So you can't run what's in the box with Harlequins...

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**Hecaton**

The new Troupe datasheet got leaked, and it forces you to run 11 or more models to fun 4 or more fusion pistols per squad. This means that if you buy two boxes of Harlequins, you cannot run the special weapons you got in the box as a single squad, you have to buy more. GW has gone past "force you to run what's in the box" straight to "that's not good enough, we're going to restrict you."

It's honestly laughable, and the fact that it's only enforced on some factions makes it stupid.

**Waaaghpower**

... what's the problem here? GW includes more bits than you need in a troop kit, and that's... a bad thing?

Most kits have the opposite problem, where if you want to have a fully flexible unit you need to buy a half dozen boxes. Want your devastator squad to all have the same weapon? Better buy *four boxes* of devastators!

I find this much preferable - having more bits than you practically need is a good thing.

**Stux**

Sucks for anyone who already assembled and painted their Troupe in a configuration that is no longer valid.

That's the only problem I can see with this, though admittedly it is a big one for those affected.

**Slipspace**

I'm a bit confused here. Can you build any legal Troupe squad from the box? If so, you're just ending up with extra bits. That's potentially annoying for anyone assembling the squad before checking the rules but not exactly a heinous bait-and-switch.

It does suck for those who've already assembled the very common all-fusion Troupe units but I suspect this is a balance decision as GW doesn't want Harlequins to be the drive-by melta units in an Eldar army, especially now they've been folded back into a larger Codex.

**tneva82**

Balance reasons? Last thing gw worries about. No all fusion squads as kit doesn't come with enough

**Waaaghpower**

Stux wrote:
Sucks for anyone who already assembled and painted their Troupe in a configuration that is no longer valid.

That's the only problem I can see with this, though admittedly it is a big one for those affected.

That does suck, and GW does this about five billion times a day so I sympathize with anyone whose lovingly assembled and painted models are no longer going to see field time.

Though it's not a tenth as bad as the 'this wargear which we used to sell as part of the kit is no longer legal under any circumstances' change that happens sometimes. Guess who has two storm bolters glued onto all my Sisters of Battle Rhinos, an option that got arbitrarily yoinked for no reason at all?

**SamusDrake**

Sounds like they've only adjusted the rules as to what is included in the Troupe box.

Can a normal 5-Players unit still take two fusion pistols?

**Sarigar**

SamusDrake wrote:
Sounds like they've only adjusted the rules as to what is included in the Troupe box.

Can a normal 5-Players unit still take two fusion pistols?

Yes.

**Lord Damocles**

Waaaghpower wrote:
Guess who has two storm bolters glued onto all my Sisters of Battle Rhinos, an option that got arbitrarily yoinked for no reason at all?

All the additional storm bolters were melted down and recast as the heavy bolters which invalidated all of the prior Immolator and Exorcist models...

**Rihgu**

I'm confused. Each box comes with 6 players, or you can build 1 as a troupe master.

If you buy 2 boxes, you build 1 as a troupe master, and 11 players, and you have your 11 model unit with 4 fusion pistols.

Or you just build all 12 as players.

Where is the issue?

**Andilus Greatsword**

Lord Damocles wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
Guess who has two storm bolters glued onto all my Sisters of Battle Rhinos, an option that got arbitrarily yoinked for no reason at all?

All the additional storm bolters were melted down and recast as the heavy bolters which invalidated all of the prior Immolator and Exorcist models...

My Exorcists are so old that they don't even HAVE heavy bolters on the model itself.

**Gene St. Ealer**

Hecaton wrote:
The new Troupe datasheet got leaked, and it forces you to run 11 or more models to fun 4 or more fusion pistols per squad. This means that if you buy two boxes of Harlequins, you cannot run the special weapons you got in the box as a single squad, you have to buy more. GW has gone past "force you to run what's in the box" straight to "that's not good enough, we're going to restrict you."

It's honestly laughable, and the fact that it's only enforced on some factions makes it stupid.

I don't get this at all. It takes 2 boxes (3 really) to get enough fusions to outfit 1 squad with them. Why is this any different than "you should run what's in the box"?

I've said this before too, from a fluff perspective, it's not like every single Harlequin is armed with fusion; you hear much more about peppering targets with shuriken in the lore. IDK, I'm usually pretty easy to convince to get on the "GW bad" train, but not here, this post doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

-Sincerely, a player with 2500 points of Harlequins (in case anyone accuses me of bad faith arguing

)

**Sgt_Smudge**

Is this not the same situation as a Tactical Squad kit coming with a plasma, flamer, melta, and grav gun, despite only two of them ever being usable for the full box (and that's only if the squad is split as 2 5 man squads, with their own Sergeants, and no using the missile launcher in the kit in that case!)

It sucks if you'd built your models in a skewed manner initially, but you would have had to have gone out of your way to equip them like that, considering that apparently you don't get all those weapons in the same box?

**Solitaire88**

Has anyone ever actually been called on WYSIWYG on harlequin models? I play them, lovingly painted and converted. No one knows the difference between a caress, and embrace and a kiss. No one really looks to see if they're holding a shuriken pistol or a fusion.

I just tell people upfront what all my squads are equipped with. I keep it all the same so it's easy to track. If I'm running fusion boats, I tell them the ones in the starweavers have fusion pistols.

Is this a tournament thing? Do people get called out for harlequin weapons? I mean, some of my guys have spears and power fists and chainswords...

**ClockworkZion**

It could be a tournament thing to prevent cheating since the different weapons had different stats and now have different strats.

**Hecaton**

Rihgu wrote:
I'm confused. Each box comes with 6 players, or you can build 1 as a troupe master.

If you buy 2 boxes, you build 1 as a troupe master, and 11 players, and you have your 11 model unit with 4 fusion pistols.

Or you just build all 12 as players.

Where is the issue?

They only have 5 non-troupe master torsos in the box.

**Rihgu**

Hecaton wrote:
Rihgu wrote:
I'm confused. Each box comes with 6 players, or you can build 1 as a troupe master.

If you buy 2 boxes, you build 1 as a troupe master, and 11 players, and you have your 11 model unit with 4 fusion pistols.

Or you just build all 12 as players.

Where is the issue?

They only have 5 non-troupe master torsos in the box.

The Troupe Master is identified by the mask, not the torso, though...?

**jaredb**

There are enough torsos in the box to not build a troupe master's torso anyway. It's an option, not mandatory.

I'm going to need to make some small tweaks to my squads to get them legal for the new book, but I wasn't running 6 man fusion boats, so the change isn't going to effect me too much.

Yes, Rules will be out reflecting what you can build out of the box. We've had this discussion, for good or bad, it's nothing new and was expected.

**EviscerationPlague**

Slipspace wrote:
but I suspect this is a balance decision

LOL you actually believe that? How many Fusion Pisols does the kit come with?

**beast_gts**

This box contains everything you need to make a 6-man Harlequin Troupe armed with sword and shuriken pistol, including the option to include a Troupe Master. There are 6 sets of legs, all perched on outcrops of rock, with which to form the base of your miniatures. You have the choice of 7 different torso fronts and 5 torso backs, along with 3 extra backs sporting Harlequin jackets. You also get 6 swords of two distinct designs, 6 shuriken pistols, 6 harlequin’s kisses, 2 harlequin’s embraces, 2 harlequin’s caresses, 2 neuro disruptors and 2 fusion pistols. There is a power sword as well should you wish to upgrade your Troupe Master.

**Eihnlazer**

in other words, 2 box's would actually not quite get you 2 squads worth of special melee weapons which is unfortunate.

I think all the melee weapon strats require that the entire unit be equipped with said melee weapons.

You would have to buy 3 box's to have one unit fully equipped with all 3 of the melee weapon options. Thats not that big of an issue, as your gonna want at least 3 units of players anyway.

**kirotheavenger**

beast_gts wrote:
This box contains everything you need to make a 6-man Harlequin Troupe armed with sword and shuriken pistol, including the option to include a Troupe Master. There are 6 sets of legs, all perched on outcrops of rock, with which to form the base of your miniatures. You have the choice of 7 different torso fronts and 5 torso backs, along with 3 extra backs sporting Harlequin jackets. You also get 6 swords of two distinct designs, 6 shuriken pistols, 6 harlequin’s kisses, 2 harlequin’s embraces, 2 harlequin’s caresses, 2 neuro disruptors and 2 fusion pistols. There is a power sword as well should you wish to upgrade your Troupe Master.

From this description it sounds like the data sheet matches the box.

They've allowed you to build one Troup Master and 5 Harlequins from the first box, then all 6 from the second. Hence 11+

**Racerguy180**

beast_gts wrote:
This box contains everything you need to make a 6-man Harlequin Troupe armed with sword and shuriken pistol, including the option to include a Troupe Master. There are 6 sets of legs, all perched on outcrops of rock, with which to form the base of your miniatures. You have the choice of 7 different torso fronts and 5 torso backs, along with 3 extra backs sporting Harlequin jackets. You also get 6 swords of two distinct designs, 6 shuriken pistols, 6 harlequin’s kisses, 2 harlequin’s embraces, 2 harlequin’s caresses, 2 neuro disruptors and 2 fusion pistols. There is a power sword as well should you wish to upgrade your Troupe Master.

The underlined says it all...

Unless I'm not understanding what the meaning of words are.
6 players armed with Swords & Shuriken pistols, seems pretty clear to me.

**Hecaton**

Racerguy180 wrote:
beast_gts wrote:
This box contains everything you need to make a 6-man Harlequin Troupe armed with sword and shuriken pistol, including the option to include a Troupe Master. There are 6 sets of legs, all perched on outcrops of rock, with which to form the base of your miniatures. You have the choice of 7 different torso fronts and 5 torso backs, along with 3 extra backs sporting Harlequin jackets. You also get 6 swords of two distinct designs, 6 shuriken pistols, 6 harlequin’s kisses, 2 harlequin’s embraces, 2 harlequin’s caresses, 2 neuro disruptors and 2 fusion pistols. There is a power sword as well should you wish to upgrade your Troupe Master.

The underlined says it all...

Unless I'm not understanding what the meaning of words are.
6 players armed with Swords & Shuriken pistols, seems pretty clear to me.

Not actually accurate to the assembly instructions or pieces involved.

**Rihgu**

Hecaton wrote:
Racerguy180 wrote:
beast_gts wrote:
This box contains everything you need to make a 6-man Harlequin Troupe armed with sword and shuriken pistol, including the option to include a Troupe Master. There are 6 sets of legs, all perched on outcrops of rock, with which to form the base of your miniatures. You have the choice of 7 different torso fronts and 5 torso backs, along with 3 extra backs sporting Harlequin jackets. You also get 6 swords of two distinct designs, 6 shuriken pistols, 6 harlequin’s kisses, 2 harlequin’s embraces, 2 harlequin’s caresses, 2 neuro disruptors and 2 fusion pistols. There is a power sword as well should you wish to upgrade your Troupe Master.

The underlined says it all...

Unless I'm not understanding what the meaning of words are.
6 players armed with Swords & Shuriken pistols, seems pretty clear to me.

Not actually accurate to the assembly instructions or pieces involved.

Having built multiple 12-man troupes before Troupe Masters were a separate unit... I don't know why you think this? Have you built harlequins before?

**the_scotsman**

TLDR: Mad Guy On Internet Mad At Nothing.

**AnomanderRake**

Hecaton wrote:
The new Troupe datasheet got leaked, and it forces you to run 11 or more models to fun 4 or more fusion pistols per squad. This means that if you buy two boxes of Harlequins, you cannot run the special weapons you got in the box as a single squad, you have to buy more. GW has gone past "force you to run what's in the box" straight to "that's not good enough, we're going to restrict you."

It's honestly laughable, and the fact that it's only enforced on some factions makes it stupid.

You know the Harlequin box is six models, right?

**Hecaton**

AnomanderRake wrote:
You know the Harlequin box is six models, right?

Only 6 players, however.

**EviscerationPlague**

the_scotsman wrote:
TLDR: Mad Guy On Internet Mad At Nothing.

It isn't "nothing". They're doing the "what's in the box" datasheet.

**AnomanderRake**

Hecaton wrote:
AnomanderRake wrote:
You know the Harlequin box is six models, right?

Only 6 players, however.

...And? Two boxes is twelve models and four fusion pistols, which is a legal squad.