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2012/10/22 15:07:49
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Necros wrote: I thought rick was just pissy that she smooched Hershell back to life, cuz he could have been a zombie at the time.
I don't know about that...
Spoiler:
There was a part earlier where Lori was telling Rick "to do what he think is best to protect the group" and that she said if he had to kill them, she knows there's "no malice in his heart" thing... Maybe he's wigging out a bit that he coldly killed those two prisoners...
Think whembly is on the right track here...
Spoiler:
Those who've read the series of books will be familar with how Rick basicaly goes from being a pretty nice guy to struggling with his conscience over the things he has to do to ensure the groups survival.
Seems that the show is attempting to convey that inner struggle.
As an aside, it appears that old Hershell will be filling not only his own role, but that of Dale ( frrom the books) in the show...should be interesting.
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2012/10/22 15:14:50
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Loved last night's episode, Rick is slumming it up man. Killing prisoners, granted I probably would to if one of the guys BLATANTLY pushed a zombie on top of me.
Spoiler:
Did big time get bit? It looked like he was clawed in the back by forearm bone or two
Also, Dish Networks and AMC came to some form of understanding, so I get my Breaking Bad AND Walking Dead back
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2012/10/22 16:01:56
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Alfndrate wrote: Loved last night's episode, Rick is slumming it up man. Killing prisoners, granted I probably would to if one of the guys BLATANTLY pushed a zombie on top of me.
Spoiler:
Did big time get bit? It looked like he was clawed in the back by forearm bone or two
Also, Dish Networks and AMC came to some form of understanding, so I get my Breaking Bad AND Walking Dead back
Spoiler:
Looked like he just got clawed, but by a bloody broken bone were the walker broke his hand off getting the handcuffs off himself.
I liked this episode. To be fair, All of
Spoiler:
Hershel's scenes were spent with my thinking "What the hell? tie him up some more." or "Bitch gonna get bit. Get the feth off of him."
Also,
Spoiler:
I was hoping deep down with Tomas dead, the other two prisoners would get a chance to join the main group.
2012/10/22 17:34:34
Subject: Re:Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Rick & Lori: Rick's probably done the math. And he's pretty sure the kid isn't his. That's gonna piss a dude off. Secondly, after he had time to think, probably came to the conclusion that Lori is at least partially to blame for Shane going nuts. So in a way, she's partially (or more...) responsible for killing his best friend. Lastly he's probably just tired of her whiney butt. If all the people watching the show are tired of her how to do you think the people living with her would feel
Rick in general: He's a bad mother. It started with gunning down those dudes in the bar and continued through to his speech at the end of season two and seems to have solidified over the "winter". He's cold, calculating, and likely to do what's needed to protect the group. At the same time he's still got enough of a soul left to be willing to give people the benefit of the doubt. And those prisoners needed killing....
Herschel: They haven't pointed it out in the episodes yet but this dude would be absolutely essential to creating some kind of sustainable community. Farming is hard and first hand experience at crop farming would be essential, not counting his medical expertise.
Carl: Kid is pretty much all grown up. And probably one of the deadlier people in the group now. Not necessarily in regards to other humans (though I doubt he'd hesitate) but in regards to the environment. And he seems to listen and respect his place now. The one time he's done something without being ordered to was to retrieve medical gear which while it could be reckless was also needed. I'm liking him not being a plot device anymore.
I find it funny we're going to have two things that slow/endanger the group if they have to move again. The baby, when it comes, and one legged Herschel mean the group isn't as fast as it used to be.
I'm stoked Merl is back. I'm interested in seeing how his time away has changed him. And interested in seeing how he develops in relation to the govenor.
Overall the move to a sound stage seems to have freed up some funds considering the number of people and scope being added this season. Add in the solid show runner that gave us the second half of season two and hopefully the studio not swiping their money for madmen and we've got a heck of a show over the next season. And that doesn't take into account the extra episodes that were ordered this season.
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2012/10/22 19:33:55
Subject: Re:Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
I was definately surprised the way Rick executed that prisnor. Just straight up chopped his head open.
Spoiler:
In the comic, he tried to make it look like an accident.
I thought it was unneccesary to chase down that other guy and make sure he gets eaten by Zombies. I know killing people is supposed to make you cool but it just feels like Kirkman has confused the Rick of the current comic with the Rick of back where the show is now. I just don't see why Rick is a stone cold killer now. It just makes him seems like a bad guy.
2012/10/22 19:46:45
Subject: Re:Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
With Meryl being reintroduced, I can definitely see rick actually seeing his hand cut off once they make some serious contact with the Mayor, just as revenge.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/22 19:47:01
KamikazeCanuck wrote: I was definately surprised the way Rick executed that prisnor. Just straight up chopped his head open.
Spoiler:
In the comic, he tried to make it look like an accident.
I thought it was unneccesary to chase down that other guy and make sure he gets eaten by Zombies. I know killing people is supposed to make you cool but it just feels like Kirkman has confused the Rick of the current comic with the Rick of back where the show is now. I just don't see why Rick is a stone cold killer now. It just makes him seems like a bad guy.
I loved that scene!
2012/10/22 20:14:57
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
I don't think it makes Rick seem like a bad guy. That dude is an active threat. He's already proved it. Rick has to make sure he's not an active threat to his group. I'd point out that Rick in the show, since the second half of season 2, is much deadlier and more cold blooded than Rick of the comics was. It started when he was forced in the show to shoot little zombie sophie. Nothing along those lines happened to Rick early in the comics. It took until the comic issues with the prisoners to really turn him into the same Rick we're seeing in the show right now.
To me it doesn't make him a bad guy. It makes him a survivor. Something they've spent the better part of 2-4 months doing on the road by themselves. Group first.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/22 20:17:07
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2012/10/22 20:18:52
Subject: Re:Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
With Meryl being reintroduced, I can definitely see rick actually seeing his hand cut off once they make some serious contact with the Mayor, just as revenge.
I wonder. Could be too expensive CGI-wise.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hulksmash wrote: I don't think it makes Rick seem like a bad guy. That dude is an active threat. He's already proved it. Rick has to make sure he's not an active threat to his group. I'd point out that Rick in the show, since the second half of season 2, is much deadlier and more cold blooded than Rick of the comics was. It started when he was forced in the show to shoot little zombie sophie. Nothing along those lines happened to Rick early in the comics. It took until the comic issues with the prisoners to really turn him into the same Rick we're seeing in the show right now.
To me it doesn't make him a bad guy. It makes him a survivor. Something they've spent the better part of 2-4 months doing on the road by themselves. Group first.
That dude wasn't an active threat. Don't get me wrong, I totally understand killing the guy he killed with a machette that guy was a threat. I'm not convinced on the other guy.
I agree with what your saying about Rick being more cold-blooded in this timeline than the comic one but I just don't see why. We know why in the comic. He encounters the govenor and very, very bad things happen to him and others. That changes him completely and he becomes a merciless killer. It's understandable, considering what happened. In the show the turn has happened earlier and I'm not really sure why. I don't think it's justified at this point and so I feel it makes Rick seem like a villian.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/22 20:25:35
2012/10/22 20:58:44
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Let's recap the differences between the comics and the show to this point regarding Rick and tell me it doesn't make sense for him to be harder
-Had to kill his best friend (him, not his son)
-Had his wife cheat on him (in the comics it was implied that lori hadn't cheated on him, at least, that was the impression I got)
-Saw people die from his mistakes (something that didn't really happen in the comics for quite some time)
-Had to put a bullet into the rotting head of a little girl he was responsible for (since he left her at the river)
-Found out there is no answer and that everyone is infected much earlier (CDC)
-Dealt with...undesirable....people like Merl and the fellas from town.
-Had people question his leadership a lot more.
Overall he's a lot farther along in the series than the comics. He also had Shane around a lot longer to digest what he might be dealing with in the new world. Which I think also adds a significant stretch. He's seen first hand what this world can do much, much earlier. I feel everyone is farther along in the show than the comics. The show is darker and to me slightly more "real" in how things would likely go. And it's a good thing. They always seemed to work to well together in the comics.
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2012/10/22 22:31:22
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Hulksmash wrote: Let's recap the differences between the comics and the show to this point regarding Rick and tell me it doesn't make sense for him to be harder
-Had to kill his best friend (him, not his son)
-Had his wife cheat on him (in the comics it was implied that lori hadn't cheated on him, at least, that was the impression I got)
-Saw people die from his mistakes (something that didn't really happen in the comics for quite some time)
-Had to put a bullet into the rotting head of a little girl he was responsible for (since he left her at the river)
-Found out there is no answer and that everyone is infected much earlier (CDC)
-Dealt with...undesirable....people like Merl and the fellas from town.
-Had people question his leadership a lot more.
Overall he's a lot farther along in the series than the comics. He also had Shane around a lot longer to digest what he might be dealing with in the new world. Which I think also adds a significant stretch. He's seen first hand what this world can do much, much earlier. I feel everyone is farther along in the show than the comics. The show is darker and to me slightly more "real" in how things would likely go. And it's a good thing. They always seemed to work to well together in the comics.
-Yes, but actually having his son kill a man in front of him is worse.
-Lori definately cheated on him and he knew it.
-Zombie is a Zombie. I don't see why this would increase his inhumanity towards living people.
-Comic is much worse. In show some scientist guy just tells him. In comic, prisnor decapitates two little girls he's responsible for. This is another big contributor too Rick going "Hardcore-don't-trust-anyone-Rick"
-The guys he kills in the bar was the beggining of the TV turn and once again seemed uncharacteristic. That was even pre-shane kill. Why has he already lost all faith in humanity at this point?
-Yes, but he's a killer now to out-badass Shane? I'd argue that makes him a bad guy again.
He's further along for sure. Just not sure he should be.
2012/10/22 23:10:03
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
It's too bad that Shane had to die. If he hadn't been so mixed up with Lori, and gone bat-shiz crazy about being the Alpha, I think he and new-Rick would've got on pretty sucessfully.
Veteran Sergeant wrote:Oh wait. His fluff, at this point, has him coming to blows with Lionel, Angryon, Magnus, and The Emprah. One can only assume he went into the Eye of Terror because he still hadn't had a chance to punch enough Primarchs yet.
Albatross wrote:I guess we'll never know. That is, until Frazzled releases his long-awaited solo album 'Touch My Weiner'. Then we'll know.
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Marshal2Crusaders wrote:Good thing it wasn't attacked by the EC, or it would be the assault on Magnir's Crack.
2012/10/22 23:20:42
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Lint wrote: It's too bad that Shane had to die. If he hadn't been so mixed up with Lori, and gone bat-shiz crazy about being the Alpha, I think he and new-Rick would've got on pretty sucessfully.
That is ironic isn't it? He's basically New-Shane now.
2012/10/23 00:20:00
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Lint wrote: It's too bad that Shane had to die. If he hadn't been so mixed up with Lori, and gone bat-shiz crazy about being the Alpha, I think he and new-Rick would've got on pretty sucessfully.
That is ironic isn't it? He's basically New-Shane now.
Yeah... I hated every second of Shane.
I'm beginning to hate Rick. Long live Glenn and Maggie!
I'm expecting Carl to nearly die or something along those lines.
Veteran Sergeant wrote:In the grim darkness of the far future, the guy with a rifle is the weakest man on the battlefield, left to quake in terror, hoping the two or three shots he gets do the job before somebody runs screaming across the battlefield to hit him with an energized stick.
See I see the difference between Rick and Shane pretty starkly. Shane, when all is said and done, was about himself. It was what he wanted. In a bind it was Shane first (as evident by him capping Otis to escape).
With Rick it's transformed into the group first. They are his stability in this world. Tell me you'd be human enough after 10 months in this world seeing what you're seeing to try to give convicts the benefit of the doubt. Rick still did. Was he merciless when that trust was betrayed? Yep, but you can't hesitate in this world.
Oh, and KamikazeCanuck we're going to have to agree to disagree. The evolution of Rick has actually made sense to me. He tried to long to hang on to morals that don't work in the post-apoc world. And his shooting of the dudes in the bar made perfect sense. While one guy was a "smooth" talker the other wasn't. They tried to hard to find out about his place and hinted at not so nice acts. I'd argue that he was to soft for to long. Not that he got hard to fast.
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2012/10/23 19:20:36
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
I lked the TV shane - I would have been interested to see how different from the comic the story would be it would have been if Rick had died instead. Its pretty different already to be fair.
Carl is good - still waitiing for Andrea to become what she is in the comics and not looking forward to seeing what happens if she is going to meet the Govenor
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Hulksmash wrote: See I see the difference between Rick and Shane pretty starkly. Shane, when all is said and done, was about himself. It was what he wanted. In a bind it was Shane first (as evident by him capping Otis to escape).
With Rick it's transformed into the group first. They are his stability in this world. Tell me you'd be human enough after 10 months in this world seeing what you're seeing to try to give convicts the benefit of the doubt. Rick still did. Was he merciless when that trust was betrayed? Yep, but you can't hesitate in this world.
Oh, and KamikazeCanuck we're going to have to agree to disagree. The evolution of Rick has actually made sense to me. He tried to long to hang on to morals that don't work in the post-apoc world. And his shooting of the dudes in the bar made perfect sense. While one guy was a "smooth" talker the other wasn't. They tried to hard to find out about his place and hinted at not so nice acts. I'd argue that he was to soft for to long. Not that he got hard to fast.
Ya, that's fine. Just Rick's transformation seems a little forced or hurried to me. The theme of the show and comic is "fight the dead, fear the living". In a zombie apocalypse it's the living that turn out to be the real monsters. Comic-Rick has had terrible things happen to him from people. Show-Rick dealt with a lot of crap but it's mostly Zombie related. He's been the one to shoot first and ask questions later.
Anyway, it's true that Rick is protective of the whole "gang" as opposed to Shane who was only protective of a few people he liked.
2012/10/23 20:34:50
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Hulksmash wrote: See I see the difference between Rick and Shane pretty starkly. Shane, when all is said and done, was about himself. It was what he wanted. In a bind it was Shane first (as evident by him capping Otis to escape).
With Rick it's transformed into the group first. They are his stability in this world. Tell me you'd be human enough after 10 months in this world seeing what you're seeing to try to give convicts the benefit of the doubt. Rick still did. Was he merciless when that trust was betrayed? Yep, but you can't hesitate in this world.
Oh, and KamikazeCanuck we're going to have to agree to disagree. The evolution of Rick has actually made sense to me. He tried to long to hang on to morals that don't work in the post-apoc world. And his shooting of the dudes in the bar made perfect sense. While one guy was a "smooth" talker the other wasn't. They tried to hard to find out about his place and hinted at not so nice acts. I'd argue that he was to soft for to long. Not that he got hard to fast.
Ya, that's fine. Just Rick's transformation seems a little forced or hurried to me. The theme of the show and comic is "fight the dead, fear the living". In a zombie apocalypse it's the living that turn out to be the real monsters. Comic-Rick has had terrible things happen to him from people. Show-Rick dealt with a lot of crap but it's mostly Zombie related. He's been the one to shoot first and ask questions later.
Anyway, it's true that Rick is protective of the whole "gang" as opposed to Shane who was only protective of a few people he liked.
And it's all because the writers thought it was ok to just skip the winter, which I thought was an important part of the comic, despite being out of chronological order after the farm, but I really wouldn't have minded...
Ya, i was mildly surprised to see them skip a whole winter. Winter is an important time survival-wise but I guess they didn't think it would be interesting screen time. Mostly just people being cold and hungry. Though does it even get cold in Georgia?
Also the end of Season 2 made it seem like they were only like 20 km from the prison. They've only travelled 20km all winter?
2012/10/23 20:40:53
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
KamikazeCanuck wrote: Ya, i was mildly surprised to see them skip a whole winter. Winter is an important time survival-wise but I guess they didn't think it would be interesting screen time. Mostly just people being cold and hungry. Though does it even get cold in Georgia?
Also the end of Season 2 made it seem like they were only like 20 km from the prison. They've only travelled 20km all winter?
During the winter (in the comic) a few zombies froze and became immobile, problems arose when the survivors tried to inhabit new buildings to find their occupants still moving, etc. I don't think it would have moved the plot forward any.
Regarding the prison being relatively close at the end of season two the writers explained that they've basically been going in a circle trying to find a way through during winter. Basically a gap in the "herds" is what allowed them to get to the prison.
As for the winter they may have gotten farther north in the comic before winter hit. In the show they were still in georgia. It doesn't exactly freeze in georgia in winter.
I'm glad they skipped the winter. We didn't need to watch the group meld under Rick and see all the birthing issues. Advancing the story a few months gave the writers some leeway in character development and saved us from watching more of what equated to the early part of season 2...
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2012/10/23 20:53:30
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Andrea hasn't even rejoined the group. Looks like her and Michonne are going straight to govenor town. I wonder how Rick & Co will even find out about them.
2012/10/23 21:41:38
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
KamikazeCanuck wrote: Andrea hasn't even rejoined the group. Looks like her and Michonne are going straight to govenor town. I wonder how Rick & Co will even find out about them.
Probably after they meet the governor themselves. Perhaps they'll do some daring raid on the town and recognize Andrea as they pillage.
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2012/10/23 22:01:33
Subject: Walking Dead Frazzled Mod Warning Potential Spoilers
Each season follows a completely linear path until the mid-season finale, then they preview a major twist. Then, once the show's back it follows a linear path until the season finale which introduces something kinda major but on the other hand could just be a cliff-hanger ending... Wow, it all makes so much sense now...
I'll admit they kind of got me with The Govenor. I thought maybe he won't be super-evil and Meryl will take his place of super-villany. But ya, looks like evil-govenor is percolating.
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