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Hi,

Everyone’s talking about their favourite points from the big preview so I thought I’d start a threat about the most boring parts

1. Assault intessesors are not very exciting are they? Especially when it probably means all the units will just be chain sword and bolt pistol because primaries don’t like options
2. All the codex will be revamped so probably no new armies I expect

They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

If they go a starter set route, I imagine the Assault Intercessors will just be monopose with gear presented, but hopefully, if they get a full kit, it will have power axes and mauls, maybe lightning claws if we are lucky. And jump packs if we are super lucky.

 Nevelon wrote:
They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

 Valkyrie wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

Reivers do the same job, but better, is not a sentence I thought I'd EVER hear.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:


Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

Reivers do the same job, but better, is not a sentence I thought I'd EVER hear.

I know, right?

Better gear on assault intercessor sarges will go a long way to making them better then reivers. Sure, you are going to have trouble getting into contact with the enemy, but at least the unit won’t just issue some limp slaps when it gets there. You can have the sarge put the hammer/powersword/whatever into the bad guys. In that context, they might be comparable units. One moves better, one hits harder.

The trick is assault vs. tactical intercessors. Intercessor sarges can already pick up the CC toys.

Some things they could do to help is issue grenades. Smoke/Shock grenades on the assaults could give them an edge. Bring back melta bombs for the sarge.
Special rules, like assault move and charge, or double tapping pistols, or something to give them an boost would help. This is 100% rules based, so we won’t be able to tell from the models. This could be baked into the datasheet, or a stratagem.

If you work hard enough, they might be semi-viable. But it’s going to be an uphill battle.

At least there's something to ride around in Impulsors now.

Ork-en Man wrote:
At least there's something to ride around in Impulsors now.

Still better with shooty units, as you can’t assault out of them using their assault vehicle rule.

(which is a hilarious use of mis-matched names)

I'm sure theyll receive some special rule to make them an actual choice over normal intercessors.

Also, they only need two things to be much better than reivers:
-To be troops (I assume they'll be? Maybe not, because assault marines but they look too basic to be anything other tna troops)
-If the sargeants can take options, even a power fist, would put them leagues above Reivers in damage output.

 Nevelon wrote:

Ork-en Man wrote:
At least there's something to ride around in Impulsors now.

Still better with shooty units, as you can’t assault out of them using their assault vehicle rule.

(which is a hilarious use of mis-matched names)

I forgot about that part of the rule. But that could change in 9th.

If they don't make morale way more punishing a chainsword squad is going to remain just as pointless as any chainsword squad in 8e was.

So how do we think Assault Intercessors will be sold in 'full kit format'?

I'm, personally, leaning towards a Knight->Knight Warden situation. An additional sprue of chainsword+bolt pistol arms and 'gothic gubbins' is added to the standard Intercessor kit.

 Kanluwen wrote:
So how do we think Assault Intercessors will be sold in 'full kit format'?

I'm, personally, leaning towards a Knight->Knight Warden situation. An additional sprue of chainsword+bolt pistol arms and 'gothic gubbins' is added to the standard Intercessor kit.

The ones in the pic are running, more dynamic. I think they will be their own full kit.

I could see them getting a LOT of use with some simple buff to their charge on top of something like orbital deployment.

Imagine a very cost-effective unit that could reliably do the deepstrike charge, and even if it only tarpits tough units (rather than hurting or killing them) it will still see a LOT of play.

mrFickle wrote:
Hi,

Everyone’s talking about their favourite points from the big preview so I thought I’d start a threat about the most boring parts

1. Assault intessesors are not very exciting are they? Especially when it probably means all the units will just be chain sword and bolt pistol because primaries don’t like options

They remind me of the Diablo Immortal announcement. 'Did you not want chainswords?' 'Did you not want melee primaris?' (they didn't actually say that, but pictures of foot guys with swords gave me the same vibe)
I mean, yeah, sure. People wanted that. But... not so much as footsloggers who have to wander to wherever the actual fight is. The sword and shield marines remind me of nothing so much as Primaris Lychguard, with all the problems that unit has in army that can't get them stuck in, despite teleportation shenanigans out the wazoo.

2. All the codex will be revamped so probably no new armies I expect

Eventually, but the codex revamp was a given anyway. They spent a lot of time and effort saying that the current books (and sadly the PA books) would be sticking around and valid. So they aren't going to rush through the codexes again at the same pace.
If I were GW, I'd definitely do a new army at this point. The new ones brought Aos back into the limelight in a way that its revised edition didn't.

what if the guys with the shields can provide cover for units behind them? we sort of saw that in the video and if so it'd make an intreasting synergy

We will have to see. Hypothetically GW has learned from assault marines and reivers, but unless their strength comes from a 9e rule change or a new super strat, I don't see chainsword melee intercessors being any good.

-Primaris sticking with 1 loadout means they aren't fixing the old assault marine problem by giving them power weapon options.
-Presumably these guys will be a FA slot option, which is all around worse unless you need for a brigade as no ob sec.
-No jump packs means less mobility unless buying an Impulsor, which admittedly isn't terrible since the Impulsor is good, but it jacks up the price.

It seems like all the same problems as assault marines, but without the slight saving grace of jump packs. If that assault marine cost a few point less than the tactical body variant, assault marines become a fine option to give you a cheap jump unit. But GW won't do that because a marine body (or intercessor body) is supposed to cost x amount as a floor then add on points for weapons. Assault guys can't cost less even if less useful.

leerm02 wrote:
I could see them getting a LOT of use with some simple buff to their charge on top of something like orbital deployment.

Imagine a very cost-effective unit that could reliably do the deepstrike charge, and even if it only tarpits tough units (rather than hurting or killing them) it will still see a LOT of play.

They're going to be a terrible tarpit. Any melee unit that matters in 8e has a large number of multi-damage attacks and is going to be incredibly cost-effective at chopping up Primaris.

bort wrote:

-Presumably these guys will be a FA slot option, which is all around worse unless you need for a brigade as no ob sec.

they're troops you can bet money on it.

 Valkyrie wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

Reivers aren't a Troop choice and can't be Vets and don't have any options for the Sarge.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

Reivers aren't a Troop choice and can't be Vets and don't have any options for the Sarge.

............. that's a good point I never thought of, these guys will have the intercessor keywork, which means they'll be eligable for the vetern intercessors strat.

wonder if GW'll do blood angels a solid and give them a death company assault intercessors datasheet

mrFickle wrote:
Hi,

Everyone’s talking about their favourite points from the big preview so I thought I’d start a threat about the most boring parts

1. Assault intessesors are not very exciting are they? Especially when it probably means all the units will just be chain sword and bolt pistol because primaries don’t like options

Im sure BA players will never use them. They will have 3 base attacks, 4 with chainsword, 5 with savage echoes, 6 with shock assault, 7 with unleash rage, 8 with the sanguinor nearby. And thats just the number of attacks.

pretty sure they'll only have 2 base attacks, 3 if you spend a CP or two to make them veterns (which TBH is proably a good idea)

 p5freak wrote:

mrFickle wrote:
Hi,

Everyone’s talking about their favourite points from the big preview so I thought I’d start a threat about the most boring parts

1. Assault intessesors are not very exciting are they? Especially when it probably means all the units will just be chain sword and bolt pistol because primaries don’t like options

Im sure BA players will never use them. They will have 3 base attacks, 4 with chainsword, 5 with savage echoes, 6 with shock assault, 7 with unleash rage, 8 with the sanguinor nearby. And thats just the number of attacks.

...And they'll all be 4/0/1 (or 4/-1/1 in assault doctrine) so a full squad with eight attacks apeice gets to kill slightly over two Bullgryns on the charge!

Also: Try delivering large squads of T4/2W/3+ models in the age of D2 spam.

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 p5freak wrote:

mrFickle wrote:
Hi,

Everyone’s talking about their favourite points from the big preview so I thought I’d start a threat about the most boring parts

1. Assault intessesors are not very exciting are they? Especially when it probably means all the units will just be chain sword and bolt pistol because primaries don’t like options

Im sure BA players will never use them. They will have 3 base attacks, 4 with chainsword, 5 with savage echoes, 6 with shock assault, 7 with unleash rage, 8 with the sanguinor nearby. And thats just the number of attacks.

...And they'll all be 4/0/1 (or 4/-1/1 in assault doctrine) so a full squad with eight attacks apeice gets to kill slightly over two Bullgryns on the charge!

well yeah, a buncha guys with chainswords aren't exactly an optimal weapon to use against Bullgryns. that's like arguing a lascanon will onyl kill 1 guardsman in a squad, thus lascanons suck. Marine chainsword units are almost always intended to be "bully units" being thrown at guardsman squads etc. obviously the points cost will be whats important here. if they're 20 PPM no one in their right mind will take them, but if they're 3 PPM they'll be the only troops you ever see in Marine lists.

Assuming no special rules (and 9th edition doesn't let us assault out of transports) I think they'll be of limited use, but even something like strat that allows them to charge after advancing, or something could make them reasonably solid. but yeah they won't be replacing intercessors in any of my lists.

BrianDavion wrote:
...well yeah, a buncha guys with chainswords aren't exactly an optimal weapon to use against Bullgryns. that's like arguing a lascanon will onyl kill 1 guardsman in a squad, thus lascanons suck. Marine chainsword units are almost always intended to be "bully units" being thrown at guardsman squads etc. obviously the points cost will be whats important here. if they're 20 PPM no one in their right mind will take them, but if they're 3 PPM they'll be the only troops you ever see in Marine lists.

Assuming no special rules (and 9th edition doesn't let us assault out of transports) I think they'll be of limited use, but even something like strat that allows them to charge after advancing, or something could make them reasonably solid. but yeah they won't be replacing intercessors in any of my lists.

So you're wasting all the time and energy to deliver a chaff-killing melee unit when your entire army is vastly oversupplied with chaff-killing guns (like the extra grenade launchers they keep sticking on all the Primaris vehicles)...given that 9e is also going to buff blasts against large squads?

 AnomanderRake wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
...well yeah, a buncha guys with chainswords aren't exactly an optimal weapon to use against Bullgryns. that's like arguing a lascanon will onyl kill 1 guardsman in a squad, thus lascanons suck. Marine chainsword units are almost always intended to be "bully units" being thrown at guardsman squads etc. obviously the points cost will be whats important here. if they're 20 PPM no one in their right mind will take them, but if they're 3 PPM they'll be the only troops you ever see in Marine lists.

Assuming no special rules (and 9th edition doesn't let us assault out of transports) I think they'll be of limited use, but even something like strat that allows them to charge after advancing, or something could make them reasonably solid. but yeah they won't be replacing intercessors in any of my lists.

So you're wasting all the time and energy to deliver a chaff-killing melee unit when your entire army is vastly oversupplied with chaff-killing guns (like the extra grenade launchers they keep sticking on all the Primaris vehicles)...given that 9e is also going to buff blasts against large squads?

we'll have to see, keep in mind I'm not saying they're going to be awesome, but I am saying that blood angels and similer chapters might occasionally be able to toss them in a list and have some fun with em

Fair. I'm just sitting here thinking that Assault Marines have spent most of 8e as a strong contender for the worst unit in the game, and 9e's got it's work cut out for it if it wants to make chainsword squads even pretend to be relevant.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Fair. I'm just sitting here thinking that Assault Marines have spent most of 8e as a strong contender for the worst unit in the game, and 9e's got it's work cut out for it if it wants to make chainsword squads even pretend to be relevant.

on that I agree. the preview did also suggest some new rules on tactical reserves, depending on how those rules work, the units could be handy for marine armies with outflank options. If, for example, you can charge from outflank suddenly that opens up possiabilities for raven guard, space wolves and other marine armies with those options.

 Valkyrie wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
They are going to have to pile on the special rules or have them be criminally undercosted to make assault intercessors worth it. Heavy bolt pistols and an extra CC attack are NOT worth giving up the bolt rifle. Reivers do this already and are wildly considered hot garbage. And they actually have some deployment/movement options.

That said they look very nice. I might do some arm swaps and mix in a box of regular intercessors to make for a more active running squad for autobolters.

I suspect we will get a new army sometime soon. All the traitor guard from Blackstone Fortress are crying out for a codex.

Exactly this, the models are nice but they just seem pretty underwhelming considering Reivers already do the same job but better.

You haven't seen the rules for Assault Intercessors...so how do you know Reivers will do it better?