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If they used cloning, i doubt that they would even consider it for the Astartes, because they are far too important to the survival of the Imperium. If they massed produced Guardsmen, it might work for a few generations before the genetic structure of the original copy unravels and mutates. And then there is the whole problem with the replication of the soul, etc. Overall, they way they do it right now works just fine.

Manchu wrote:Cloning technololgy is available to the Imperium. The DKoK are clones.

I'm pretty sure this is not true, and i have no idea where you got this idea. DKoK are all normal people born from mothers. their steeds are clones, but not the soldiers.

Foxy_Grandpa wrote:

Manchu wrote:Cloning technololgy is available to the Imperium. The DKoK are clones.

I'm pretty sure this is not true, and i have no idea where you got this idea. DKoK are all normal people born from mothers. their steeds are clones, but not the soldiers.

Then you'd pretty much be wrong.

IAs 5-7 all contradict your statement, in stating that a large quantity of the ground troops utilized by the Death Korps of Krieg are vat-grown clones.

Hence why very few Kriegers actually have names, rather than just serial numbers.

Citation please.

I own all three of those and i have never seen where it says that.

all of the DKoK have names and serial numbers. (at least i thought)

what page of what book says that?

Discarding the comments on cloning normal astartes in bulk which I agree with although I've never heard of the Imperial war machine being limited in terms of funds. My main point was the value of cloning the primarchs. Now forgive me but I can't help but think that even if they don't have the experiences and memories of their originals they would still have the genetic make up of the original which means they would develop in the same rapid way and quickly become master tacticians and warriors especially when "raised" amongst their respective chapters which where created in the vision of their primarch. This would be a great asset to the individual chapter as well as the Imperium as a whole

WHY DO YOU ALL IGNORE THE FACT THAT CORAX TRIED TO CLONE MARINES AND IT WENT TO HELL?!

Sorry for caps but that rather cements the issue:

If. You. Clone. Marines. Bad. Stuff. Happens.

Well. Considering that one of the Emperors Children Apothecaries (forgot who) successfully cloned alot of soldiers and met great success.

Which makes me ask the question, why didn't the Emperor simply clone himself?

Then he would have Primarchs with all his physical, and perhaps mental abilities. Which makes me think it is a control issue... breed too many supermen, and you lose control. Granting only limited abilities, that are watered down from Emperor to Primarch to Space Marine allows the Emperor and Empire to retain a chain of command. Make the Space Marines sterile, to avoid spreading super traits to mankind. The process must remain difficult, to control Space Marine numbers, but not so difficult to prevent having enough. And you would rather have the geneseed slowly degrade vs. possibly improve over time.

Warprat wrote:Which makes me ask the question, why didn't the Emperor simply clone himself?

The Emperor wanted sons. As the Emperor tried to have children but he failed. As women usually exploded when he did it with them

Nurglitch wrote:Citation please.

IA volume 5. No page number, but I distinctly remember it being implied on the page about the Watchmasters for the Grenadiers.

So it's not actually the case that the Death Corp are cloned, it's simply a leap of logic you made because you thought it was implied. So noted.

It's a completely reasonable leap of logic considering the statement in that very same book that the standard foot soldiers have no names, just numbers, even before they enlist within the Grenadiers(wherein they don the skull-faced respirators to show that they're "Dead Men Walking").

There's also a statement that, right before that statement, the Death Korps of Krieg, due to the fact that they really don't have a stable population are the only world in the Imperium that's given carte blanche by the Munitorium to use clone technology.

So, tell me. How do you read that, when the only people we've seen with actual names have been high ranking Krieg officials or Commissars(who actually aren't from Krieg proper)?

Asherian Command wrote:Well. Considering that one of the Emperors Children Apothecaries (forgot who) successfully cloned alot of soldiers and met great success.

Are you talking about Fabius Bile? That did not go well at all.


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Kriegers are mass-produced in vats. I assumed they were clones but I guess they could just be test tube babies. Either way they're mass produced on a production line like their lasguns.

You are aware that leaps of logic are by nature unreasonable, right? Leaps of logic bypass the steps that certify that a conclusion is valid. Deductive logic proceeds by making no leaps, and cautiously bases each new step on the proceding steps using either valid rules of reasoning, or truth-preserving inferences. So long as the premises are true, the conclusions will also be guaranteed to be true.

Inductive logics can make short leaps of logic, provided that they are well-justified, and the conclusion is acknowledged to have some possibility of error since it is not fully justified by valid rules of reasoning or truth-preserving inferences.

Moving from the notion that a numbering system instead of names to the notion that those so numbered are clones is completely unwarranted. The Romans, for example, tended to give their children numbers until their survival was sufficiently guaranteed to give them names (and presumably get emotionally attached). Indeed, if you want to dehumanize people, so that they might act like the Death Corps for example, giving them numbers instead of names is an effective way of discouraging human contact.

As for the notion that there's a bald statement to the effect that Krieg is the only world permitted to use cloning, you still haven't cited the source you are paraphrasing, or given us a quote so that we can check that you're paraphrasing accurately.

I repeat: Citation required.

Krieg has been given special dispensation by The Mechanicum to use the normally heretical "Vitae womb" technique. They were given this special permission due to their badassery.

I figured they're naming goes alot like Clone Troopers of Star Wars. They have a number officially but end up getting nicknames eventually.