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lets face it 90% of your opponents are going to bring an eradicator squad, so you should be looking to alpha strike them off the table 100% of the time forcing your opponents to bring atleast 3 squads if they want them

Sounds good. But they are a threat from reserves too. Better to build limiting big juicy targets for them and having bodies to block their entry I think.

I mean they are 3 wounds, imo if you cant alpha strike them off the table, your anti-eradicator weapon can become anti-tank

Or build a list with plenty of redundancy or few big targets - you eradicated 3 intercessors isn't much of a threat

that works for marines but the rest of us need to bring tanks and gak

Thing is, there are very few instances where a Eradicator squad will be shooting at it's intended weight class. Sure, it can drop a Custodian Guard Squad, but it'll likely use all it's shooting, and still only do 150 points of actual work, before it's obliterated by the next squad. Knights however, are crapping there pants right now. The sheer weight of anti-tank firepower in 9th is kinda scary for big centerpiece lists. The Melta speeders and Melta bikes, and Melta Marines, it's all S8 AP4 4 damage!

bat702 wrote:
I mean they are 3 wounds, imo if you cant alpha strike them off the table, your anti-eradicator weapon can become anti-tank

Harlequin clown car spam has no problem of killing 6 x 3 squads of Eradicators in their first turn. Sure they are having fusion pistols on every Troupes model, but that is what you see nowadays most of the time.


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 Eldarain wrote:
Sounds good. But they are a threat from reserves too. Better to build limiting big juicy targets for them and having bodies to block their entry I think.

Just put a few Grots or Ripper Swarms or Scarabs on side borads within 9" of the edge. Then the coming in from reserve Eradicators is nullified. Remember to hide these "blocking units" behind high enough terrains so SM bolter fire cannot clean them up before turn 3, since now no one is taking TFC, they will be safe there. Then you are free to slaughter the rest of SM army.


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FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Thing is, there are very few instances where a Eradicator squad will be shooting at it's intended weight class. Sure, it can drop a Custodian Guard Squad, but it'll likely use all it's shooting, and still only do 150 points of actual work, before it's obliterated by the next squad. Knights however, are crapping there pants right now. The sheer weight of anti-tank firepower in 9th is kinda scary for big centerpiece lists. The Melta speeders and Melta bikes, and Melta Marines, it's all S8 AP4 4 damage!

Sure, IK is in a tough spot, but it is more about their inability to hold objectives and the reduced CP they can get. It is not much about the AT firepower. By my mathhammer, it need two units of 3 SALAMANDER or IMPERIAL FIST Eradicators with Heavy Melta Rifle and Multi Melta to bring down an IK with 4++. The units that are dead dead dead in front of Eradicators are Leman Russ Battle Tank, Baneblades, Land Raiders, Repulsors, Fire Prisms, and Maulerfiend, etc. The only vehicle that do not afraid of Eradicators is Harlequin Starweavers, which is effectively T8, base 4++ potentially 3++, and -1 to hit.

You forgot one unit dead in front of eradicators -- eradicators.
Turns out they are almost ideal to hunt other squads of eradicators with!

So, for gaurd, killing them is a trick, of course, but remember that they are very short ranged compard to real tanks, so you can kill them from behind 2 foot thick screens with your manticores (full payload) and your battle cannons and basilisks. Hope you brought some!

I think heavy hellblasters could be a good anti gravis option. They out range eradicators, can do good work vs a number of unit types, and can 1 shot gravis when overcharged. Alternatively I have used 3 inceptors with their d3 shot plasma pistols in deep strike as a counter. Sure the Eradicators will pop up and kill something, then the inceptors drop in within 18" of them and pop them back. Thats from personal experience with them anyways.

Eradicators are just in a stupid spot honestly.

Against a T7 3+ save vehicle, a squad of 3 with the 5pt ugpraded melta rifles get 6 shots, 4 his, 2.66 wounds for 2.66 x 3.5 + (4 or 6). So generally speaking they are incinerating a light to medium vehicle a turn.

Against less amazing targets...like Space Marine intercessors,

6 shots, 4 hits, 3.33 wounds for 3.33 dead Intercessors...or 60pts. That is still a damn good return on investment for a 135pt unit.

What about against Ork boyz,

6 shots, 4 hits, 3.33 wounds for 3.33 dead orkz or 24pts of dead Orkz. not great.

So because of their ridiculous shoot twice mechanic they are utterly OP against vehicles, against elite infantry/troops they are amazing, and against Hordes they are meh but not ignorable.


Because of how the 9th edition rules are written for reserves, they are incredibly hard to alpha strike and require a defending player to guard a 24' radius around any HVT.

With orks squadrons of light vehicles are good against eradicators. Cheap enough and those marines can only target a single model at once as walkers, artillery, buggies all split up from the squadron once deployed, becoming independent units. So no shooting twice allowed against those targets.

6 Eradicators will kill a Naut (340) or a BW/Bonebreaka (155/180) but only one buggy or dread (90/110) or 1-2 Smasha Gunz (40/80).

Still the most overpowered unit in the game and in need of a significant nerf: they can easily be 65-70ppm models and remain good.

Once people start to plan around that one squad of eradicators people are just going to bring three squads imo


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also everyone is all like ya, ill bring a horde of 150 orc boys but who really wants to paint 150 orc boys, then try and fit them all in one deployment zone too haha

 Blackie wrote:
With orks squadrons of light vehicles are good against eradicators. Cheap enough and those marines can only target a single model at once as walkers, artillery, buggies all split up from the squadron once deployed, becoming independent units. So no shooting twice allowed against those targets.

6 Eradicators will kill a Naut (340) or a BW/Bonebreaka (155/180) but only one buggy or dread (90/110) or 1-2 Smasha Gunz (40/80).

Still the most overpowered unit in the game and in need of a significant nerf: they can easily be 65-70ppm models and remain good.

Yep as for all bogeymen throughout 40k editions, they will get their point increase.
And then they will either fall into oblivion (except for dedicated Salamander players for who that unit has a special "lore significance", and because SM players have so many units to choose from that as soon as you mess with a few point increases here and there, another unit comes up on top right away), or still appear here and there if GW goes lightly on the point increase.

65-70 is too much though, a melta attack bike is 55, has one more wound, and is real fast. Between clowns with fusion pistols and SM units, GW will have to rethink a lot of anti tank weapon costs throught at least these two codex

I don't think that with the current design there is a point value where they are balanced. They go straight from auto include to "garbage, while good with faction x" to plain garbage.

The firepower of the unit is simply too much for an infantry model, points can't balance something like that.

They just need to lose the double fire OR go to range 12", at which point the current cost is fine.

Also, all the multimelta should now drop in range. Melta is supposed to be a short ranged weapon. The melta gun is range 12". Range 24" on the multimelta was fine when it was the only thing that it had over the assault version, now that it is a multishoot weapon it doesn't also need to be the high range one. Range 16" on multimeltas would make a lot of good to the game.

Spoletta wrote:
I don't think that with the current design there is a point value where they are balanced. They go straight from auto include to "garbage, while good with faction x" to plain garbage.

The firepower of the unit is simply too much for an infantry model, points can't balance something like that.

They just need to lose the double fire OR go to range 12", at which point the current cost is fine.

Also, all the multimelta should now drop in range. Melta is supposed to be a short ranged weapon. The melta gun is range 12". Range 24" on the multimelta was fine when it was the only thing that it had over the assault version, now that it is a multishoot weapon it doesn't also need to be the high range one. Range 16" on multimeltas would make a lot of good to the game.

GW recently messed with weapon profiles, there is absolutely no way they will dot it again in a near future. The only thing we can hope for is a point increase on the most problematic AT weapons.

Not to mention with everyone buying tons of primaris armies they have even less reason to do a significant nerf to eradicators

bat702 wrote:
Not to mention with everyone buying tons of primaris armies they have even less reason to do a significant nerf to eradicators

They have more reason to nerf them significantly actually. As soon as lots of players get their 9-12 dudes eradicators won't sell that much. Perfect time for encouraging SM players to replace them with new stuff!!!

So they let them be overpowered for now, no way they stay overpowered if they don't sell anymore. And the eradicators box isn't like ork boyz which you can buy 10-15 times, the max is 6 (18 models) but even meta chasers will probably settle with 3-4 boxes. Not to mention that a lot of players bought multiple halfs of indomitus, granting them all the eradicators they need. My bet is GW will nerf the eradicators quite badly as soon as they have sold enough of their 3-models kits.

 Blackie wrote:

bat702 wrote:
Not to mention with everyone buying tons of primaris armies they have even less reason to do a significant nerf to eradicators

My bet is GW will nerf the eradicators quite badly as soon as they have sold enough of their 3-models kits.

This 100% ! And people who bought that many boxes (again, except salamanders players) will be thinking "fool me once, the blame's on you. Fool me twice, facepalm. Fool me "metachasing every few months or so..." Yeah at some point buyers have to decide to not be victims anymore.

I think with the absence of tournaments and the mutated virus in the UK, we could be stuck with undercosted eradicators for a few months still, perhaps even half of 2021. It will bring back memories of editions prior to 8th, when we waited such a long time for the "company selling toys before rules" to actually try to improve their shoddy game

They are clearly out of line and competitive play is kinda a joke right now with covid and the edition being so young.

Just play casual games for the time being and request no erradicators...it is really that simple.

You're a bit behind OP. Alpha stiking units like eradicators with shooting IS the meta. Like others have said, eradicators actually do this the best.

Anti-meta is hordes with invun saves. There's a reason demons are suddenly doing so well again.

 Xenomancers wrote:
They are clearly out of line and competitive play is kinda a joke right now with covid and the edition being so young.

Just play casual games for the time being and request no erradicators...it is really that simple.

That can work but then both sides have to name a unit the opponent can’t take, so you don’t have just the Sm player being restricted. I am a xenos player but I can’t see myself asking for one sided restrictions against marines.
Harlequins have too few units and they seem even harder to beat than any Sm brand :(

Best way to get something nerfed by GW - spam it. Best counter to Eradicators is a look. A look to your opponent like they should be ashamed of themselves, a pulse in the corner of your lip to express disgust and a subtle head shake every time they mention the unit while immediately glancing away.

To beat eradicators, TAKE eradicators. Leave them in the spot to fire auspex scans with an ancient bearing banner right behind them.

Enter the enemy eradicators. Auspex scan. Fire twice. Hit on average 1 melta shot per arriving eradicators .. that kills a six man squad more or less immediately.

Then let them shoot at your (obviously terrifying) eradicators who sat out in the open looking bored. As each of their shots slams home, on a 4+ fire the eradicators double shot into them back as your guy dies. Killing, on average, another squad of six of them.

Move oyur second eradicator squad into EXACTLY the same position next turn, and watch your opponent's lip quiver as he says "My eradicators stay in orbit this turn...."

Dukeofstuff wrote:
To beat eradicators, TAKE eradicators. Leave them in the spot to fire auspex scans with an ancient bearing banner right behind them.

Enter the enemy eradicators. Auspex scan. Fire twice. Hit on average 1 melta shot per arriving eradicators .. that kills a six man squad more or less immediately.

Then let them shoot at your (obviously terrifying) eradicators who sat out in the open looking bored. As each of their shots slams home, on a 4+ fire the eradicators double shot into them back as your guy dies. Killing, on average, another squad of six of them.

Move oyur second eradicator squad into EXACTLY the same position next turn, and watch your opponent's lip quiver as he says "My eradicators stay in orbit this turn...."

Or just play Harlequin, -1 to hit, -1 to wound, 3++ save. 5 troupes dealing out 5 melta shots and 40 attacks Str5 AP-2 rerolling to wound. Isn't it much more simple than taking 6 Eradicators and Ancient for countering enemy Eradicators?

Classic GW game tactics thread. Always ends up "play what's currently broken"

 Eldarain wrote:
Classic GW game tactics thread. Always ends up "play what's currently broken"

I actually think that in casual games it is fine to ask an SM player to simply not take any eradicators (attack bikes are no joke either but at least they cost more points per melta shot), because they have tons of perfectly good units to pick from. In return the SM player asks you not to bring one unit. It was said just a few posts before.

So no, we are not just saying "play harlequins" (I much prefer facing eradicators than models each toting a melta pistols, being troops, and stacking defensive buffs like they were eating peanuts).

For comp play, no solution has been found other than "play this broken thing", or "play hordes" that is true.

It is not an eradicator only issue, and not even an SM only issue.

All multimelta platforms have been busted, and all non invul vehicles have become useless.

GW will 100% change this as soon as they notice that they are no longer selling all those vehicles.

True, but only 3-4 melta platforms at most are broken. So it's definitely a SM problem.

But I agree there's not really a specific eradicators issue: the SM codex is utterly broken even without taking eradicators.

 Blackie wrote:
True, but only 3-4 melta platforms at most are broken. So it's definitely a SM problem.

But I agree there's not really a specific eradicators issue: the SM codex is utterly broken even without taking eradicators.

Eradicators are under priced sure. But SM codex "being utter broken" maybe an over statement. Yes, some Chapters of the SM maybe quite strong, and no denying that SM as a whole is above average by quite a margin. But they are definitely far from "utter OP". At least, a decent built Crown Car fusion pistol caress spam plus Jetbike spam Harlequin army WILL stomp majority of Space Marine army. While many times even Tyranids with Kronos Gunline plus Genestealer blob road blocks could pull up a fair fight against SM and have a decent chance of winning.

Most of the SM dex is actually fairly in line with the rest of the game after all the long long series of nerfs upon nerfs that they got after the IH supplement.

The fact that it took something like 6 or 7 consecutive nerfs to get them to be just "good and competitive" is pretty telling of the state of those early SM times...

Now they are a mid/high tier dex that can play in the high competitive league thanks to a bunch of clearly overperforming models (Eradicators, chief apot and plasma inceptors) and to some excellent secondary choices and protection.