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Made in us
Steadfast Grey Hunter





Orlando, FL

I live a few minutes from the Orlando venue. I didn't buy a ticket but I'll probably go just to spectate and check out the merch.

2000
#spacewolves 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Hm, I am willing to wait and see on how the enforcement of model rules is handled. There are many places where laws or rules are written that theoretically justify absurd levels of restriction but in practice are used to prevent problem elements from finding loop holes to exploit.

It may be that GW is essentially 'reserving the right' to kick out armies that egregiously make use of 3rd-party elements and they will be right-handed with enforcement. Or maybe they will be totally strict about it and it will be oppressive to people who like to convert. GW hasn't run tourneys in a long time.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
ERJAK wrote:
...probably has a some amount of Nazi memorabilia, has many concerning opinions about racial and cultural minorities, and/or likely refers to women as 'females'.
--Saying this about another member does not violate Dakka's Rule #1, apparently. 
   
Made in us
Chaos Space Marine dedicated to Slaanesh




New Orleans, LA -USA

Has anyone here received a response to the the model verification request emails?

I do realize they are probably swamped by them, but i was hoping that they'd maybe make a blanket statement or two about the most frequently asked questions. I sent my email in on June 16th and haven't heard back yet. I'm just wondering if they haven't gotten to it or maybe missed mine? If they won't allow the models, I'll have to prepare a different army to play.

I 3-d printed shoulder pad icons to glue on to all of my "out-of-the-box" models. Not sure if that is allowed.

-Jon

Emperor's Children, Sisters of Battle, Sylvaneth, Idoneth Deepkin 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Halifax

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Hm, I am willing to wait and see on how the enforcement of model rules is handled. There are many places where laws or rules are written that theoretically justify absurd levels of restriction but in practice are used to prevent problem elements from finding loop holes to exploit.

It may be that GW is essentially 'reserving the right' to kick out armies that egregiously make use of 3rd-party elements and they will be right-handed with enforcement. Or maybe they will be totally strict about it and it will be oppressive to people who like to convert. GW hasn't run tourneys in a long time.

Presumably that's why they hired Mike Brandt, who ran the very successful NOVA event.

   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Austin players. Nov is a good time of year for this. Check the weather as conditions change. There is a bit of a homeless situation near the freeways but otherwise its fine. Steer clear of 6th Street after about 12.00.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Deranged Necron Destroyer




Out of my Mind

 Nurglitch wrote:
Presumably that's why they hired Mike Brandt, who ran the very successful NOVA event.
Pity they didn't hire someone who could run a successful 40k event.

Current Armies
Waiting for 40k to come back in the next edition.

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Frazzled wrote:
Austin players. Nov is a good time of year for this. Check the weather as conditions change. There is a bit of a homeless situation near the freeways but otherwise its fine. Steer clear of 6th Street after about 12.00.



Love how we talk about the homeless.

   
Made in us
Frothing Warhound of Chaos




 Akar wrote:
 Nurglitch wrote:
Presumably that's why they hired Mike Brandt, who ran the very successful NOVA event.
Pity they didn't hire someone who could run a successful 40k event.


This must be sarcasm right?
   
Made in us
Lord of the Fleet





Seneca Nation of Indians

Moorecox wrote:

This must be sarcasm right?


No, it's probably a shot at the fact that NOVA is cancelled this year and GW offered zero support for it even if it went forward.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/06 21:13:37



Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
 
   
Made in us
Frothing Warhound of Chaos




Mike is more than capable.
   
Made in us
Deranged Necron Destroyer




Out of my Mind

Moorecox wrote:
Mike is more than capable.
Then why hasn't he done it?

When GW stepped down from running events in the early 2k's, they left a void in 40k of providing a standard set of rules for 40k. Players would get a hold of all of the missions and play those in casual play since it's what they would play when they go to an event. In 5th ed, GW just made those missions a part of the core ruleset. Leaving it up to the organizers of any event to simply use the missions provided. This would remain true for 6th, 7th, and 8th. What GW lost was the team that had the skills to schedule the event, find a location, fill the venue with the required components to run the event (Tables, Terrain, Judges, Vendor area), in addition to coordinating with the local hotels for convention rates, getting all of the responsible stuff (Insurance, security, safety,etc).

Of those who rose to the top of being able to have that skill set, Mike (along with a handful of others I can think of), already has a Resume with an existing skill set that GW could use instead of trying to get someone to start from scratch. NOVA is struggling without his leadership from trying to recover after Covid is a perfect example of his skill even without knowing what he's capable of. I'm sure Mike was at the top of the list and he's been recognized and rewarded for his hard work and skill. It should be great news that GW is getting back into Organizing events so that it can become standardized again and we can stop seeing a different rule set for each individual event.

I've never seen an actual 40k Mission pack from the NOVA open. They always contained their own house rules which were only applicable to those who attended the event. There is nothing wrong with House Rules in 40k until they think that those house rules apply to the rest of the community. Competitive 40k used to mean 'Those who played 40k in a Tournament Setting'. When GW bailed being involved, Events were given free reign to introduce their own 'House' rules. Competitive 40k started to go away and Competitive 40k changed to mean 'A commonly accepted set of House Rules in a Tournament Setting'. Each edition released a set of rules that were modified or outright ignored by these independent events, NOVA included. By late 7th and all of 8th, you couldn't find a Competitive 40k event where players who had practiced the rules included with the editions had to learn an entirely different mission set to attend those events.

In relation to the NOVA mission pack, I can't think of any positive change to the game that has been implemented. When it was limited to the NOVA open it was easy to avoid, since they never ran an actual 40k event, we simply didn't have to go. Now we're stuck with a Mission that reflects his influence on 40k and excludes those who haven't wanted or, been able to attend the NOVA open. More than half of the current player base is unhappy with the current state of 40k, if they haven't left already several have gone back as far as 5th ed. I personally thought 5th ed was the worst edition, but then 9th came along. I'm not saying 5th was bad, but it was the least memorable as it didn't introduce any significant changes. It was also the last edition before the NOVA,ITC,etc. became the more known formats before Competitive 40k started to die. And players are going back to THAT out of all the editions available. Several players are already having an issue with AoS 3 since it's using a similar setup.

I'm fairly excited that Mike will bring back GW run events, and hopefully it won't see the problems that caused GW to leave in the first place. It would be nicer if they found someone who had run a 40k event instead of having to destroy the game to be successful, but here we are. It's a new era of 'Matt Ward' all over again, but Matt didn't do nearly as much damage to the game and the community that Mike has accomplished in 9th. There are going to be people on both opinions on this. Some are clearly in support of him, while others can't believe that we're stuck trying to play something that never needed to exist in the first place, let alone outside of NOVA.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/07/12 15:44:54


Current Armies
Waiting for 40k to come back in the next edition.

 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Given that your stance is there hasn't been a "proper" 40k event after GW pulled out of hosting tournaments themselves at the start of the 2000s I'm curious where you think they'd find a tournament co-ordinator "who had run a 40k event instead of having to destroy the game to be successful". If GW aren't producing an official tournament pack then any tournament packs produced will necessarily contain House Rules. This should not be a surprise and it also doesn't invalidate any of those tournaments as "not real 40k". IIRC, the NOVA mission pack was originally designed as an attempt to create a more balanced, fairer game than 40k provided out of the box. It seems to have been fairly successful at doing that given its ongoing popularity up until the world shut down.

Frankly, your posts here and in the other thread in this sub-forum about tournament pairings are coming across as semi-coherent ramblings at best and bizarre rants at worst. You're accusing someone who has yet to actually fully run a 9th edition 40k event in his new role for GW of doing more damage to the game and community than one of the most divisive personalities who've worked for GW in the last 20 years. Where's your evidence for that?

Personally, I think 40k as a system is singularly unsuited to competitive play for a number of reasons. However, I accept some people like to play it that way and also accept that a certain amount of house-ruling and adjustment is often required to allow the game to be played in that way. I'm struggling to see how running a new set of events in any way harms what we currently have in the competitive scene. If you already don't like what exists nothing has changed. Some people may prefer this approach that GW will be taking to tournaments and we might see more events like that in the future from non-official TOs. Again, if you hate the current competitive 40k set-up you still haven't lost anything if that's the case.

As with the other thread about pairings, I'd also ask what your solution is? You seem to dislike a lot of things about how tournaments are run yet I've not seen you propose anything of your own.
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Hoping somebody with the same issue or maybe even Mike B sees this...

Rules lock for Orlando is August 7th. Will the "special edition" ork codex in the beast snagga box count as a new released codex? With availability so limited I'm hoping it does not...

I sent an email to the model/army approval address but haven't heard back and this is pretty time sensitive since I'd have to get my pre-order in this week.

Looking for an "official" answer here....hoping maybe somebody else already asked and got an answer.

   
Made in us
Never Forget Isstvan!






Since that is going to be an officially printed GW datasheets it will most likely be in effect.

Obviously my word is not official, but the new Ork datasheets in that box will be just as usable as any limited edition release space marine models would have been.

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Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Its not data sheets, its a whole new codex. But its a "special edition" with limited availability.

I dont see how they can REQUIRE players use the new codex under these circumstances....but i also dont see how they can tell someone who has the codex that they cant use it.

   
Made in us
Never Forget Isstvan!






If its an entire codex, and not a supplement then it will be up to their discretion of course.

However, in general, all tournaments will have a rules cutoff date that they will follow.

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Fresh-Faced New User




I'm sorry if i haven't made myself clear: yes, i know there is a rules cutoff date. Its August 7. What i dont know is if a "special edition" codex with extremely limited availability will be considered a "released codex".

If this was a ful retail release I'd have no question but making it special, limited, only available as part of a larger box, muddies the water quite a bit
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




theseehawk wrote:
I'm sorry if i haven't made myself clear: yes, i know there is a rules cutoff date. Its August 7. What i dont know is if a "special edition" codex with extremely limited availability will be considered a "released codex".

If this was a ful retail release I'd have no question but making it special, limited, only available as part of a larger box, muddies the water quite a bit


Likely *not* but there are no official comms in a dakka thread. We'll message attendees with a clarification shortly.
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Thank you for the reply Mike.
I appreciate that nothing here us official...but with the pre-order going live tomorrow i hope "shortly" is today

Hate being "that guy"...

Thanks again for the reply and the hard work on the tournaments

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




We're working on the correspondence now
   
Made in us
Frothing Warhound of Chaos




Thanks Mike for all the great things you do!
   
Made in us
Nihilistic Necron Lord




The best State-Texas

 Eihnlazer wrote:
If its an entire codex, and not a supplement then it will be up to their discretion of course.

However, in general, all tournaments will have a rules cutoff date that they will follow.


In most cases updated rules are generally not allowed until they've had a general release, as the limited edition release like Beastnaggas can create a massive advantage.

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Thousand Sons 4000+
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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Just as a PSA, we emailed the attendees the codex will unfortunately not be legal for Orlando.

We did not want to make people feel compelled to scramble for a limited release box, nor effectively penalize those who did not acquire one, nor create a situation where desperate scratch builds were the only way to get certain models on the table.
   
Made in us
Lord of the Fleet





Seneca Nation of Indians

MVBrandt wrote:
Just as a PSA, we emailed the attendees the codex will unfortunately not be legal for Orlando.

We did not want to make people feel compelled to scramble for a limited release box, nor effectively penalize those who did not acquire one, nor create a situation where desperate scratch builds were the only way to get certain models on the table.


Was this before, or after, it sold out under a minute?


Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 BaronIveagh wrote:
MVBrandt wrote:
Just as a PSA, we emailed the attendees the codex will unfortunately not be legal for Orlando.

We did not want to make people feel compelled to scramble for a limited release box, nor effectively penalize those who did not acquire one, nor create a situation where desperate scratch builds were the only way to get certain models on the table.


Was this before, or after, it sold out under a minute?


Well before.
   
Made in us
Lord of the Fleet





Seneca Nation of Indians

MVBrandt wrote:

Well before.


Well, the reason I ask is that based on the time stamps on your posts in this tread, it would have been less than a day.

MVBrandt wrote:
We're working on the correspondence now


So, in other words, at the last possible moment, to try and maximize preorders without actually giving anyone any benefit.


Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 BaronIveagh wrote:
MVBrandt wrote:

Well before.


Well, the reason I ask is that based on the time stamps on your posts in this tread, it would have been less than a day.

MVBrandt wrote:
We're working on the correspondence now


So, in other words, at the last possible moment, to try and maximize preorders without actually giving anyone any benefit.


Do you reckon a handful of Orlando Ork players who both didn't want the box but did want it if they just had to get a codex would have been the ultimate unethical play for maximum profit in helping sell tens of thousands of boxes? It's a fascinating take.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/18 18:04:16


 
   
Made in us
Lord of the Fleet





Seneca Nation of Indians

MVBrandt wrote:


Do you reckon a handful of Orlando Ork players who both didn't want the box but did want it if they just had to get a codex would have been the ultimate unethical play for maximum profit in helping sell tens of thousands of boxes? It's a fascinating take.


From my own experiences with GW and others with same recently, I expect maximum underhandedness and attempts to milk the player base, no matter how far fetched they would seem.


Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 BaronIveagh wrote:
MVBrandt wrote:


Do you reckon a handful of Orlando Ork players who both didn't want the box but did want it if they just had to get a codex would have been the ultimate unethical play for maximum profit in helping sell tens of thousands of boxes? It's a fascinating take.


From my own experiences with GW and others with same recently, I expect maximum underhandedness and attempts to milk the player base, no matter how far fetched they would seem.


Well I'm happy to defy expectations in this case. We held some hefty internal conversations about what would be best for the player experience, then emailed every attendee about 24 hours ahead of US box sales. I can also affirm I didn't leave a corporate exec position and 12 years of running a charity con to toss reputations away on maybe selling 2-3 boxes that were going to sell out in seconds regardless.

That said, I think that's about all I feel like responding about in this line, so I hope you won't pivot to anything character assassinatey. I do understand your concerns.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/07/18 18:18:24


 
   
Made in us
Nihilistic Necron Lord




The best State-Texas

One of the most bizzare takes I've seen recently on Dakka is the conspiracy that a box that sold out in seconds, may not have sold out in seconds if the dex had been allowed in a single event.

EDIT: Wanted to say thank you to Mike Brandt for being so coolheaded here and appreciate the responses. A lot of us appreciate you posting here, and it's unfortunate you have to deal with some of this absurd toxicity at times.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/18 19:16:06


4000+
6000+ Order. Unity. Obedience.
Thousand Sons 4000+
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