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Maybe they called FW to complain directly? I'd imagine the percentage of 40k players is somewhat larger then the percentage of people who also are Dakkaroos.

Ouze wrote:Maybe they called FW to complain directly? I'd imagine the percentage of 40k players is somewhat larger then the percentage of people who also are Dakkaroos.

Maybe, but that still doesn't explain why this is the first time anyone has said "Forge World model on a sprue, like Finecast!".

And apparently the German site emailed FW, which likely means that there's a posting of it on there.

Protests can also be individual complaints.

Meaning, individuals emailed FW directly and complained.

Agamemnon2 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:"Failcost" is in no way a legitimate term. It's a term used by those who think they're being clever.

Just like the Necron Fistbump .jpeg, they get very old very quickly.

You know what else gets old? Your incessant mewling about how Games Workshop is the greatest company in the world and how any criticisms of them, no matter how minute, are merely jealous trolling by internet troglodytes. Across the entire forum, your posting is a negative constant, like a black veil drawn across the face of all Creation.

Except that in this specific instance, he's right. And not carrying GW's water doesn't exclude people from being trolls - that would be you in this specific instance.

Back on topic

I don't really mind FW doing small thing like infantry or "mark xyz" armor bits in Finecast. I've received enough "spooged up" stuff from FW over the decades that a few small plastiresin defects won't cause me to suffer an anurism. If it's something I can't repair on my own without destroying detail or needing serious scupting skills, you can be certain I will return it for a replacement. Then again, I already do that. In fact, I order through my GW Battle Bunker specifically so I can do that and not have to deal with FW myself.

I don't know if they have plans to switch large models over to finecast or not. My Tantalus was cast in the normal FW resin so take that for what it's worth. Yea, gonna have to let that soak in hot water for a bit. :/

Except that in this specific instance, he's right. And not carrying GW's water doesn't exclude people from being trolls - that would be you in this specific instance

I don't even give a gak about the issue and I have no vested interest and I find it obnoxious. Whinehammer 40k is bitchy enough without every mistep of the company turning into a meme and being debated until the horse rides from the dead and puts me out of my misery with a bullet through the skull.

What's this about a horse riding from the dead?

Is there any chance that casting resin miniatures (since it seems rather unlikely that these are plastic-resin) on a sprue could result in a better quality product?

Kan brought up the idea that the sprues could help small bits from being lost or damaged.

Who said GW switched cause of metal costs? Thats completely ridiculous. The amount the price fluctuates when compared to how much material is being used is negligible. Shipping resin models over pewter saves a colossal amount on shipping costs from factory all the way to your flgs door. In addition to that resin casting requires no heavy duty machinery or smelting (ect..) so it puts less limitations on where it can be produced.

The mold lines are not the fault of GW or FW. It is a inevitability of the resin casting process.

Its obviously to early to tell on this, but i would be surprised if this thought had not crossed GW's mind.

So yes it is a concern, to be blunt its a huge concern. Not all of us have had great results with getting finecast replaced. i have yet to get any finecast model that i would consider being up to the quality standards i used to get with metal models. I have bought about 6 boxes/blisters over the course of time since it launched, none where up to the standards of metal GW models over the years. i bore these with nothing more than some moaning and groaning over coffee at my FLGS.
Recently, I bought a copy of bragg the gutsman for my son, I found numerous problems including some fairly large voids on the torso and weapon.
This time i call GW and explain things to them, the rep keeps asking what are the worst parts..can it be fixed with greenstuff, of course it could be fixed with greenstuff, i could make one from scratch with greenstuff (if only i had skill...) i explain that the weapon and torso both have significant issues. so what do i recieve in the mail days later, the weapon only, smeared in spots with blobs of greenstuff most of which fell off during shipping and the rest of which fell right off when i went to sand them to the proper shape. No replacement torso and another defective and ill repaired replacement for the weapon.

so ya..the idea of FW moving to finecast's materials and manufacturing method does concern some of us. yes i don't really think this is much of a sign that its happening..yet

The Grundel wrote:Who said GW switched cause of metal costs? Thats completely ridiculous. The amount the price fluctuates when compared to how much material is being used is negligible. Shipping resin models over pewter saves a colossal amount on shipping costs from factory all the way to your flgs door. In addition to that resin casting requires no heavy duty machinery or smelting (ect..) so it puts less limitations on where it can be produced.

The mold lines are not the fault of GW or FW. It is a inevitability of the resin casting process.

Other companies including GW and forge world itself manage to avoid it. It's not an inevitability, it's a side effect of a quality control process with a very forgiving view on what constitutes something that is 'miscast'.

The Grundel wrote:Who said GW switched cause of metal costs? Thats completely ridiculous. The amount the price fluctuates when compared to how much material is being used is negligible. ..............

Not really, the material in one one model is irrelevant, but in the hundreds/thousands/hundreds of thousands brackets it gets very relevant. If as a company GW are buying bulk supplies that fluctuate massively (as metal has done) then they do not have cost certainty on a significant amount of vital supplies. So swapping to a more predictable material will always be beneficial if it mimics metals characteristics.

I would suggest the real test of the cost of finecast (and GWs decision to implement it) is whether they hold the price of those models over the course of the next 2-3 years rather than a yearly increase.

Salaries and property cost should remain stable over that period, so assuming that oil (read transport) doesn't sky rocket it could be a good test of GW mettle [pun intended, yuck, yuck, yuck!]

If as a company GW are buying bulk supplies that fluctuate massively (as metal has done) then they do not have cost certainty on a significant amount of vital supplies. So swapping to a more predictable material will always be beneficial if it mimics metals characteristics.

I sure hope they continue to swap resin for metal. Very few times in life you actually see a dream come true and I hope in a few years I can look at a GW stock shelf and not see a SINGLE metal model. Those days can only come too soon!

That isn't really a praise of GW since I think finecast has lots of issues but my hatred for metal models exceeds virtually everything

Those guys do not look half bad.

If that is what you got from FW, consider yourself lucky. Didn't see too much flash, airbubbles, or mutant parts there, overall a good looking batch. ( Not $80.00 worth, but a good looking sprue none the less.)

Is this FW's regular quality now?

Kirasu wrote:

If as a company GW are buying bulk supplies that fluctuate massively (as metal has done) then they do not have cost certainty on a significant amount of vital supplies. So swapping to a more predictable material will always be beneficial if it mimics metals characteristics.

I sure hope they continue to swap resin for metal. Very few times in life you actually see a dream come true and I hope in a few years I can look at a GW stock shelf and not see a SINGLE metal model. Those days can only come too soon!

That isn't really a praise of GW since I think finecast has lots of issues but my hatred for metal models exceeds virtually everything

I think it will be a shame when all the metal miniatures are gone.
My first GW model was a metal warlock. There is something very special about metal models. I know they can be problematic to build/paint, but so can resin (if it isn't cleaned properly or if you try to drill it and use just too much force).

OT FW does some nice kits, and if they are using a sprue something "might" get better, such as staffs and servo arms.

Grot 6 wrote:Is this FW's regular quality now?

That's what I want to know. If sprues produce those results then I for one welcome sprues.

Kanluwen wrote:

Ouze wrote:Maybe they called FW to complain directly? I'd imagine the percentage of 40k players is somewhat larger then the percentage of people who also are Dakkaroos.

Maybe, but that still doesn't explain why this is the first time anyone has said "Forge World model on a sprue, like Finecast!".

And apparently the German site emailed FW, which likely means that there's a posting of it on there.

Yes, it couldn't possibly have happened because you haven't heard about it.

If they (FW) only tested it on a 'few' models, then it is more likely that the people that got those models don't whine on internet message boards, and more likely that they emailed directly or called.

SickSix wrote:
Yes, it couldn't possibly have happened because you haven't heard about it.

If they (FW) only tested it on a 'few' models, then it is more likely that the people that got those models don't whine on internet message boards, and more likely that they emailed directly or called.

I'd suggest you read the statement I'd originally replied to.

Kroothawk wrote:Actually someone told me today that people on the German gw-fanworld forum have actually emailed FW on that topic some time ago, FW acknowledged that they have actually silently used Finecast on some items and due to protests will refrain from doing it again in the future. I will check that later, when I have some more time.

So yes. It was apparently whined about on internet message boards, and there was an email there.

Yes, someone got wiff of FW+finecast and sent an inquiry. But the protestations specifically are not on the internet. Because, we all know if they were, we'd have heard about it. That was my point.

If the "protestations specifically are not on the internet" then why are they reputed to be on a German warhammer website, who reputedly emailed Forge World--who reputedly replied with an affirmative.

Do you see the problem here? This story is getting out of hand quickly.

He's saying the whole story is probably false, due to a lack of evidence.

Gee...it's almost like I've already said that repeatedly.

Then you guys are agreeing? Why are you arguing then? Why is this thread even open anymore? "Forgeworld is not using Finecast resin" isn't really news.

I tend to agree... 4 pages of redetive arguments from a handful of users is enough I think.

Discussion of the topic can perhaps continue when and if more info comes to light.

Just a quick addition.

From their FB page when asked about this

Finecast resin is not Forge World resin. While both are a two-part resin mix, Finecast with its additional 'flex' isn't suitable for manufacturing most of the FW range, although many of the techniques were trialed on some of our smaller kits such as heavy weapons teams. The customers in question have probably just received one of these kits.