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Apparently creating threads where I basically insult fans of certain factions is becoming a trend with me. But no insult is intended! I've almost made this thread a few times in the last month or so, but the new Angron model and threads finally convinced me to do so.

Khorne fans. I love that you love your Khorne army. But from the outside looking in, aren't those armies a little... repetitive? It seems like all the khorne-specific units are just some variation on, "run forward, and swing your sword." (With the exception of the skull cannon). And the difference between a Khorne prince, a blood thirster, Skarbarand, and any other Khorne MC seems to be mostly acedemic; they're all going to be some variation on, "Lots of wounds. Lots of attacks. Does melee better than you." When I saw the Angron model, I figured it was prooobably Angron, but you could have told me it was any of the other Khorne MCs, and I'd have believed you.

I'm coming from a mostly aeldari background with lots of zany units that do weird stuff and can do that weird stuff in pretty much every phase of the game. So compared to that, twenty flavors "run forward and stab" just seems like it would lose its appeal after a while. Even compared to other CSM variants, khorne forces seem kind of one-note. Slaaneshi marines have weird guns and psychic powers that dovetail nicely with their daemon halves. Thousand Sons have interesting shooting and melee options to go with their metamagic subsystem plus daemon allies with some of the weirdest special rules. Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting, melee, and interesting unit synergy (thinking pox walker buffs and the aura mechanic). But Khorne? Khorne seems to pretty much be all melee all the time.

So tell me what I'm missing and why Khorne keeps dragging you back into the arena. Are Khorne armies samey? Is that part of the appeal? How do you feel about something like the old blood tithe mechanics that added a bit of complexity to the Khorne playstyle?

Sometimes one likes the simple things in life. Charge forward and end the enemy units before they end yours with massive amounts of attacks. Though if they did something with the mechanics from the old Daemonkin or AoS Khorne books one would be good too.

Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting

What variety in shooting?

sincerely,
Death Guard player

Seriously, I imagine with a new Khorne line the World Eaters will have about the same amount of shooting as Death Guard - ie. restricted to a certain subset.

chain axe goes "BRRRR!!!!"

Khorne is happy.

Khorne player happy.

What more is there to it ?

As a Khorne player of 20+ years: no, not really.

Yes, at their core your armies are about running forward and hitting things. But that's like saying a shooty army is all about picking an enemy and rolling dice, when it's obviously a lot more than that; a shooty army requires placement, forward planning, target priority, and having just enough manoeuvrability to nab objectives at the right time. Assault armies aren't really any different.

If Malakai Makaisson, the renowned Dwarven engineer could create the Goblin Hewer in WFB, it is only fair to assume that a thousand monkeys Khornate weaponsmiths working on a thousand anvils could eventually create a Chaos version.




EDIT: That first image was simply too wee.

 Eldarsif wrote:

Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting

What variety in shooting?

sincerely,
Death Guard player

Seriously, I imagine with a new Khorne line the World Eaters will have about the same amount of shooting as Death Guard - ie. restricted to a certain subset.

Plagueburst
Blight Haulers
Bloat Drones
PM with plasma + Blight launchers
Contemptors
Helbrute

then you get the meme picks :
Predator
Land raiders
sicarans

In an age of rules bloat some players appreciate relative simplicity to faction rules and tactics.

Every 40k army is either "Run forwards and swing your sword," or "Stand back and shoot your gun," interspaced with the occasional "Warble around and cast your powers." 40k is not a nuanced or complicated game.

Some factions reward you to combine the "stand back and shoot" guys with the "run forwards and swing" dudes, but it's still just the same gak with a slight variation. Even Eldar are little more than a glorified gunline / blitzkrieg melee bomb.

The only army in the game with literally any depth in gameplay is GSC. The way they're rewarded for shooting at enemies from different angles with different weapon and various LoS criteria. combined with their deployment and redeploy shenanigens, leaves them as the only faction not designed for brain-dead chimps with calculators.

 morganfreeman wrote:
Every 40k army is either "Run forwards and swing your sword," or "Stand back and shoot your gun," interspaced with the occasional "Warble around and cast your powers." 40k is not nuanced or complicated game.

Some factions reward you to combine the "stand back and shoot" guys with the "run forwards and swing" dudes, but it's still just the same gak with a slight variation. Even Eldar are little more than a glorified gunline / blitzkrieg melee bomb.

The only army in the game with literally any depth in gameplay is GSC. The way they're rewarded for shooting at enemies from different angles with different weapon and various LoS criteria. combined with their deployment and redeploy shenanigens, leaves them as the only faction not designed for brain-dead chimps with calculators.

Wow, what a wonderful and not at all insulting way to describe other players!

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting

What variety in shooting?

sincerely,
Death Guard player

Seriously, I imagine with a new Khorne line the World Eaters will have about the same amount of shooting as Death Guard - ie. restricted to a certain subset.

Plagueburst
Blight Haulers
Bloat Drones
PM with plasma + Blight launchers
Contemptors
Helbrute

then you get the meme picks :
Predator
Land raiders
sicarans

That's not really variety unless you put your bar low. You also forget the standard flamers, autocannons, and meltas. I do not fault you, however, as nobody ever picks those options except for the lulz.

I mean, if this is variety then I guess Khorne will have variety? Because Khorne is going to get the meme picks, the Helbrute, and the contemptor - that's 5 out of 9 already you already listed. Then they might have their daemon cannon thingy and probably some Special K because they are very likely going to get a fleshed out force much like Death Guard did in the beginning of 8th. I mean, they already have Khorne Lord of Skulls which has a huge belly cannon. Now that I mention it Epic 40k did have a few large Khorne vehicles that had shooting so who knows what the future holds for World Eaters.

So we solved the equation - if we take that DG shooting has variety: Khorne shooting will have variety.

Yeah I was going to mention the Lord of Skulls has some pretty hefty guns on it. Used to be that you could just make any ol unit a Khorne unit, and that would have included Havocs, Obliterators and other firepower-focused units.

No more than most Tau armies I expect.

The monotony of Khorne forces is entirely down to how much GW "Space Wolfs" us in the upcoming Codex.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The monotony of Khorne forces is entirely down to how much GW "Space Wolfs" us in the upcoming Codex.

I for one look forward to "blood Lords, with blood axes, riding bloodbeasts, with the blood lust special ability!"

BrianDavion wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The monotony of Khorne forces is entirely down to how much GW "Space Wolfs" us in the upcoming Codex.

I for one look forward to "blood Lords, with blood axes, riding bloodbeasts, with the blood lust special ability!"

Don't forget to stay within your Bloodsecrator's Blood rage gore aura to allow you to access the tides of blood secondary anger phase that states in the second battleround every other tuesday (or wednesday on a leap year) you can gain an additional attack with the Blood Axe of gore rage

Do Your Armies Not Feel Monotonous?

It's a question that can be asked to Tau, AM, Imperial/Chaos Knights and Custodes players as well, not just Khorne guys.

I play AM and yes, it is monotonous, but also fluffy and the models are awesome. I also like to differentiate the armies by a significant margin and making a few factions pretty one dimensional might be great game design as long as they're balanced appropriately.

 Blackie wrote:
Do Your Armies Not Feel Monotonous?

It's a question that can be asked to Tau, AM, Imperial/Chaos Knights and Custodes players as well, not just Khorne guys.

I play AM and yes, it is monotonous, but also fluffy and the models are awesome. I also like to differentiate the armies by a significant margin and making a few factions pretty one dimensional might be great game design as long as they're balanced appropriately.

The problem with guard is, that it shouldn't be monotonous.

The problem with later three is honestly their faction design as it stands at the moment is unhealthy and selfskewing by nature for the game. Basically they are too bad designed to not be monotonous, same with an all clowns army.

Not Online!!! wrote:


The problem with guard is, that it shouldn't be monotonous.

No? It's a pure shooting army with maybe a single melee unit in the entire codex.

Not Online!!! wrote:

The problem with later three is honestly their faction design as it stands at the moment is unhealthy and selfskewing by nature for the game. Basically they are too bad designed to not be monotonous, same with an all clowns army.

Clowns are highly mobile, have solid psychic, shooting and melee phases. Sure they're an elite army with a grand total of 8 datasheets to choose from, but they're definitely not monotonous.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting

What variety in shooting?

sincerely,
Death Guard player

Seriously, I imagine with a new Khorne line the World Eaters will have about the same amount of shooting as Death Guard - ie. restricted to a certain subset.

Plagueburst
Blight Haulers
Bloat Drones
PM with plasma + Blight launchers
Contemptors
Helbrute

then you get the meme picks :
Predator
Land raiders
sicarans

PBC is a very unique and great shooting unit, absolutely.
Everything else is either default imperium guns or blight launchers, and being forced to add FW units to even get the list to go above 4 is quite telling how varied DG shooting is

 Jidmah wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

Even the Death Guard have a variety of shooting

What variety in shooting?

sincerely,
Death Guard player

Seriously, I imagine with a new Khorne line the World Eaters will have about the same amount of shooting as Death Guard - ie. restricted to a certain subset.

Plagueburst
Blight Haulers
Bloat Drones
PM with plasma + Blight launchers
Contemptors
Helbrute

then you get the meme picks :
Predator
Land raiders
sicarans

PBC is a very unique and great shooting unit, absolutely.
Everything else is either default imperium guns or blight launchers, and being forced to add FW units to even get the list to go above 4 is quite telling how varied DG shooting is

Oh ok, you meant that you wanted DG exclusive shooting.
And 9 blight hauler is a loooot of heavy shooting on pretty resilient platforms

9 pbc isn't what i'd call varied shooting either tough

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
Oh ok, you meant that you wanted DG exclusive shooting.
And 9 blight hauler is a loooot of heavy shooting on pretty resilient platforms

Uhm, a MBH is just a MM/ML hellbrute with more movement speed and a 5++. I don't think that counts as variety by any metric.

As someone who love melee combat, not really. Also, Khorne Space Armies do have access to a lot of good shooting. A Khorne-marked Iron Warriors army could easily be the best of both worlds.

So dg has shooty units except when people add lots of additional restrictions on what counts.

Ok ig has no variety on shootings. It's just human with guns(no variety) or vehicles with guns(no variety) or fw(no variety)

tneva82 wrote:
So dg has shooty units except when people add lots of additional restrictions on what counts.

Ok ig has no variety on shootings. It's just human with guns(no variety) or vehicles with guns(no variety) or fw(no variety)

You probably should look up what the word variety means, you clearly don't know.

Just the IG infantry squad by itself has more variety in regard to shooting than codex DG does as a whole.