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Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




Update to original post: I reworked the list to address issue with taking a Command Rhino in my allied detachment HQ slot and make the Imperial Fists detachment provide more infantry shooting support.

Hi Folks,

So I've been toying with the idea of adding an Imperial Fists allied detachment to a DoR Blood Angels list I've been refining. In addition to just looking and feeling awesome, I'm going down this route because I wanted the Imperial Fists to provide ranged support. As you'll see, the list isn't fancy - I actually don't use any special units for both legions - but I think both legions complement each other.

++ Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1,594pts] ++

+ HQ +

Chaplain [147pts]: Artificer Armour, Bolter, Jump Pack, Melta Bombs, Plasma Pistol, Power Axe, Refractor Field
. Consul: Chaplain

Chaplain [147pts]: Artificer Armour, Bolter, Jump Pack, Melta Bombs, Plasma Pistol, Power Axe, Refractor Field
. Consul: Chaplain

Praetor, Legion [180pts]: Artificer Armour, Digital Lasers, Inferno Pistol, Jump Pack, Melta Bombs, Paragon Blade

+ Elites +

Apothecarion Detachment [130pts]
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour, Volkite Charger
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

+ Troops +

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

+ Fast Attack +

Primaris-Lightning Strike Fighter [180pts]: 2x Kraken Penetrator Heavy Missiles, Ground-tracking Auguries, Twin-linked Lascannon

+ Heavy Support +

Sicaran Battle Tank [230pts]: Accelerator Autocannon, Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Hunter-killer Missile

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance: IX: Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: The Day of Revelation

++ Allied Detachment (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List; Imperial Fists) [906pts] ++

+ Troops +

Tactical Squad, Legion , Compulsory [248pts]: Bolters, 13x Tactical Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: Additional Chainswords/Combat Blades, Nuncio-vox, Vexilla, Legion
. Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Melta Bombs
. . Combi-weapon: Combi-weapon: Plasma gun
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe

Tactical Squad, Legion , Compulsory [248pts]: Bolters, 13x Tactical Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: Additional Chainswords/Combat Blades, Nuncio-vox, Vexilla, Legion
. Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Melta Bombs
. . Combi-weapon: Combi-weapon: Plasma gun
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe

+ HQ +

Siege Breaker [140pts]: Combi-Bolter, On Foot, Solarite Power Gauntlet
. Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour: Terminator Armour
. Consul: Siege Breaker

+ Heavy Support +

Heavy Support Squad, Legion Heavy Bolter [270pts]: Hardened Armour, Heavy Bolter, 9x Space Marines, Legion
. Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance: VII: Imperial Fists, Loyalist

Total Point: 2,500

I haven't bought any of the Imperial Fist units, so I have maximum flexibility with this list. I also have a 10 Dawnbreakers, 5 Crimson Paladins, 5 Tartaroses, 10 Breachers, a Blood Angels Preator in Tartaros armor, an Incaendius Dread, and a Blood Angels Contemptor Dread, so I've got options for my Blood Angels list.

Thanks!

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/07/31 00:35:46


 
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







I'm not sure the Damocles does that much for you; Day of Revelation means that you don't need the Reserves modifier for anything other than the Lightning, and you can get better accurate deep strike out of Recon squads (remember that in 30k Reserves arrive at the start of movement, so the Damocles is stuck in your deployment zone).

The rest of the list looks pretty over-upgraded; the Lightning would do basically the same job with just the Kraken missiles and maybe the ground-tracking auguries sixty points cheaper, the Assault Squads won't need full meltabombs against probably 95% of lists, and stacking the Chaplains in both Assault Squads on top of the Blood Angels' Legion rule is going to be overkill against anything you actually want an Assault Squad fighting.

Is your goal for the Imperial Fists just to provide fire support?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/07/30 18:15:01


Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




Thanks! A friend corrected me on the Rhino and noted it's a non-compulsory HQ, so I can't take it in the IF list. Take a look at the updated version above and let me know what you think.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/07/31 00:31:15


 
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







I'm still not sure what the Imperial Fists are for, or what the Chaplains are for. You'd probably get more out of an entire extra Assault Squad than sticking Chaplains in both squads, and I don't know why you're stretching to the Allied detachment to take a bunch of squishy anti-infantry firepower in a Day of Revelation list.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/07/31 06:40:37


Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




Aside from your suggestions about extra Assault marines, all I'm seeing are snide comments that aren't constructive feedback. Give me actual suggestions instead of being critical of every minute detail about the list, ok? We're all here to enjoy the hobby, not bring people down.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/07/31 14:07:10


 
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be snide or bring you down. I don't think I understand what you're trying to build and I think I could be more helpful if you'd tell me more about your idea for the list.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




Apologies accepted and I think you helped me think about what I want in the list. Here's the broad picture of what I'm envisioning:

1) The Blood Angels infantry are primarily close combat and melee focused to make the most of their legion ability.

2) The Imperial Fists are primarily anti-infantry and anti-armor fire support infantry units. That said, I'd like to run a unit of Terminators with Vigil shields and Chain/Power Fists to hunt vehicles.

3) I'd like to take an anti-armor land vehicle/dread or two that pairs well with the Primaris Lightning. I'd likely add this to BA list.

So that's the broad outline of what I want the list to look like. At this point, I'm open to using Day of Sorrows if it's easier to work with. Let's also dispense with 2.5K points and do something at 3K. That makes it easier to work with more options.

In addition to the assault marines, apothacaries, and Blood Angels power armor Preator, I've got a unit of Dawnbreakers, Crimson Paladins, the Incaendius, a regular BA Dread, and the BA Tartaros Preator. I've also got Calth, Prospero, an extra unit of Tartaroses, a ten-man unit of Breachers, and a Leviathan. I'll get the vehicles later this year but I already have a lot to play with already.

Hope that helps with thinking about the list. Thanks!

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2020/08/01 04:57:15


 
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







I think the set of models you've got here are getting more out of Day of Revelation than they would get out of Day of Sorrows. I'm not sure which other Rite I would suggest for this assortment of models. Angel's Wrath is normally an interesting choice for Blood Angels but it'd restrict what you put in the IF detachment.

I wonder if you might want a Storm Eagle rather than the Lightning for this list? It has comparable firepower but is tougher, and if you want to use either shield/fist IF Terminators or the Crimson Paladins you're going to need to deliver them. A Storm Eagle is faster than a Land Raider, lets you put characters in vehicle with the Terminators, and is safer than Deep Striking.

As to anti-armour ground vehicles the base Sicaran is more of a crossover unit; you take it if you want one thing that's all right at killing a very wide range of targets. If you're looking for something primarily as an anti-armour unit you'd probably be better off with a Venator, laser-Vindicators, or laser-Sabres. A Sicaran-Arcus or Sicaran-Omega would be more expensive but is strong against a broader range of targets.

As to the Siege Breaker he doesn't do a lot for your Imperial Fists since the Heavy Support squad has Tank Hunters on their own by virtue of being Imperial Fists and you're not using any phosphex here. You might take a melee character if you're going to put the IF Terminators into the force, or a Master of Signal if you're more interested in the shooting support (and note that since IF and BA are Sworn Brothers you could use an IF Cognis-Signum to bump up the BS of a Blood Angels tank).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/01 05:00:10


Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




Thank you! An idea for a list is now beginning to form in my mind and I have a few questions:

1) If I went with one of the Sicarans you suggested and a laser Sabre, would you recommend adding another Sabre, a Venator, or a laser Vindicator? Or should I save those points for another part of the list?

2) The Storm Eagle is in. I originally thought about adding a Fire Raptor when I wanted a pure BA DoR list to provide heavy fire support, but I like the option of minimizing the problems with deep striking. What's a good load out for the Eagle?

3) My IF detachment may simply be a Tartaros Preator with the Solarite Gauntlet and a Vigil Shield and two units of five Tartaros. One of the termies be armed with chain/power fists and Vigil Shields to hunt vehicles. The other ones will have Vigil Shields and a weapon load out to hunt TEQs. I could use the Crimson Paladins for this purpose but the Vigil Shields will always be a 3++, making it more reliable in a broader range of situations. Finally, one of the units will ride in the Storm Eagle, the other will Deep Strike unless you think I should pop them into a DT.

In order to pull this off, I need access to Pride of the Legion. Can I use the RoW for an allied detachment? If so, does the detachment need to have 1,000 points? Or does the overall list's points value count towards the 1,000 points? I have an idea of how to hit the 1,000 point mark, so that's not an issue.

An alternative is using the Zone Mortalis Assault Force RoW but that requires me to take a unit of Breachers, which takes me a little further from the detachment's main purpose. I'm not sure I can use that RoW for an allied detachment, but any answers here would be helpful.

4) The Chaplains are out to save points. Any thoughts on additional HQs I can use for this list? Or should I shift those points to Dawnbreakers or another set of Assault Marines?

Thanks again!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/08/01 19:36:55


 
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







1) depends on points.

2) ML+stock missiles on a Storm Eagle will usually be enough given that you have the mobility to hunt side armour, consider building multi-melta+lascannons if you've got a lot of points left and you see a lot of Land Raiders on the table, otherwise rely on the cargo for heavy armour.

3) You can use a Rite in an Allied detachment if the army itself is big enough that you can take another Praetor, the allied detachment doesn't have to be a full thousand points. The problem here is that Pride of the Legion is the only way to get Terminators as compulsory Troops, and it doesn't let you take Allies, so you can't use it in an allied detachment. ZMAF wouldn't let you take the Storm Eagle as an Imperial Fists unit and no level of allies can share transports, so if you did that your Fists would be Deep Striking only. If you're going to take any Rite for the Allied detachment I'd suggest doing Stone Gauntlet with one Breacher squad on the table and one Terminator squad in the Storm Eagle, otherwise don't worry about a Rite there.

4) Not sure. Depends on what's left in the list. I'd suggest the Dawnbreakers given that it's going to be a stretch to work a second IF Terminator squad into the list and that'd give you another AP2 melee squad.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




I figured out how to thread the needle on the IF detachment to get two terminator units out of it: take one as the Preator's Command Squad for vehicle hunting and pop the other in the Elite slot to target TEQs. Breachers are now filling the troop slot. I'll think about whether I want to run Storm Gauntlet but I'll keep my options open to allow the terminators to deep strike.

I've now got 139 points, so I have space for another land-based vehicle if you have recommendations.
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







Not many you can get for 139pts. Land Speeders?

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in us
Psychic Prisoner aboard a Black Ship




So here are two very different 3,000 point lists that I came up with using a lot of your ideas and combined them with some of my own. The key thing is that made these lists work is that I gave up the idea of having two IF terminator units. That allowed me to come up with some good ways of combining the two legions into one coherent force. I know it's a lot to review two different lists, so let me know which one looks best and let me know what you think. Thank you again for your help!

List One: Day of Revelation Meets Armored Breakthrough

The idea behind this list was to use your idea for dropping a unit of terminators with a Storm Eagle and pop that into the Blood Angels DoR force. I beefed up that force with a full squad of Dawnbreakers to hunt TEQs with the Preator. I married this list to an IF Armored Breakthrough detachment to provide the vehicle support for the list. I've got two predators in the Troop Slots, a Sicaran Venator, and the Preator with the Vigil Shield and Solarite Gauntlet and his Terminator Command Squad riding in a Land Raider. The list is exactly 3,000 points.

++  Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1,695pts] ++

+ HQ +

Praetor, Legion [195pts]: Artificer Armour, Blade of Perdition, Digital Lasers, Inferno Pistol, Iron Halo, Jump Pack

+ Elites +

Apothecarion Detachment [120pts]
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

Dawnbreaker Cohort [335pts]: 9x Dawnbreaker Legionary, 9x Fallen-star Pattern Power Spear
. Dawnbreaker Champion: Fallen-star Pattern Power Spear

Terminator Squad, Legion [225pts]
. Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour
. Terminator Sergeant, Legion: Chainfist, Combi-Bolter
. Terminators, Legion: Combi-Bolter, Power Fist
. Terminators, Legion: Combi-Bolter, Power Fist
. Terminators, Legion: Plasma Blaster, Power Fist
. Terminators, Legion: Chainfist, Combi-Bolter

+ Troops +

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

+ Fast Attack +

Storm Eagle Assault Gunship, Legion [240pts]: Armoured Ceramite, Extra Armour, Missile Launcher, Tempest Rockets x 4, Vengeance Launcher

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance:   IX: Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: The Day of Revelation

++ Total: [1,695pts] ++

++ Allied Detachment (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1,295pts] ++

+ Troops +

Predator Strike Armoured Squadron, Legion , Compulsory [130pts]
. Predator Tank, Legion: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Extra Armour, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Predator Cannon

Predator Strike Armoured Squadron, Legion , Compulsory [130pts]
. Predator Tank, Legion: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Extra Armour, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Predator Cannon

+ HQ +

Praetor, Legion [775pts]: Digital Lasers, On Foot, Solarite Power Gauntlet, Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. Master of the Legion
. . Terminator Command Squad, Legion: Chainfist, 3x Power Fist, 4x Space Marine Chosen, Legion, 4x Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. . . Land Raider Phobos: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Dozer Blade, Extra Armour, Frag Assault Launchers, Heavy Bolter, Hunter-killer Missile, 2x Twin-linked Lascannon Sponsons
. . . Standard Bearer, Legion: Chainfist, Grenade Harness, Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. . . Tartaros Pattern Terminator Armour
. Tartaros Pattern Terminator Armour: Terminator Armour

+ Heavy Support +

Sicaran Venator Tank Destroyer [260pts]: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Hunter-killer Missile

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance:    VII: Imperial Fists, Loyalist

Rite of War: Armoured Breakthrough

++ Total: [1,295pts] ++

List Two: Day of Sorrows (Sort of) Meets the Stone Guantlet

This list uses your idea for dropping a unit of terminators with a Storm Eagle and puts that in the IF allied detachment. The Preator and the Command Squad from list one will now be riding in the Eagle. I decided to axe the idea of adding another terminator unit and put the Breachers into a Land Raider Phobos to provide some vehicle support. I don't think I can use Stone Gauntlet because of the Storm Eagle but correct me if I'm wrong there.

Rather than trying to make the Blood Angels list work with DoR, I decided to go with Day of Sorrows so I could use the points I would have used for the Fast Attack slot for vehicles. I decided not to screw around and put in a Sicaran Arcus and Venator. This version of the list dropped the terminators but kept the Dawnbreakers to accompany the Preator. That said, I can always replace one of the Sicarans with land speeders or the Incaendius Dread in the Fast Attack slot to convert the BA force to DoR. This list is 2,996 points.

++  Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1,765pts] ++

+ HQ +

Praetor, Legion [195pts]: Artificer Armour, Blade of Perdition, Digital Lasers, Inferno Pistol, Iron Halo, Jump Pack

+ Elites +

Apothecarion Detachment [120pts]
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades
. Apothecary, Legion: Jump Pack, Power Armour
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

Dawnbreaker Cohort [335pts]: 9x Dawnbreaker Legionary, 9x Fallen-star Pattern Power Spear
. Dawnbreaker Champion: Fallen-star Pattern Power Spear

+ Troops +

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

Assault Squad, Legion , Compulsory [290pts]: 14x Assault Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 3x Power Axe
. Assault Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolt Pistol
. . Power Weapon: Power Axe
. Standard Wargear
. . Chainsword or Combat Blade: Chainswords/Combat Blades

+ Heavy Support +

Sicaran Arcus Strike Tank [275pts]: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Hunter-killer Missile
. Twin Arcus launcher

Sicaran Venator Tank Destroyer [260pts]: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, Hunter-killer Missile

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance:   IX: Blood Angels, Loyalist

Rite of War: The Day of Sorrows

++ Total: [1,765pts] ++


++ Allied Detachment (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1,231pts] ++

+ Troops +

Breacher Siege Squad, Legion [520pts]: 9x Breacher Siege Space Marines, Legion
. Additional Wargear: 2x Flamer
. Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion: Artificer Armour, Bolter
. Land Raider Phobos: Armoured Ceramite, Auxiliary Drive, Dozer Blade, Extra Armour, Frag Assault Launchers, Heavy Bolter, Hunter-killer Missile, 2x Twin-linked Lascannon Sponsons

+ HQ +

Praetor, Legion [475pts]: Digital Lasers, On Foot, Solarite Power Gauntlet, Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. Master of the Legion
. . Terminator Command Squad, Legion: Chainfist, 3x Power Fist, 4x Space Marine Chosen, Legion, 4x Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. . . Standard Bearer, Legion: Chainfist, Vigil Pattern Storm Shield
. . . Tartaros Pattern Terminator Armour
. Tartaros Pattern Terminator Armour: Terminator Armour

+ Fast Attack +

Storm Eagle Assault Gunship, Legion [236pts]: Armoured Ceramite, Extra Armour, Searchlight, Tempest Rockets x 4, Twin-linked Heavy Bolter, Vengeance Launcher

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance:    VII: Imperial Fists, Loyalist

++ Total: [1,231pts] ++

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/08/04 04:49:59


 
   
 
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