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 Xenomancers wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Dudes armed with lasers backed up by tanks with gun turrets too small to actually fit crew and led by dudes wielding chainsword saws in a universe where melee combat is somehow effective despite automatic weapons and orbital bombardment are in liberal use, 40k makes no sense in a ton of ways

Whats wrong with making IG tanks look like actual functional tanks? I assure you. Design a new russ that looks more like an Abrams/challenger tank and it will sell tons.

To me - IG represent modern military - the more they look like modern military the better.

Well, the setting has always been rather anachronistic. Space Marine armor is patterned far more off knightly medieval plate than modern body armor for instance. Tanks have long been rather clunky steampunky designs, and the Guard has always been heavy on the WW1 aesthetic (inlcuding the old 2E Russ tank having box art with WW1 british tank stripe markings).

That said, they could definitely be done a bit better. I often use a shrunken Macharius design for my Russ tanks where it looks like a crew could actually fit (I don't think the guy that did these makes them anymore though).

 Crimson wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
If IG went to a new more modern looking battle tank look for their armor I'd instantly be hooked.

Oh, I missed this bit. Hell no! The Cadians already look too modern. The Guard needs to be more of a weirdly steampunkish anachronism mess, not less. Vostroyans were the right direction.

Hell no, give me tacticool Guardsmen.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Dudes armed with lasers backed up by tanks with gun turrets too small to actually fit crew and led by dudes wielding chainsword saws in a universe where melee combat is somehow effective despite automatic weapons and orbital bombardment are in liberal use, 40k makes no sense in a ton of ways

Whats wrong with making IG tanks look like actual functional tanks? I assure you. Design a new russ that looks more like an Abrams/challenger tank and it will sell tons.

To me - IG represent modern military - the more they look like modern military the better.

Well, the setting has always been rather anachronistic. Space Marine armor is patterned far more off knightly medieval plate than modern body armor for instance. Tanks have long been rather clunky steampunky designs, and the Guard has always been heavy on the WW1 aesthetic (inlcuding the old 2E Russ tank having box art with WW1 british tank stripe markings).

That said, they could definitely be done a bit better. I often use a shrunken Macharius design for my Russ tanks where it looks like a crew could actually fit (I don't think the guy that did these makes them anymore though).

Those tanks look great BTW.

Yeah, the Macharius design still looks anachronistic, but doesn't look quite as goofy as the Russ, so fits very well once reduced in size, wish they were still around

Darsath wrote:


I think he means play a different game. Something other than 40k or Games Workshop related. Check out the competition and see if anything interests you if 40k isn't quite doing it for you atm.

That makes it even worse. even in AoS, which is a GW rule, there is no army I could use the GK as anything. I put all my money in to a GK army, and I don't have money to start another one, Worse now am too scared to start anything else. What if it gets nerfed in 2 months, what if the firm decides to drop the faction, what if I will wait for 2-3 years and the stuff I have never gets better.

My dad told me that his friend that played WFB waited for like 8 years for a faction fix, and in the end GW made AoS and his army doesn't exist in AoS. Still 8 years is more then half of my life. Maybe it won't matter to someone that is 40, but to me it seems like an eternity.

Football; nature walking; photography; self defence; art; reading; writing; juggling; smithing; crafting; swordplay; knitting etc.....

Well my options are be a hooligan and end up in jail, beat up or killed. Go in to drinking or doing drugs. I am not good enough to do sports in any official teams, plus I don't like the people in school teams, they are crazy because of all the roids they take. Sword play or HEMA is actually interesting and there even is a Polish Saber club near where I live, only the gear costs almost as much as a w40k army, plus the trainer would have to be ok.

If your hobby is causing you more stress than joy, for whatever reason, you need to step away from that hobby for a while.

I don't get a lot of games anymore. most people told me it is a "waste of time" to play vs GK. they only let me play if I pay for the table and when I lose they can use it to play someone else, so if they table me in 15-20 min, they still get 40 min "free" time to play, they don't have to pay for. I want to at least get back the money I put in to the army and the play time cost. How I don't care. I know I can't sell the army, so I hope GW is going to fix the army. It makes no sense to me, why they aren't doing it. While keeping good armies good. They could at least nerf all armies.

 Xenomancers wrote:

Whats wrong with making IG tanks look like actual functional tanks? I assure you. Design a new russ that looks more like an Abrams/challenger tank and it will sell tons.

To me - IG represent modern military - the more they look like modern military the better.

It's a stylistic thing, in fitting with the whole brutalistic industrial sort of production line of guard equipment. Guard vehicles operate like WWI vehicles, slowly grinding forwards toward the enemy, surrounded by guardsmen. A modern design gives off much more of a vibe of driving around the battlefield at 40mph making computer-stabilised shots against a target a mile away. It doesn't fit. A Russ that looks like a modern MBT is a Russ that I absolutely won't be buying. I love the WWI aesthetic on guard vehicles. It's fitting, and anything that looks more modern than WWIIish is too modern for me. As for the troops, I want guardsmen who look like they've marched straight out of the 19th century. Praetoria over Cadia any day.

Depends on the regiments, the Guard is the most varied faction there is, so saying it as a whole operates the way you prefer is false, some regiments do, and most likely yours do, but it doesn't mean that a more modern/tacticool IG is impossible within the setting.

 Stux wrote:
I simply see this issue as personal burnout, and not anything on GW's part.

You can't stay enthused about one thing indefinitely. You'll get bored and want something different. If you're feeling that, play something else for a while. It'll come back around.

And this is why I rotate between painting, reading books, podcasts, and games. 40k is more than just playing the game itself.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Dudes armed with lasers backed up by tanks with gun turrets too small to actually fit crew and led by dudes wielding chainsword saws in a universe where melee combat is somehow effective despite automatic weapons and orbital bombardment are in liberal use, 40k makes no sense in a ton of ways

Part of the problem is 40k vehicles have always been on a smaller scale than the rest of the models in the game leading to problems like that.

 Bobthehero wrote:
Depends on the regiments, the Guard is the most varied faction there is, so saying it as a whole operates the way you prefer is false, some regiments do, and most likely yours do, but it doesn't mean that a more modern/tacticool IG is impossible within the setting.

look what happens when you ad a more modern looking turret and hull to a human type tank. It just looks better. Imagine how cool a predator would look if it had an even bigger turret and gun.

 Xenomancers wrote:


Anyways - unless you count new BA and DA primaris kits - which are basically not even new kits. We've had practically no new models for about 1 1/2 years. I mean rouge trades characters...who the heck cares? That is what I am mostly depressed about. You know writing codex does not prevent them from producing models right?

Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

I actually like the first Predator there quite a lot. Probably about on even footing.

Not a fan of the first Predator though, the one before that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Depends on the regiments, the Guard is the most varied faction there is, so saying it as a whole operates the way you prefer is false, some regiments do, and most likely yours do, but it doesn't mean that a more modern/tacticool IG is impossible within the setting.

Isn't that basically what Millitarum Tempests are though? Both in lore and mechanics.

Sure they don't have a Battle Tank, but they could. Would that make everyone happy? Regular guard keep their WWI monstrosity (which I do have a big soft spot for) and Tempestus get a shiny modern design?

 rayphoton wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:


Anyways - unless you count new BA and DA primaris kits - which are basically not even new kits. We've had practically no new models for about 1 1/2 years. I mean rouge trades characters...who the heck cares? That is what I am mostly depressed about. You know writing codex does not prevent them from producing models right?

Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

Not dismissing orks - I am happy they are getting their rules final after a year and a half - (wow amazing pace) pretty sad pace if you compare to any other company other than GW on earth. Like 8 people on earth care about 3 little human characters. Most of us want battle tanks - war machines - titans - flyers - gargants and stuff and not monopose LT. characters.

 Stux wrote:
I actually like the first Predator there quite a lot. Probably about on even footing.

Not a fan of the first Predator though, the one before that.

Yeah. And people even buy crazy expensive resin variants that mimic the style of that old Predator!




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 rayphoton wrote:

Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

I was over the moon when I first heard about the Rogue Trader thing, but I was super disappointed when I found out that they were just bunch of special characters with zero options. I want my own customisable Rogue Traders! Nice models nevertheless.

 Crimson wrote:

 Stux wrote:
I actually like the first Predator there quite a lot. Probably about on even footing.

Not a fan of the first Predator though, the one before that.

Yeah. And people even buy crazy expensive resin variants that mimic the style of that old Predator!

Agreed. Though it looks a little better in resin. Would never buy it still!

That thing is ugly. People who buy crazy expensive resin are special in their own way anyways. More than likely they bought it for it's rules and because it has different options compared to the other predators.

I can say objectively that thing looks like garbage compared to the new pred variant.

 Stux wrote:
I actually like the first Predator there quite a lot. Probably about on even footing.

Not a fan of the first Predator though, the one before that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Depends on the regiments, the Guard is the most varied faction there is, so saying it as a whole operates the way you prefer is false, some regiments do, and most likely yours do, but it doesn't mean that a more modern/tacticool IG is impossible within the setting.

Isn't that basically what Millitarum Tempests are though? Both in lore and mechanics.

Sure they don't have a Battle Tank, but they could. Would that make everyone happy? Regular guard keep their WWI monstrosity (which I do have a big soft spot for) and Tempestus get a shiny modern design?

Scions, to me, are more baroque than modern. The large decorative plate armour doesn't really fit modern armour that much. Heck, the IG's flak armour looks closer to modern wargear with the basic Cadian trooper looking like he's a take on Desert Storm era military which I don't think fits quite the setting as much as it could. I just feel like we need something more archaic in design that feels more like it's less generic sci-fi (which is largely based on the modern military with blockier guns).

That said, I'm also the person who wants to use the Solar Auxilia on the table in 40k games because I feel like they feel very 30s-50s scifi in design and it scratches an itch I have to run an army that looks like it's out of a B movie.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Xenomancers wrote:
That thing is ugly. People who buy crazy expensive resin are special in their own way anyways. More than likely they bought it for it's rules and because it has different options compared to the other predators.

I can say objectively that thing looks like garbage compared to the new pred variant.

Tastes vary and bashing taste is weaker than most American beers.

And I like the FW old school Predator and Rhino call backs for HH because it helps set the game apart from modern 40k and helps make the setting feel like a different time with different approaches to war.

 Xenomancers wrote:
That thing is ugly. People who buy crazy expensive resin are special in their own way anyways. More than likely they bought it for it's rules and because it has different options compared to the other predators.

I can say objectively that thing looks like garbage compared to the new pred variant.

Look. You just have really bad taste. You like boring modern stuff, instead of cool antiques. That's okay, some people are like that. However, I think you're kinda missing the whole aesthetics of 40K, it has never meant to be modern, not even the Space Marines.

It would be nice to see new models for Eldar & Dark Eldar. Some of those kits are ancient, and look really terrible. Also they should update those Klu Klux Kraftworld hats, really not a good look. IMO.

And I will never buy another resin model unless i have no other choice.

My castellan crowe with a boomerang sword is the prized jewel of my resin collection.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 rayphoton wrote:


Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

(wow amazing pace) pretty sad pace if you compare to any other company other than GW on earth. Like 8 people on earth care about 3 little human characters. Most of us want battle tanks - war machines - titans - flyers - gargants and stuff and not monopose LT. characters.

Hyperbole much?

 rayphoton wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 rayphoton wrote:


Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

(wow amazing pace) pretty sad pace if you compare to any other company other than GW on earth. Like 8 people on earth care about 3 little human characters. Most of us want battle tanks - war machines - titans - flyers - gargants and stuff and not monopose LT. characters.

Hyperbole much?

It's definitely hyperbole. I think the big thing holding the RT back in regular 40k is the inability to run them like army as a stand alone faction. Closest you could get to doing that is is build Guard and buy a LOT of Voidsmen to build the army out of. Which isn't quite the same thing.

 Marmatag wrote:
It would be nice to see new models for Eldar & Dark Eldar. Some of those kits are ancient, and look really terrible. Also they should update those Klu Klux Kraftworld hats, really not a good look. IMO.

To be fair, the DE line is probably one of the newest and most up to date, having been rebooted entirely from top to bottom in 5E.

 Marmatag wrote:
It would be nice to see new models for Eldar & Dark Eldar. Some of those kits are ancient, and look really terrible. Also they should update those Klu Klux Kraftworld hats, really not a good look. IMO.

I always rather liked the more ornate Farseer style helms on the Eldar- it made them feel and appear far more alien than just space elves with pointy hats. I'd love them to re-do eldar with more Farseer style so far more ornate and decorated and alien looking - perfectly within GW's capacity now with plastics

They're too busy pumping out specialist games. Necromunda, Blood Bowl, Kill Team, Rogue Trader expansion for kill team, commander expansion for kill team, adeptus titanicus... Why make stuff for 40k when you can pump out stuff for a new specialist game system and only support it for a year?

 Stux wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

 Stux wrote:
I actually like the first Predator there quite a lot. Probably about on even footing.

Not a fan of the first Predator though, the one before that.

Yeah. And people even buy crazy expensive resin variants that mimic the style of that old Predator!

Agreed. Though it looks a little better in resin. Would never buy it still!

Honestly I love that thing. I've often thought about including some of those in my army over the current Predator models, which I'm not too keen on. The current turret looks great with the twin Assault Cannon Baal bits, but I'm really not a fan of the sponsons. I'm collecting the Baal turrets to use for TLAC Razorbacks. But if I were to go for a full Predator, Imo the FW one altogether looks way cooler.

 Toofast wrote:
They're too busy pumping out specialist games. Necromunda, Blood Bowl, Kill Team, Rogue Trader expansion for kill team, commander expansion for kill team, adeptus titanicus... Why make stuff for 40k when you can pump out stuff for a new specialist game system and only support it for a year?

Necromunda has been pretty well supported, Titanicus is seeing support, and Kill Team is definitely well supported.

And didn't Blood Bowl just get another team added in?

I wouldn't say I'm personally bored as much as I'm just patiently waiting for Chapter Approved. I won't be starting a new army any time soon (Harlequins!) so I'm just looking forward to improvements on Deathwatch, CSM, and AdMech.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 rayphoton wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 rayphoton wrote:


Just cause YOU don't like the rogue trader characters..doesn't mean other people don't them ..like my whole group. Saying no new models are out and then saying..except these new models..but i don't like those so Im just ignoring them comes across as whiney. Same with orks. Just cause you don't like them doesn't mean they don't exist.

(wow amazing pace) pretty sad pace if you compare to any other company other than GW on earth. Like 8 people on earth care about 3 little human characters. Most of us want battle tanks - war machines - titans - flyers - gargants and stuff and not monopose LT. characters.

Hyperbole much?

It's definitely hyperbole. I think the big thing holding the RT back in regular 40k is the inability to run them like army as a stand alone faction. Closest you could get to doing that is is build Guard and buy a LOT of Voidsmen to build the army out of. Which isn't quite the same thing.

It's a lot closer to the truth than exaggeration. Man you guys are out of touch with the world.

 Xenomancers wrote:
It's a lot closer to the truth than exaggeration. Man you guys are out of touch with the world.

Says the guy who wants 40k to look more like generic sci-fi setting by basing it off of modern military equipment....

You know who isn't excited about the RT stuff? People who play don't play KT and mainly play competetive 40k. Everyone else has some level of interest in the army, though most of us wish it all went a bit deeper than it does.

I'm actually considering getting a box and mixing GSC parts in to imply my GSC has ties to a RT that is helping them spread.

 Crimson wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
That thing is ugly. People who buy crazy expensive resin are special in their own way anyways. More than likely they bought it for it's rules and because it has different options compared to the other predators.

I can say objectively that thing looks like garbage compared to the new pred variant.

Look. You just have really good taste. You like boring antique stuff, instead of cool modern gear. That's okay, some people are like that.

Fixed that for you.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Toofast wrote:
They're too busy pumping out specialist games. Necromunda, Blood Bowl, Kill Team, Rogue Trader expansion for kill team, commander expansion for kill team, adeptus titanicus... Why make stuff for 40k when you can pump out stuff for a new specialist game system and only support it for a year?

Necromunda has been pretty well supported, Titanicus is seeing support, and Kill Team is definitely well supported.

And didn't Blood Bowl just get another team added in?

Those games were all well supported the last time around. So was epic, BFG, etc... I will believe in 2-3 years when they're still updating the rulesets for all these specialist games. However, given their previous history, I'm not holding my breath. Luckily my SO plays with me and we have a nice table setup at home so if GW abandons them and my FLGS stops holding events, I'll still get to use my models and rules for these specialist games. Many weren't so lucky when they shitcanned all their specialist games in the past.