Changes (Hikes!) to GW International Shipping

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**Kirasu**

Yeah, next price increase will be attributed to Kirasu for his dakka post on US gamer income

**GrimTeef**

I wish there was something that we gamers could do to circumvent practices like the price disparities and shipping shenanigans.

It would be nice if somehow we could organize a method where we could order something from our favorite local store (in my case it would be one in the States here) for someone in, for example, Australia or Japan, and then ship that item to the person in Australia or Japan and just cut out this ridiculous mark-up that GW is trying to get.

I'd be a way to get the playerbase to help each other out.

It's total pie-in-the-sky thinking, and people can take all kinds of advantage if they are that sort, but it would be very cool if something like this could be worked out to the benefit of the players.

I dunno. I just feel for the folks in this trap.

**insaniak**

nosferatu1001 wrote:Insaniak - In fact this pricing segmentation is not going away - it is remaining. Levis went to court not so long ago to ensure this. Same for Hermes, and other brands. When it comes to physical goods you have a LOT more control than data. The EU even has specific laws regarding this, which is why GW are allowed to restrain the export by Maelstrom et al outside the EEA. (and, if it mattered, INTO the EEA as well)

The fact that some companies are fighting the change kicking and screaming doesn't make it any less a relic of a bygone age. It will change... because as more and more of their customers take to buying online, companies will find that they don't have a choice if they want to keep those customers.

nkelsch wrote:How does international shipping get past all these countries customs? I can barley get an ebay product from overseas or to without someone lying saying it was a gift of a 2$ toy from grandma to get it out and in to some of these countries.

Doesn't customs snatch up all these international shipping deliveries and make people pay taxes or confiscate them all together? Who is 'liable' for a package gone missing in customs when you buy internationally?

Customs charges vary for different countries. Australia has no Customs duty or taxes on most incoming packages under $1000 in value. Certain companies have been lobbying for that to be changed (One of our big electrical/household chains was in the media a year or so ago complaining very loudly that buying from overseas instead of supporting Australian businesses was 'un-Australian'... Of course, this is a store that is full of product imported from China, so make of that what you will...) but even if they do wind up adding GST onto incoming purchases, the sheer disparity in pricing between here and the rest of the world makes for some pretty sweet deals when you're used to paying Oz prices.

I treat the 'disposable income' argument with a certain amount of skepticism. Averages don't tell anything like the real story... There is a huge divide in income levels here, which skews the average away from anything even closely resembling reality. I would strongly suspect that the majority of the customers that GW is trying so hard to estrange have a damn sight less disposable income than GW think they do.

**Azazelx**

Kirasu wrote:I SERIOUSLY doubt that the disposable income in australia reflects the price that australians pay. Im sorry I don't believe for a second that australians have double the disposable income as American gamers.

I would wager that american gamers have *more* which totally blows that excuse out of the water. However, I would believe that the price difference is due to a smaller market that has a similar income level to America and Euroland thus they need to gouge the people that do pay, and now restrict the ability of those who wont pay from buying overseas. Its a classic example of how mercantilism (tariffs) are used when you have a monopoly on a given market (As far was Warhammer goes, GW is the only producer). It's just a bizarre circumstance because they're being protectionist against themselves

Australian prices aren't based on disposable income, but on the exchange rate from about 5 years ago - with annual price rises, repackaging price rises, etc, etc added in. Lots of local prices for things spiked when the dollar nosedived back then, as businesses that import their stuff had to survive, and fair enough. What has happened since is that they have kept their prices at that level, since they "don't know when that could happen again and we would lose money" but more meaningfully because they're now enjoying the increased profit between the old exchange rates and the new.

Even concert tickets did this. Jumped, and stayed high. GW isn't alone in this kind of gouging practice.

**H.B.M.C.**

Computer games are like this as well. Before 'Next Gen Pricing' came in and everything became US$60, most games were US$50. The Australian dollar, worth roughly half that of the US dollar, meant that our games were $100.

US games jumped to US$60, ours got bumped to AUD$110. They still are, even though our dollar is now worth more (and for years was sitting in the high 80c/low 90c). Thankfully, for us Aussies at least, there are always alternatives.

**Azazelx**

insaniak wrote: Certain companies have been lobbying for that to be changed (One of our big electrical/household chains was in the media a year or so ago complaining very loudly that buying from overseas instead of supporting Australian businesses was 'un-Australian'... Of course, this is a store that is full of product imported from China, so make of that what you will...)

As you say - it was perfectly fine and "Australian" for HN and other big retailers to bypass the local manufacturing industry (killing it in the process) to purchase cheap product from China.
OTOH, it's "un-Australian" for consumers to do essentially the same thing and bypass the local retail industry (which has been happily marking things as high as they like) to purchase the same product from ...almost anywhere else in the world.

**H.B.M.C.**

Mr. Harvey got no where with that demand, so I wouldn't worry that much about it.

**zombie**

H.B.M.C. wrote:Mr. Harvey got no where with that demand, so I wouldn't worry that much about it.

but he did have one last whine that everybody was picking on him

**insaniak**

H.B.M.C. wrote:Mr. Harvey got no where with that demand, so I wouldn't worry that much about it.

Mind you, part of that was probably just down to his headlines being stolen by half the country sliding underwater. Give him time to get back up to steam... It will no doubt come up again.

It's a ridiculous argument, though. Adding a 10% GST to prices that are half what we're paying locally isn't going to discourage people from buying overseas.

I do still occasionally daydream about walking into Harvey Norman and demanding they show me their range of Australian-made TVs...

**HarlequinZero**

Not all companies do this price segregation junk. Apple, (yes, the electronics behemoth,) actually LOWERED their Japanese prices by about 20% earlier this year to make it less attractive for people to import Apple goods from overseas. I mean, with the ridiculously strong yen it's not like they're losing much of anything and, more importantly, they're protecting their Japanese retail division.

**H.B.M.C.**

I think Lego tries to keep prices consistant across the world as well. And even if they didn't, and even if they sold a lego pirate ship for twice as much here than over there, I doubt they'd slap a shipping charge 2600% the price of the items if I ordered it from overseas.

**Chibi Bodge-Battle**

Yeah but they build a big freight ship out of Lego and when it gets to the destination it is dismantled and boxed up to be sold

At least I think that is how it works

**SagesStone**

Guess it would make their pirate Lego ships seem more authentic.

It's sort of depressing this news wasn't actually surprising to me.

**Azazelx**

And just as I noticed that the Iron Hands Boxed set is actually reasonably priced in the UK.. I don't really want to do another GWUK order via Germany, though.. :p

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H.B.M.C. wrote:Computer games are like this as well. Before 'Next Gen Pricing' came in and everything became US$60, most games were US$50. The Australian dollar, worth roughly half that of the US dollar, meant that our games were $100.

US games jumped to US$60, ours got bumped to AUD$110. They still are, even though our dollar is now worth more (and for years was sitting in the high 80c/low 90c). Thankfully, for us Aussies at least, there are always alternatives.

Yeah, I've been buying from xbite and zavvi for a couple of years now.

Also, Steam sale gifts from a mate in Canadia.

**SickSix**

It is really frustrating to see these type of business practices from a company that has an IP that I love. Something needs to change.

**Kirasu**

Most likely the only change that would help is one of your location

**HarlequinZero**

Got this in my email the other day from GW Japan:

Dear Customers,

Thank you for your messages regarding the price rise of the shipping fees from the UK/USA to Japan.

I can understand your frustration in not being able to enjoy a service you where very comfortable with, and we are very sorry that you are feeling upset. Many of you mentioned they wouldn’t receive a reply from Games Workshop, but since we take pride in our customer service I am very glad to share some thoughts and explain the reasons why we had to take such a decision.

Concerning the English language support, we understand that a lot of English speaking foreigners find it hard to understand Japanese. We won’t leave you alone to deal with the Japanese web store by yourselves. We are happy to provide you with guidance, and help to place your orders. I will be more than happy to help you ordering your items through the Japanese web store. You will enjoy an easy and straight forward service with reliable and inclusive prices.

English Language Support Benefits:

l Japanese Bilingual Customer Service:

You can ring from Monday to Friday at 03-3296-3512, and I will personally provide help and guidance to either place an order on the Japanese webstore or placing an order on your behalf using the Customer Service System.

l Access to all of the English and Specialist Games range:

Simply browse through the other countries web stores and once you have decided what products you need just ring the Customer Service Team we will be able to place an order on your behalf. You can also find the same English language products on the Japanese web store in the related section.

Now I think are in order some explanations about the recent changes in the shipping fees. You might not know that shipping items from a country to the other is extremely expensive and the process is very long and often difficult. These difficulties are reflected by the shipping prices most companies will charge you when you send products from a country to another. Games Workshop unfortunately is no different then other companies and we have to face a lot of costs during the shipping process. Until now Games Workshop UK/US where absorbing this extra cost but the actual economic situation does not allows Games Workshop UK/US to absorb these costs any longer and as a consequence the latter are reflected on the shipping charges to our customers.

In case you are not convinced I would suggest you check the shipping fees companies such as UPS or DHL charge their customers you will be surprised as I was when I asked.

Games Workshop Japan as well is facing costs that are not influenced by the exchange rate (wages, rents etc.) therefore if you add all together this factors you will undoubtedly have higher prices, but on the other hand through the Japanese web store we are able to offer much better shipping fees and services to our customers

Japanese Web Store Benefits:

l Access to the full range of Games Workshop products and English language products. (Note that this is a service we only offer for Japan, if you want to buy for example an Italian Codex from Japan you will have to do that from the Italian web site with related shipping fees!)

l Inclusive Japanese Shipping Fees:

1) Free shipping for orders over 10.000 Yen

2) Standard Shipping 750 Yen (orders under 10.000 Yen)

3) Express shipping 2250 Yen (1500 Yen for order over 10.000 Yen)

4) Cash on Delivery Service 2250 Yen (1800 Yen for orders over 10.000 Yen)

5) Access to all of the English language products and Specialist game range

I hope this message can give you an idea of why certain decisions where made and I hope you will understand the future benefits these changes will make possible.

Sincerely

Games Workshop Japan

Customer Service Manager

Giovanni Allari

So, apparently GW UK has been eating 40~50 GBP losses on each and every package to Japan! Yet they don't change their shipping policy to any other country on the planet? Hmm....

**AlexHolker**

HarlequinZero wrote:So, apparently GW UK has been eating 40~50 GBP losses on each and every package to Japan! Yet they don't change their shipping policy to any other country on the planet? Hmm....

It's the exact same response as last time they screwed us: lie their asses off and hope nobody notices. A two kilogram (~4.5 pound) package would cost 23.13 pounds to ship to Japan or Australia via Royal Mail Airmail. cite To reach 60 pounds you'd have to be sending 5 kilograms (11 pounds). A Hammerhead does not weigh 5 kilograms. A 12mL bottle of paint does not weigh 5 kilograms.

**Howard A Treesong**

They claim to send by UPS/DHL.

Now those are expensive, but you can post royal mail with full insurance for up to £500 for a fraction of the cost.

I posted a box of CDs weighing 1.2kg to Australia and stuck the insurance on top and it came to £20.

**H.B.M.C.**

HarlequinZero wrote:So, apparently GW UK has been eating 40~50 GBP losses on each and every package to Japan! Yet they don't change their shipping policy to any other country on the planet? Hmm....

They have. Shipping to Australia is now sometimes more than the item itself.

Anyway...

GW wrote:You might not know that shipping items from a country to the other is extremely expensive and the process is very long and often difficult. These difficulties are reflected by the shipping prices most companies will charge you when you send products from a country to another. Games Workshop unfortunately is no different then other companies and we have to face a lot of costs during the shipping process.

Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak. Bull gak.

It does NOT cost £60 to ship a pot of Skull White to Australia. You were not eating those costs. Total and utter bs.

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Howard A Treesong wrote:They claim to send by UPS/DHL.

Also bs. If they shipped UPS, it would arrive via courier (like the box I got from FFG the other day which did come via UPS). Every GWUS and GWUK item I have ever ordered has come via surface mail (either USPS or Royal Mail). And none of these services cost as much for international shipping as GW claims. This isn't the turn of the 20th century. Shipping is pretty normal.

**Temujin**

Is having some customer service guy lie through his teeth supposed to make the situation better? Granted, I was already dissatified enough before this latest insult to put me in boycott territory, but every time they try to explain why they're treating us like dirt it just makes me hate them even more. If they'd just stopped international shipping altogether it would have been much less aggravating, but instead they've decided to close it down by inventing hilarious charges to ensure that it is more expensive in every possible scenario, which has the same practical effect with twice the insult value. Then we have the ungratifying spectacle of this Giovanni guy asking us to believe that it actually costs £60 to send a pot of paint to Japan. The fact that he's specifically addressing foreign residents who are invariably well acquainted with international shipping costs makes it all the more absurd.

My current project is missing a few models that I'd quite like to pick up. It's well within my means to buy these, even at the stupid prices they charge in Japan, but I'm resigned now to the fact that I will never buy them, because the ill will that GW has amassed with me is simply unsurmountable.

At the end of the day GW thinks that it can manipulate me into spending my money in the manner most advantageous to them, and I won't have it. They think they can just keep piling on punitive restriction after punitive restriction until all customers relent and behave as GW would like them to - visiting their stores to receive their weekly allocated dose of sales propaganda, buying their monthly sales catalogue to find out what new products they're releasing tomorrow, and buying our models at the full retail price they've jacked up as far as they feel they can get away with in our local currency. If GW wasn't happy with the money they were getting from me prior to all this embargo nonsense, they're welcome to dispense with my business. The idea that they can herd me towards their ideal by banning my avenue of purchase and repeatedly feeding me lies about it is laughable. Until they can restrict my option to just stop buying their products, this manipulation strategy of theirs is doomed to fail.

**Aspiring Champion**

Spot on, Temujin. I didn't think GW could insult my intelligence more than they already had with the embargoes. Yet, here they are, doing just that. They've taken away any joy I get from my GW minis. I have no interest in actually doing anything with them anymore as just looking at them reminds me of how GW is treating me like dirt. It truly feels like a slap across the face, and when I turned the other cheek, they slapped that one, too. Only a complete rescission of the embargoes along with an apology will ever see me buying anything from GW again.

**Azazelx**

Simply a load of BS.

Still, I continue to buy their products. I just use other methods. Yeah, I know, I'm not exactly "sticking it to the man" buy buying their crap from overseas, but hey...

**SteveimusPrime**

H.B.M.C. wrote:Check Dicebucket. I know they still ship to Australia, they might ship to Japan.

Have any Australian players used Dicebucket? They seem to be one of the only places that don't want to bend us over and take all our money.

**H.B.M.C.**

I always put my money where my mouth is, and wouldn't reccommend them unless I had tried them myself. Dicebucket and Chaos Orc are both good stores that still ship over here.

**Miguelsan**

I wish Dicebucket would ship to Japan, I wanted to order some individual necrons and some Krieg but after GWs latest antics they´ll be lucky if I ever buy anything from an official shop/site again.

M.

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Howard A Treesong wrote:They claim to send by UPS/DHL.

Now those are expensive, but you can post royal mail with full insurance for up to £500 for a fraction of the cost.

I posted a box of CDs weighing 1.2kg to Australia and stuck the insurance on top and it came to £20.

Actually he doesn´t claim that as that would be a bald lie that could lead him to trouble, people used to recieve their stuff with Royal Mail markings (don´t know from now on what will happen) and by regular mail package to boot, not the fancy 24h/insured/trackable... type. He simply suggested you to check what UPS would charge to send something here with all bells and whistles. It would be akin to the Toyota dealership saying that they are not overcharging you on a oil change because Ferrari fees costs 10 times as much.

M.

**AesSedai**

I've met Giovanni and conversed with him, If I ever see him again (I'm sure I will) I'm going to have to call him out on that email. You can find him at GW Japan's office on the floor above the Jimbocho store, here in Tokyo.

Regarding shipping: What a load of BS. Someone needs to tell Giovanni-san that GW shills can put lipstick on a pig, but the foreign gamers of Japan won't be kissing it. How utterly insulting of him to expect that foreign residents of Japan are so ignorant of actual shipping cost. See H.B.M.C and the mysterious Case of the Skull White Paint.

Regarding service: The worst customer service I ever had from GW was at the Nakano store, relating to the Japanese webstore. If Giovanni is going to be a one-man bilingual support department, I suppose that's pretty cool of him and that will be a feather in his cap.

Temujin, don't let GW becoming their own worst enemy alienate you in the process. Buy online and ship it to Japan. You have to look harder, and your discount won't be as deep as it was before--but you can still get by especially when you consider the exchange rate.

Check it out--Do you like venoms? Well, I sure do!

Price of a Venom kit, shipped from America to my door as of today:

35.29 USD = 2,721.56 JPY

Price of a Venom kit PURCHASED OFF THE FETHING SHELF, without even considering exorbitant shipping prices (consider that Japanese customers have to spend the equivalent of $129.66 to even qualify for free shipping, by far the most of any country) is:

4,100.00 JPY = 53.1639 USD

Yeah, I think what I'll do is reward GW by buying none of their products directly through them and then use their great tables as I choose to play games with my friends. Also, when GW Japan withers and dies thanks to their ridiculous and insulting practices, I will start a gaming club or join the excellent Nerima-ku miniatures club and benefit from a hobby community that is pulled from the scores upon scores of GW hobbyists coming to Japan each and every year to teach English and/or study.

**MrFlutterPie**

Gw has been taking more and more control of their stuff for awhile now.

It's obvious that they are eventually going to move towards a monopoly on self distribution. The day is coming where the only way to get GW stuff is to buy it from a GW store or from GW direct service. GW will shut down all internet sales at some point. Look at all the crazy rules they have been putting online retailers for years now.

The writing is on the wall. They are moving aggressively to complete control of their product.

I am worried about the day they knock out ebay. Yes ebay is big enough to tell them to STFU but won't. GW will tell ebay you can't have their products on ebay's website. Ebay will comply simply because the legal cost of defending their right to allow GW products sold on their website will be more then what ebay is making off fees on GW products.

Mark my words in a few years you will only be able to buy GW stuff legally from GW themselves.

But won't this cost GW a ton of customers? Yes but they will make it up in increased profit margins. Say Gw makes a $50 and they mark it up 50% to make $25 a kit. But to sell it to a LGS/webstore they sell that $50 kit to them for like $35 so the Webstore/LGS. By only self disturbing GW now make an $10 on each $50 kit they sell. They will lose a lot of customers but the new profit margin will cover the loss of players. *These are rough estimates not actual facts* GW wants to cut out the middle man charge full prices and make extra money on each sale and if you don't like your screwed.

l

**Azazelx**

At a certain point though - the prices are just too high for parents and kids to support. Never mind us "hobbyists". With a Playstation 3 or 360 costing in the realm of AU$300 and games as cheap as $20... a Black Reach box can't compete with that.

**insaniak**

MrFlutterPie wrote:It's obvious that they are eventually going to move towards a monopoly on self distribution. The day is coming where the only way to get GW stuff is to buy it from a GW store or from GW direct service. GW will shut down all internet sales at some point.

Yeah, that won't happen.

In some countries it's illegal for them to 'shut down' internet sales. The only way that would happen is if they stop selling to independant retailers entirely. And that won't happen because GW stores just don't (and won't ever) have sufficient coverage for them to actually do that and not lose a hefty chunk of their market.

And I very seriously doubt that GW has anywhere near the clout they would need for eBay to just nod and say 'yussir' and ban GW product.