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Basically assume all living loyalist Primarchs (so no Manus or Sanguinius) returned and assumed control of their gene-sons and combined them into Legions once again going back to old days of Imperial Army? And assume that Blood Angels Chapter Master and Iron Hands chapter master would be made the heads of their own legion as well.

How would it affect things now that the Imperium's foes would be facing eight Primarchs and ten SM legions?

 Tyzarion_Kronius wrote:
Basically assume all living loyalist Primarchs (so no Manus or Sanguinius) returned and assumed control of their gene-sons and combined them into Legions once again going back to old days of Imperial Army? And assume that Blood Angels Chapter Master and Iron Hands chapter master would be made the heads of their own legion as well.

How would it affect things now that the Imperium's foes would be facing eight Primarchs and ten SM legions?

Well assuming that they don't start arguing over power immediately and /or going off doing their own thing?

They still have to organise their various forces spread all over the place and they may not be happy with what they have become - indeed they are likely to be quite angry in some cases or at least hugely disapointed .

They would at some point argue and posture over who commands what and what they should do and their fathers legacy. It will take some sorting out.

One loyalist primarch returning is enough of an upheaval of the setting. Please, no more.

Hard to say, to be honest.

First, each would have to take in and adapt to how The Imperium is now.

Then, it’ll depend upon their own character. Vulkan for instance, will respond very differently to say, Russ. That doesn’t mean drawn blades or owt, just very different personal approaches and philosophy.

Guilliman is near unique in being a Statesman that ever before reunification had over seen an Empire in the form of Ultramar.

Whilst I believe all his Brothers would follow his lead, the exact execution in a given theatre of war may differ. The Lion might be ruthlessly pragmatic. The Khan not so much.

Reformation of the legions would be inevitable if they all turned up, short of them all being told directly by the Big E to listen to Guilliman they would do their own thing as they always did.

I think some of the Primarch scenarios that could lead to a Civil War would be interesting. If a Primarch returns in a cutoff section of the Imperium, would he come to power there? Would he submit?

I'd assume that Vulkan returning to the 18th would result in a bunch of new wargear. He did have most of his masterworks destroyed before he left for istvaan.

The Lion's return would mark the 1st's chaos fall....

Dorn would immediately enact the last wall and start building fortifications.

Khan would just meet up w his legion and conduct business as usual.

Russ would feth everything up with his wolf headedness.

Ferrus should never return to IH, but should lead the Legion of the Damned.

Sanguinious Shouldnt return....PERIOD!

I think it depends on the primarch. Not all of them would want to lead huge chunks of the imperium. Guilliman would be reluctant to truly hand over too much power as he's keenly aware of how thinly stretched his resources are.

I could see Russ and the Khan being too ambitious to settle into the (losing) status quo but too independent to fall neatly into Guilliman's plans. I imagine they would set their own short-medium-term goals and acquire the power to accomplish those goals with or without Guilliman's blessing. Each would be able to call upon their own chapter without difficulty. They could probably even call upon some of their successors or even unrelated chapters that like that primarch's style.

Basically, I picture massive fleets forming with or without some extra resources contributed by Guilliman. Guilliman would probably try to keep lines of communication and coordination open to avoid disrupting his own supply chains and intelligence networks, but the regions where those primarchs campaign would probably be more or less under the sway of said primarchs.

I feel like Dorn would be pretty likely to work alongside Guilliman. He wouldn't want to feel commanded or belittled, but he pragmatically accept a major place in Guilliman's plans. I could see him working with Guilliman to acquire the resources needed to build a bunch of defensive fleets and fortifications across the imperium.

Vulkan could go either way. If some of those relics that are supposed to be gathered together before his return end up being useful enough, he could pretty easily go the Khan/Russ route, dealing with stuff in his own neighborhood as well as possible.

I feel like the most likely result, however, is that Guilliman reaches out to him, and he ends up focusing on building up the defenses of isolated imperial areas. Dorn can build up the best walls with all the resources Guilliman can harness. Vulkan would teach isolated systems to stand on their own feet as much as possible. Seems fitting for his Code of Fire attitude and crafter skills. Also means he could build some nifty-but-heretechal defenses in places the mechanicus isn't paying attention.

I really don't know enough about the Lion to have any thoughts. My impression of him is that he basically broods until the Heresy happens and then takes a long nap.

Is Corax still kicking? Where is that guy? I feel like he'd want to focus on big picture targets. Maybe he coordinates with Guilliman for resources and intel. Maybe he goes off and does his own thing with the Raven Guard and a bunch of cool secretive dudes in tow.

Where Guilliman focuses on building up key positions, I could see Corax trying to tear down key threats. I wouldn't be surprised to hear about him trying to kill Vect and cripple Comorragh in an effort to functionally end the drukhari threat. I could see him trying to assassinate Yvraine if he doesn't like his brother's girlfriend. Maybe he takes a swing at Ghazzy and the Silent King.

The rumours that the Dark Angels have been Legion-building all this time are slanderous tales told by jealous Ultramarines. We just have the occasional meeting on the Rock with the Successor Chapters - that's all. We're not already a Legion. At all.

Their value to the imperium is strategic and morale. Individually they aren't going to fight wars by themselves any more than a warhound titan can.

Their strength is in building and leading new war strategies and inspiring troops to victory.

Unless their strategic brilliance is actually beyond the ken of mortals (which hasn't really seemed to be the case), they would be like 6 returning Creeds. Pretty useful, but they aren't going to win any wars just by existing.

They individually might be able to target enemy commanders that are lynchpins in their forces and that could help them win though.

So Abaddon, Ghazkhull, the stormlord, The grand high ethereal (or the whole caste...), Eldrad.

If primarchs formed kill teams to take those leaders out they could severely disrupt enemy military movements and break their main warfronts for an extended period of time.


Other than that, they could subdivide the segmentae in Primarch-tae and assign one as military governor of that area.

Wyldhunt wrote:

Is Corax still kicking? Where is that guy? I feel like he'd want to focus on big picture targets. Maybe he coordinates with Guilliman for resources and intel. Maybe he goes off and does his own thing with the Raven Guard and a bunch of cool secretive dudes in tow.

According to "Shadows of the Past", Corax is in the Eye hunting traitors. He kicked Lorgar's golden behind so hard he ran away through a warp portal and sealed it up behind him. Bearing in mind that this was Lorgar after he ascended to Daemonhood, that is some decent power on Corax's part. Lorgar ran from the fight bleeding runes of blood while Corax had just a black eye and a few dents in his armour.

He pretty is off doing his own thing already, he's just doing it out of sight. Who knows how many Chaos champions he has slain over the last 10 millennia and how many invasions and black crusades he has prevented. However he has noticeably failed to claim any big scalps as all the Traitor Primarchs are still alive (even if Lorgar is hiding from Corax in a locked room).

Guilliman didn't hold Corax in particularly high regard during the GC as he thought he was impatient. He would take down the immediate threat and then rush on to the next target with no thought leaving a functioning planet behind. Whilst the UMs and the Fists were probably the best at leaving stable fortified planets behind them, the Raven Guard were definitely in the bottom tier.

You can't really kill Demon Primarchs so there's no point trying. Plus is beating Demon Lorgar an achievement when you're also powered up? It's just Lorgar.

Roboute forgot what his job was. Maybe that's why he got picked to wreck the Word Bearers stuff...