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Does anyone have and used either a Spartan Assault Tank, Typhon Heavy Seige Tank, or Cerberus Heavy Tank Destroyer? Which have you preferred?

I like the idea of the Spartan, mainly because it is much cheaper points wise and I like the idea of carrying 15 Blood Claws and 10 Grey Hunters in one tank - 2 quad lascannons are bad either. Typhon and Cerberus and some just nasty large guns so I'm conflicted and at $170 a piece, I don't see myself buying two.

Tactically, all three suck, but the Spartan sucks the least.
The reason why is pretty simple, too. You're spending way, way too many points.

A Spartan is only about 50 points cheaper than just buying two Land Raiders, takes up its own special detachment that doesn't generate Command Points, and the only benefit you get over two Raiders is 5 more transport capacity and the ability to fall back and shoot (and a better, but still laughably bad, melee profile). You have a whopping 12 fewer wounds than if you took two Land Raiders, can still be tarpitted if your opponent surrounds the vehicle, and is way less flexible.

Typhons and Cerberus are way worse, because they cost so much and still come with a ton of downsides.

They're awesome models, but don't expect to win competitive games with them.

From a Chaos perspective, I built a Typhon solely based on looks (because why not). I kit-bashed it for less than the cost of a Land Raider (bought a Land Raider kit, some alternate resin sponsons, and had a buddy 3D print a barrel...then sold off the spare Land raider bits). All-in, maybe $60?

I've used it maybe twice and done horribly both games simply because it takes up half of your points and doesn't survive, even with Toughness 9. It's criminally priced at 750+ for the gun and some lascannons. If it was its original Index price around 500-550, it might be useful, so if your buddies would let you run it at that cost, it'd be a fun toy.

The gun is absolutely tremendous and it has some good rules - including the recent addition of Power of the Machine Spirit from a recent FAQ (so you roll around with a 2+ ballistic skill). It's a cool idea, but absolute crap in game most of the time.

I collect 7 factions and whenever I look up a Forgeworld item I'm interested in, turns out it's crap.

FW feels like pay-to-lose...

The only thing that seems good from all the things I've cared about is the Tau Tigershark with the heavy rail cannons, but since I never play against Knights, I have little use for it

On the Chaos side of things, I really like the Cerberus on paper. I've yet to test one out. The Spartan I've seen do pretty solid in competitive (3-2ish records). I'll probably be getting a Spartan myself for my WE and/or my IW.

On the loyalist side, of the few players I've seen bring Spartan to competitive most of them were SW. They seem like one of the only SM armies that can really make the most of it.

The Spartan deletes things. If it lives. It's overcosted and suffers from the same things a Phobos Land Raider suffers from... weapons that want to stay still to shoot, and a payload that needs it to move to deliver.

In a friendly game a Spartan can have some mileage but it doesn't play in a way that matches the fluff that well. Give it some Captain and Lieutenant rerolls and pray it doesn't get focused to death, and watch it shred things.

Depends on what you want to do with them. I wouldn't recommend any for purely competitive play due to gw's insane points hike which they continue to hold on to.

If you want to use them in casual/narrative games they can be fun. I have a hellforged Cerberus and it's probably the most effective anti-tank unit in the game.

If only gw would give it a more sensible points cost. (Cerberus and typhon are 395 in hh vs 650/700 respectively in 40k).

 JohnnyHell wrote:
The Spartan deletes things. If it lives. It's overcosted and suffers from the same things a Phobos Land Raider suffers from... weapons that want to stay still to shoot, and a payload that needs it to move to deliver.

In a friendly game a Spartan can have some mileage but it doesn't play in a way that matches the fluff that well. Give it some Captain and Lieutenant rerolls and pray it doesn't get focused to death, and watch it shred things.

In the last FAQ, the following vehicles got "Daemonic Machine Spirit" (ignore penalties to shoot when moving)

-Spartan
-Cerberus
-Typhon
-Mastodon
-Falchion
-Fellblade

It still hurts the Typhon since if it moves, it can only shoot 24" instead of 48" but it's great for the other units.

 Elbows wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:
The Spartan deletes things. If it lives. It's overcosted and suffers from the same things a Phobos Land Raider suffers from... weapons that want to stay still to shoot, and a payload that needs it to move to deliver.

In a friendly game a Spartan can have some mileage but it doesn't play in a way that matches the fluff that well. Give it some Captain and Lieutenant rerolls and pray it doesn't get focused to death, and watch it shred things.

In the last FAQ, the following vehicles got "Daemonic Machine Spirit" (ignore penalties to shoot when moving)

-Spartan
-Cerberus
-Typhon
-Mastodon
-Falchion
-Fellblade

It still hurts the Typhon since if it moves, it can only shoot 24" instead of 48" but it's great for the other units.

I meant more that Lascannons want to be a long way away from your target, but anyone transported gets close. Poor phrasing, sorry.

Driving Lascannons closer so your 500pt model gets tagged and can’t fire suuuucks. And sitting back and shooting wastes its transport capacity (unless deploy>disembark T1). That’s more what I meant. It’s roles sound fluffy together but get a little muddled in 8th.

LoftyS wrote:
I collect 7 factions and whenever I look up a Forgeworld item I'm interested in, turns out it's crap.

FW feels like pay-to-lose...

The only thing that seems good from all the things I've cared about is the Tau Tigershark with the heavy rail cannons, but since I never play against Knights, I have little use for it

If you believed the complaining on dakkadakka they would be uber broken good world ending awesomeness

What did my pylon do last tournament? Game 1: Damage predator, then finish it off. Took out land raider(okay that was nice), took out land speeder. Game 2. Took out 1.5 black knights(2 wounds when pylon died. Before that spent 2 turns cursing that nobody came into sight...So it only got to shoot the mini mode once in overwatch). Game 3. Damaged land raider, took out redemptor dreadnought, finished land raider(on turn 5 at which point it was already 0-20 loss).

What a cheese

tneva82 wrote:

LoftyS wrote:
I collect 7 factions and whenever I look up a Forgeworld item I'm interested in, turns out it's crap.

FW feels like pay-to-lose...

The only thing that seems good from all the things I've cared about is the Tau Tigershark with the heavy rail cannons, but since I never play against Knights, I have little use for it

If you believed the complaining on dakkadakka they would be uber broken good world ending awesomeness

What did my pylon do last tournament? Game 1: Damage predator, then finish it off. Took out land raider(okay that was nice), took out land speeder. Game 2. Took out 1.5 black knights(2 wounds when pylon died. Before that spent 2 turns cursing that nobody came into sight...So it only got to shoot the mini mode once in overwatch). Game 3. Damaged land raider, took out redemptor dreadnought, finished land raider(on turn 5 at which point it was already 0-20 loss).

What a cheese

You must be doing something wrong. Everyone knows that fw is auto win.

Even when the unit costs twice as much as it should.

Yeah it's def my fault for not moving terrain pieces out of my way before shooting pylon After all how dare opponent utilize terrain to his advantage against my immobile platform of fairly decent odds of one shotting vehicles! (Well still <60% vs leman russ. It's surprisingly unreliable when you do the actual math taking in average several turns to take out knight. Well unless you run hot like I have done. Odds of one shotting 4++ knight 25%, I did that twice in row to equilavent target with 3++...Too bad hot dice ran out before tournament )

tneva82 wrote:
Yeah it's def my fault for not moving terrain pieces out of my way before shooting pylon After all how dare opponent utilize terrain to his advantage against my immobile platform of fairly decent odds of one shotting vehicles! (Well still <60% vs leman russ. It's surprisingly unreliable when you do the actual math taking in average several turns to take out knight. Well unless you run hot like I have done. Odds of one shotting 4++ knight 25%, I did that twice in row to equilavent target with 3++...Too bad hot dice ran out before tournament )

I was being sarcastic.

Or are you being sarcastic about my sarcasm?

Whoa. Mind blown.

Well yeah bit of poking fun. I find it amusing how often I hear about "FW is broken yaddayaddayadda"(hell even regarding pylon) and then have actual real experience where I can't literally shoot a thing for 2 turns. Or then get some target which is frigging IG trooper squad and I spend 2 turns killing whopping 7(and then realize you were actually shooting above average there...)

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 Elbows wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:
The Spartan deletes things. If it lives. It's overcosted and suffers from the same things a Phobos Land Raider suffers from... weapons that want to stay still to shoot, and a payload that needs it to move to deliver.

In a friendly game a Spartan can have some mileage but it doesn't play in a way that matches the fluff that well. Give it some Captain and Lieutenant rerolls and pray it doesn't get focused to death, and watch it shred things.

In the last FAQ, the following vehicles got "Daemonic Machine Spirit" (ignore penalties to shoot when moving)

-Spartan
-Cerberus
-Typhon
-Mastodon
-Falchion
-Fellblade

It still hurts the Typhon since if it moves, it can only shoot 24" instead of 48" but it's great for the other units.

I meant more that Lascannons want to be a long way away from your target, but anyone transported gets close. Poor phrasing, sorry.

Driving Lascannons closer so your 500pt model gets tagged and can’t fire suuuucks. And sitting back and shooting wastes its transport capacity (unless deploy>disembark T1). That’s more what I meant. It’s roles sound fluffy together but get a little muddled in 8th.

Um, the Spartan also has Steel Behemoth rule that allows it to fire even when in melee or falling back so that is not a problem. You totes can drive closer, shoot all the way and laugh on your way to bank as you both crush things under your tracks while shooting their armour unhindered. It is what a Land Raider should be, the only problem is that it costs a bit too much for its durability. In function, it's just peachy.

 Sherrypie wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 Elbows wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:
The Spartan deletes things. If it lives. It's overcosted and suffers from the same things a Phobos Land Raider suffers from... weapons that want to stay still to shoot, and a payload that needs it to move to deliver.

In a friendly game a Spartan can have some mileage but it doesn't play in a way that matches the fluff that well. Give it some Captain and Lieutenant rerolls and pray it doesn't get focused to death, and watch it shred things.

In the last FAQ, the following vehicles got "Daemonic Machine Spirit" (ignore penalties to shoot when moving)

-Spartan
-Cerberus
-Typhon
-Mastodon
-Falchion
-Fellblade

It still hurts the Typhon since if it moves, it can only shoot 24" instead of 48" but it's great for the other units.

I meant more that Lascannons want to be a long way away from your target, but anyone transported gets close. Poor phrasing, sorry.

Driving Lascannons closer so your 500pt model gets tagged and can’t fire suuuucks. And sitting back and shooting wastes its transport capacity (unless deploy>disembark T1). That’s more what I meant. It’s roles sound fluffy together but get a little muddled in 8th.

Um, the Spartan also has Steel Behemoth rule that allows it to fire even when in melee or falling back so that is not a problem. You totes can drive closer, shoot all the way and laugh on your way to bank as you both crush things under your tracks while shooting their armour unhindered. It is what a Land Raider should be, the only problem is that it costs a bit too much for its durability. In function, it's just peachy.

And if you're rolling heretic you'll be getting back a wound for everything you grind under your tracks on a 5+.

Yep, the Chaos one is a far better option - as it's wounded, it becomes better in close combat...has a bunch of attacks (and yes, benefits from the new Hateful Assault bonus, etc.). However, only being able to be fixed by eating people also means if you sit back and shoot you can't be fixed by Warpsmiths or Stratagems, etc.

The heretic one can also eat its own passengers now and then, mighty awkward if its at some point only transporting important characters...

Sitting back with an assault tank that actually can contribute to the assault by ferrying men, blasting tanks apart, eating overwatches and tagging smaller vehicles so they can't shoot is kind of a waste though.

Also, funnily enough, I've found Spartans absolutely beastly in the new Apocalypse. They can wade through formations of Russes as they don't die nor get tagged down, provide very good AT weapons (especially with the Heretics' reroll 1's to wound bonus) and significantly hasten your advance towards close range firefights where marines can shine.

The Spartan is a staple of 30K. Just about every Legion uses it, especially if they field a Primarch (it's one of the few transports that can transport a Primarch).

In 40K... meh. Start stepping up to that level of play, and I expect to see Warhounds, Mastodans, Orions, Acastus Knight Porphyrions, and this monstrosity:



Who knows WTF that's supposed to be or even what is does.

 Tamwulf wrote:
The Spartan is a staple of 30K. Just about every Legion uses it, especially if they field a Primarch (it's one of the few transports that can transport a Primarch).

In 40K... meh. Start stepping up to that level of play, and I expect to see Warhounds, Mastodans, Orions, Acastus Knight Porphyrions, and this monstrosity:



Who knows WTF that's supposed to be or even what is does.

A spartan is more akin to baneblades and the like.

And that thing is an astreus. The only fw super heavy that gw deigned to give a points drop in ca 2019 because it's "primaris ".

Thanks gw.

Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Tamwulf wrote:
The Spartan is a staple of 30K. Just about every Legion uses it, especially if they field a Primarch (it's one of the few transports that can transport a Primarch).

In 40K... meh. Start stepping up to that level of play, and I expect to see Warhounds, Mastodans, Orions, Acastus Knight Porphyrions, and this monstrosity:



Who knows WTF that's supposed to be or even what is does.

A spartan is more akin to baneblades and the like.

And that thing is an astreus. The only fw super heavy that gw deigned to give a points drop in ca 2019 because it's "primaris ".

Thanks gw.

You realize that isn't true right? Lots of superheavies have had adjustments in FW. However. The Astreus has been unplayable for about 2 years now after it's release dispite the fact it was "primaris". You gotta admit this thing looks dope too.

 Xenomancers wrote:

Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Tamwulf wrote:
The Spartan is a staple of 30K. Just about every Legion uses it, especially if they field a Primarch (it's one of the few transports that can transport a Primarch).

In 40K... meh. Start stepping up to that level of play, and I expect to see Warhounds, Mastodans, Orions, Acastus Knight Porphyrions, and this monstrosity:



Who knows WTF that's supposed to be or even what is does.

A spartan is more akin to baneblades and the like.

And that thing is an astreus. The only fw super heavy that gw deigned to give a points drop in ca 2019 because it's "primaris ".

Thanks gw.

You realize that isn't true right? Lots of superheavies have had adjustments in FW. However. The Astreus has been unplayable for about 2 years now after it's release dispite the fact it was "primaris". You gotta admit this thing looks dope too.

Don't know which ones you're talking about. Definitely none of the ones being discussed in this thread.

And it looks like the aborted crossbreed of a sicaran and the tank from the halo video games.

Give me a fellblade or falchion.

Get. Off. My. Lawn.

That... Primaris "tank" doesn't even come close to matching the beauty of a Fellblade:

Gotta agree...the Astraeus is a turd compared to a lot of other offerings.

 Tamwulf wrote:
That... Primaris "tank" doesn't even come close to matching the beauty of a Fellblade:

Preach brother!

Now if only gw's rules writers would let us use them more.