco is well documented and has known issues which don't necessarily make someone growing it a threat. Marijuana is not the same.

You sound like a spokesman for a vaping company.

lol whut? That makes no sense. Given that they're putting tobacco, pot, and everything else in vaping products. You can even get ones that have neither pot or tobacco. And they're all super bad for you.

 Chute82 wrote:
If I remember correctly hemp was outlawed in the US because of some rich wood pulp owner pushed for it to be outlawed, fear that it would be cheaper product and lose them money. Think they greased some hands in Congress to push their agenda

Also the cotton industry lobby.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
, unlike tobacco, marijuana is a hallucinogen that also causes brain damage, and is not properly studied so we don't know what other long term issues it can cause might be. The main danger from cigarettes specifically is the nasty chemicals that commercial cigarettes contain. If someone is smoking pure unprocessed tobacco, as a home grower would be doing, the danger is significantly less, though it is still a long term cancer and addiction issue. Tobacco is well documented and has known issues which don't necessarily make someone growing it a threat. Marijuana is not the same.

You sound like a spokesman for a vaping company.

lol whut? That makes no sense. Given that they're putting tobacco, pot, and everything else in vaping products. You can even get ones that have neither pot or tobacco. And they're all super bad for you.

Uh-huh. Can you provide some evidence to back up all those assertions?

 Grey Templar wrote:
I'm ok with Hemp being a legal crop. It has no realistic use as a recreational drug. The only issue it has is it can be tough to distinguish it from the actual drug producing strains. I'm also ok with actual weed being legal, though heavily regulated. IE: If you use it medically, you can only get it from a Pharmacy, not grow it yourself or from a 'dispensary'. If it is legalized recreationally, it should be heavily taxed and only licensed growers allowed to produce it. No home growing, no self-medication, zero tolerance on driving under the influence or for use by minors. All taxes from it would support rehab programs and fund research into the problems of smoking it. We're just now realizing that weed actually has some very bad, if subtle, effects on the body.

Hemp has a lot of good profitable uses that should be exploited. We just need to take steps to ensure anybody growing it is only growing hemp.

but so does booze, and tobacco, even vaping is slowly being exposed as not being the miracle product it was touted as.

I used to be fairly anti legalization, but I'm slowly coming around to the idea more and more.

Edit, I see this was already covered.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
, unlike tobacco, marijuana is a hallucinogen that also causes brain damage, and is not properly studied so we don't know what other long term issues it can cause might be. The main danger from cigarettes specifically is the nasty chemicals that commercial cigarettes contain. If someone is smoking pure unprocessed tobacco, as a home grower would be doing, the danger is significantly less, though it is still a long term cancer and addiction issue. Tobacco is well documented and has known issues which don't necessarily make someone growing it a threat. Marijuana is not the same.

You sound like a spokesman for a vaping company.

lol whut? That makes no sense. Given that they're putting tobacco, pot, and everything else in vaping products. You can even get ones that have neither pot or tobacco. And they're all super bad for you.

Uh-huh. Can you provide some evidence to back up all those assertions?

I mean he isnt wrong. you can get juice with tch, cbd. various types and grades of nicotine and even just juice with no nicotine and only flavorings. Weather they are all bad is still up for debate. what isnt is the few cases where ingredients were super toxic (such as the butter flavor (known to cause popcorn lung) or pink coloring (i believe it was unicorn milk that used titanium dioxide as a coloring agent which is potentially toxic if inhaled) many flavorings are generally safe for human consumption but may act significantly differently if inhaled) or went bad in storage (IIRC the hand full of deaths this year was from bad pot vaping pods that were sitting around in storage and grew mold)

Some of what he says is absolutely valid, what I am trying to do is call out the evidence so we can draw the line of where the fact-based assertions end and the speculation begins.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Some of what he says is absolutely valid, what I am trying to do is call out the evidence so we can draw the line of where the fact-based assertions end and the speculation begins.

You mean unhealthy?
There were multiple cases of lung collapse recorded and brought in connection with E zigs.

I seriously doubt those potential medical issues related to smoking marijuana will be anywhere near the clear and documented health issues related to sugar addiction and high-stress environment modern humans are kept in for profit.

And I say that as someone who isn't a user (but probably would love the painkiller effects as I do have chronic low-level pain)

So this is supposed to be about non-drug use, I've been playing a part in derailing that and I apologise.

What sort of uses for hemp have people heard of or seen in action? Obviously rope, but how does hemp for clothing work out?

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So this is supposed to be about non-drug use, I've been playing a part in derailing that and I apologise.

What sort of uses for hemp have people heard of or seen in action? Obviously rope, but how does hemp for clothing work out?

its probably the same processes for making linen from flax.

also hemp seed oils which im not sure what uses it has.

i suppose the benefit may come in how good the crop is for growing. compared to logging or tree farming, it may take way less resources and yield usable materials at a much quicker rate. though im not a plant scientist so i have no clue.

Aye. Its not that Hemp really makes superior cloth, its more that it is potentially a much more efficient way to make it. Though given that hemp rope is very strong it probably would make very durable clothing.

I'm more wondering how comfortable it is; how much people want to wear it is a huge factor. And how resource intensive is the process? It could be something that is easy to grow but effortfull to process. I don't know but am curious to see what others do.

Can't be any more difficult than some of the other things we use for fabric. I imagine it would be passable for jeans. Probably good for work clothes too. Durable jackets, pants, overalls, and boots.