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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





You buy your lovely big cumbersome codex and drag it from game to game rapidly flicking through the pages trying to find rules and stats whilst playing and the GW provides a pdf with a load of rules changes that are sometimes careful changes to text and not just points updates. What a pain in the backside to then have to cross reference your codex with the print off updates to make sure your getting it right.

Isn’t it easier to just use the codex as it was released? Unless you have a photographic memory.
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






Unless it's a big change then not really. Most FAQs seem to be missed out Keywords or typos for me anyway, such as a 10 man named Kill Team being only 3 Power.
   
Made in nl
Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle





Not really, since most FAQ's so far are relatively light on content and it's not hard to remember for me at least. But then I play DG and my codex and FAQ aren't really extensive. If anything I'd like a few more pages in my codex for lore. 9th edition codexes are a bit too skimpy on lore for my liking if I'm honest. Makes sense for the Bible that is Codex: SM, less so for all the others that are half the size yet the same prize.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




My drukkhari FAQs mostly address abusable combos that I wasn't taking anyway. So my FAQ is mostly a mental note reading, "Some of the OP stuff got nerfed. Review if fielding formerly OP stuff."
   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





the FAQs are mostly pretty light, especially for the 9th edition stuff.

Sisters of battle basicly made offical what just about everyone but the most idiotic RAW TFG morons already knew

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in ca
Jinking Ravenwing Land Speeder Pilot



Canada

mrFickle wrote:
You buy your lovely big cumbersome codex and drag it from game to game rapidly flicking through the pages trying to find rules and stats whilst playing and the GW provides a pdf with a load of rules changes that are sometimes careful changes to text and not just points updates. What a pain in the backside to then have to cross reference your codex with the print off updates to make sure your getting it right.

Isn’t it easier to just use the codex as it was released? Unless you have a photographic memory.


In the interest of fairness I always play with the appropriate FAQ.

All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





I always try to play with all the FAQ's. Why wouldn't I?

 Galef wrote:
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Made in us
Frightening Flamer of Tzeentch





Please don’t complain about FAQs and errata. I played when GW almost never did them. It was way way way way worse. Imagine iron hand broken nonsense for YEARS. Rules arguments that were never settled etc. It is not that hard to print the FAQ and put a copy in the book. Sorry I am not trying to be mean but the alternative is much worse as I said.
   
Made in us
Daemonic Dreadnought




The dark hollows of Kentucky

Soooo......we're complaining about gw actually trying to fix things now? Some folks are never happy I guess.....
   
Made in us
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter







 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Soooo......we're complaining about gw actually trying to fix things now? Some folks are never happy I guess.....


I don't see this as trying to fix things, because they haven't addressed any of the fundamental problems (huge changes to one army at a time followed by years of nothing, zero playtesting, balance changes made seemingly at random). They're pushing FAQs more, sure. Despite all this supposed massive pivot to trying to make the game better the end result still looks a lot like 7th to me in terms of bloat and balance.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 xeen wrote:
Please don’t complain about FAQs and errata. I played when GW almost never did them. It was way way way way worse. Imagine iron hand broken nonsense for YEARS. Rules arguments that were never settled etc. It is not that hard to print the FAQ and put a copy in the book. Sorry I am not trying to be mean but the alternative is much worse as I said.


I don't think there's that much difference between Iron Hands broken levels of nonsense sticking around for years and a new army being Iron Hands broken levels of nonsense every few months, personally. The game's as much of a mess now as it was in 7th, it's just it changes so frequently you can't adjust or homebrew your way out of the mess as easily.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/20 03:24:10


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Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

I don't play with the actual codex, I just use photocopies of the stuff I bring to the table. It's like 15ish pages in total per game at most. Much faster than double checking stuff on the actual codex, which also doesn't get damaged by the frequent use.

Erratas are just an additional page or two of photocopies.


 
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran



Bamberg / Erlangen

I only bring Battlescribe print outs with me to a game and always use the latest FAQs.

Imperial Guard Space Marines
 
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






Why would I do that?

FAQs and Errata fix problems, for what reason would anyone want a more broken game?

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Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





 Jidmah wrote:
Why would I do that?

FAQs and Errata fix problems, for what reason would anyone want a more broken game?


yeah I don't get this bizzare additude among some people that FAQs and errata are bad. it's like... mind boggling.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in gb
Deadly Dire Avenger





Most FAQ and errata are addressing the blindingly obvious or fixing things the average player would never realise was broken anyway (e.g. minor wording changes to stop some obscure rules interaction etc.) I normally just give the document a scan every time it is updated in case there is anything interesting and only ever refer to it if I'm genuinely unsure if something in the codex is right. I keep a copy on my tablet in case but so far I've never had to refer to a FAQ in game. It really isn't a huge deal - it is just handy for GW to confirm "yes, we did intend this to work in this way" a few months after the codex release.
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer





Bristol (UK)

FAQ is better than nothing, but ideally GW should just not make the errors in the first place.

We're still seeing errors that someone familiar with the game reads once and goes "that can't possibly be right", Paragon Warsuits or Gaunts Ghosts are a great example. I find that an unacceptable level of quality for what is a pretty expensive book.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




NE Ohio, USA

 Jidmah wrote:
Why would I do that?


They've never put out a SAQ that you disagree with?
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






ccs wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
Why would I do that?


They've never put out a SAQ that you disagree with?


Shokk Assault Question?

Of course I don't think every FAQ is great and perfect, but neither are the rules to begin with. It doesn't change the fact that a game with FAQs and errata is vastly superior to one without.
Not to mention that for 8th and 9th very few FAQ and errata fit that bill - and the few that did were quickly reverted by GW.

I also doesn't really matter whether I "disagree" with rules. If someone asked to ignore a FAQ because they "disagree" with it, they would get a hard no from me unless it's an obvious mistake made by GW.
The only reason I can think of why a person wanted to play completely without FAQs and errata would be because they are trying to abuse something that has been axed.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/20 10:17:49


Earth is not flat
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We've been to the moon
Climate change is real
Chemtrails aren't a thing
Evolution is a fact
Orks are not a melee army
Stand up for science!
 
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

The entire set of FAQs for an army is like an additional page to carry, or 2-3 at most if we also consider those from rulebook and/or expansions. How can this be some kind of big deal?


 
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer





Bristol (UK)

It's not the weight of the FAQ that's the issue, it's the mental drag of needing to remember that the rule is no longer the same, or having to check both the rule and the FAQ when unsure.

Also, at least for me, having to print it is a ballache as I don't have a printer. So I'm left either roping in a friend or doing at work whilst the boss isn't looking (also not an option atm because I'm WFH).
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran



Bamberg / Erlangen

Couldn't you just note the relevant changes down in the same place where you save your army list?

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Made in gb
[DCM]
Ambitious Archon





Port Carmine

My opponent not using the most recent FAQ for their army is a deabreaker for me.

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Made in us
One Canoptek Scarab in a Swarm





I always use FAQs, but it can be annoying to have it all updated sometimes. I started playing Infinity recently, and while they're slow on FAQs, it is nice to have all of them at the touch of a button when checking a rule.

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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

I remember when GW did an edition FAQ and Errata - the week or so before the edition ended and a new edition came out... Yep you went the whole edition and got your answers on the last day pretty much before it all changed. Granted some of those changes were in codex which took time to update, but back then that was about as good as you could get.


FAQ and Errata today are fantastic - fast and updated regularly through the year. And honestly they are not that long - most are a short few value changes and the majority is more dealing with specific interactions or answering questions on how abilities play out.

If you can't print them you could write them down - the value changes are pretty simple to note out. Heck if you wanted you could neatly write them in the codex

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Made in ca
Excited Doom Diver






For me, any changes are big enough to remember, or not relevant to me. or I write them down into my book if needed. I don't bother printing them out, and maybe once every 5 games we actually need to look up an FAQ, and usually it's because it just came out a couple of days ago and one of us hadn't seen it yet.

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Made in us
Dive-Bombin' Fighta-Bomba Pilot






its usually just a few printed pages and slots right into the codex so yes. Also i find its the most aggrivating opponents who will not bring their FAQ and more importantly ignroe them to take the strongest most busted thing and try to use them in pre FAQ format pointing at their codex listing despite faqs having brought things down. These same people will also use points from codex or chapter approved depending on which is lower sometimes mixing and matching to get the most models possible. Fortunatly these players usually need that handicap and are rubbish at the game so I just smile nod and destroy them anyway.

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Annandale, VA

Gadzilla666 wrote: Soooo......we're complaining about gw actually trying to fix things now? Some folks are never happy I guess.....

Jidmah wrote:Why would I do that?

FAQs and Errata fix problems, for what reason would anyone want a more broken game?

BrianDavion wrote:yeah I don't get this bizzare additude among some people that FAQs and errata are bad. it's like... mind boggling.


Nobody's saying FAQs are bad. They're saying maybe for casual play the improvement they make to the game isn't worth the additional hassle of bringing a completely separate document that needs to be cross-referenced to resolve questions. A lot of them are a couple pages of niche rules interactions and then maybe one change that's a big deal and good to have authoritatively settled, so if you can just remember those major resolutions/errata/changes I find the FAQ itself is largely unnecessary for gameplay.

I don't agree that FAQs are burdensome, but there are other ways to deploy FAQs besides paper printouts that can address these concerns. For starters, it's a non-issue with a digital living ruleset, where FAQs and errata are integrated directly into the relevant entries. Does the app currently do that? (I honestly don't know)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/20 13:45:37


   
Made in it
Focused Fire Warrior





Casual play: you can do whatever you want, use points, power levels, made up rules... As long as you agree on everything beforehand of course.

Matched play or tournaments: FAQs are rules, you can't ignore them or pretend they don't exist.


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Hey team, when I started this thread it wasn’t complaining about the existence and purpose of FAQs, just a question about playing habits.

Otherwise I’d start a thread, not about GWs attempt to fix aspects of the game but to discuss the method by which they do this.
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






 catbarf wrote:
They're saying maybe for casual play the improvement they make to the game isn't worth the additional hassle of bringing a completely separate document that needs to be cross-referenced to resolve questions. A lot of them are a couple pages of niche rules interactions and then maybe one change that's a big deal and good to have authoritatively settled, so if you can just remember those major resolutions/errata/changes I find the FAQ itself is largely unnecessary for gameplay.


No, the question is literally about playing an unFAQed game, not about playing using the FAQ without having the physical document. And honestly bringing an army list is much more of a "hassle" than to bring a FAQ, and that isn't optional either.

If you hate flipping back and forth between FAQ pages and codex, there are solutions for that. Heck, just put a sticky note on each page that is affected by a FAQ and jot down four words describing what changed.

Earth is not flat
Vaccines work
We've been to the moon
Climate change is real
Chemtrails aren't a thing
Evolution is a fact
Orks are not a melee army
Stand up for science!
 
   
 
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