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2013/10/25 20:00:00
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
I've yet to see anything from Moskin to convince me he is that competent.
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
Unless a calculation of damages based on findings of copyright infringement would have resulted in more damages.
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
2013/10/26 02:41:03
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum, but I've been following this thread from the beginning.
Could anyone help me recap and clarify a few things?
There's a difference between Chapterhouse being found not to have infringed Games Workshop's intellectual property rights, and the court ruling that Games Workshop did not hold IP rights on something. So...
Which, if any, claims of IP by GW were found to be groundless (by the pre-trial hearing or during the trial)?
Which accepted items of GW IP was Chapterhouse found NOT to have infringed?
Which items of GW IP were they found to have infringed (I recall that a Dark Elf miature was one of these, and possibly also the Eldar personalities jetbike kit)?
How many of these disputes have been resolved by Chapterhouse changing the descriptions of their products from something like 'Space Marine Shoulder Pad' to 'Space Marine-Compatible Shoulder Pad'?
If you want my opinion, if Games Workshop claimed IP rights that it did not possess, it was either being incompetent or dishonest. Perhaps the company would be better off pursuing people who produce direct pirate copies of their products, difficult though that may be.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/26 18:25:20
2013/10/26 19:56:51
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
OsitioRojo wrote: Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum, but I've been following this thread from the beginning.
Could anyone help me recap and clarify a few things?
There's a difference between Chapterhouse being found not to have infringed Games Workshop's intellectual property rights, and the court ruling that Games Workshop did not hold IP rights on something. So...
Which, if any, claims of IP by GW were found to be groundless (by the pre-trial hearing or during the trial)?
Which accepted items of GW IP was Chapterhouse found NOT to have infringed?
Which items of GW IP were they found to have infringed (I recall that a Dark Elf miature was one of these, and possibly also the Eldar personalities jetbike kit)?
How many of these disputes have been resolved by Chapterhouse changing the descriptions of their products from something like 'Space Marine Shoulder Pad' to 'Space Marine-Compatible Shoulder Pad'?
If you want my opinion, if Games Workshop claimed IP rights that it did not possess, it was either being incompetent or dishonest. Perhaps the company would be better off pursuing people who produce direct pirate copies of their products, difficult though that may be.
I can't give you a list of IPs. But, when it come to descirption Chapterhouse now use "Space Marine" and other GW army names to to advertise there products.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/26 19:57:34
Peter: As we all know, Christmas is that mystical time of year when the ghost of Jesus rises from the grave to feast on the flesh of the living! So we all sing Christmas Carols to lull him back to sleep.
Bob: Outrageous, How dare he say such blasphemy. I've got to do something.
Man #1: Bob, there's nothing you can do.
Bob: Well, I guess I'll just have to develop a sense of humor.
2013/10/26 21:55:19
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
There's a difference between Chapterhouse being found not to have infringed Games Workshop's intellectual property rights, and the court ruling that Games Workshop did not hold IP rights on something. So...
Which, if any, claims of IP by GW were found to be groundless (by the pre-trial hearing or during the trial)?
Which accepted items of GW IP was Chapterhouse found NOT to have infringed?
Which items of GW IP were they found to have infringed (I recall that a Dark Elf miature was one of these, and possibly also the Eldar personalities jetbike kit)?
1. Kits like the wheeled Chimera add-on kit and the rhino add-on kits were dropped pre-trial with the exception of iconographical add on kits. Some iconographical items GW asserted rights over then realized those CHS items they couldn't even assert a remote association.
2. A good number of iconography was considered by the jury too generic. The general shape of the shoulder pad, the jury also seemed to think was too generic... Shoulder pads and doors with icons they weighed predominantly on the relevance of the iconography.The use of names was largely regarded as fair use.
3. A lot of those character models were found by the jury to be too wholly similar. And specific pieces with iconography were also considered too similar. Those constituted the bulk of findings in GWs favor.
How many of these disputes have been resolved by Chapterhouse changing the descriptions of their products from something like 'Space Marine Shoulder Pad' to 'Space Marine-Compatible Shoulder Pad'?
None. GW sued without accepting a 3rd party market. They only asserted CHS wasn't doing enough once it was clear they'd have to accept the possibility of fair use.
The general finding was that it was fair use to use the names. The only thing beyond that was whether specific phrasing imparted confusion, but the fact that the website went out of its way to make it clear it wasn't GW, resulted in CHS favor. GW wanted a greater amount of disambiguity than CHS afforded but legally CHS provided enough. So as long as GW believed it wasn't getting what it wanted the possibility of dispute existed. Pretty much everything in GWs favor had nothing to do with naming. CHS simply changed the phrasing to show the court that if naming wasn't found fair use there was resolution that didn't require an end of CHS, but that was ultimately unnecessary.
'Gee folks we don't want to put them out of business, just give us a small amount'
Would the jury really be aware that by giving the award to GW they also give credence to the argument that CHS is liable for legal costs?
Compare that with;
'Gee folks we don't want to put them out of business, just give us a small amount and all our costs'
GW as the Plantiff can only assert the cost of successfully defending any of its registered works. They didn't really win on any registered works. The dispute over who Won is really because as the defendant CHS can fight back for legal costs if they are found the prevailing party and if GW's claims were found baseless. CHS isn't likely to get all its costs but they could get the cost of defending the items GW dropped its dispute of in pretrial and the items that GW was cought lying about it's copyright ownership. This is potentially exceeds 1/3 of the CHS' attorney's costs. There is something carmic about the potential for GWs unfocused and unresearched suit against CHS resulting in what GWs been awarded being wiped out because of GWs attempt at overreach and it's early vagueness of its claims.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/10/26 22:22:45
2013/10/26 22:49:55
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
What I meant to ask was, did the court actually rule that GW didn't have trademark or copyright on things that it said it did? I got the impression (from one reference to court documents) that the 'Chaos Star' symbol was not their trademark, as they claim on the legal page of their website. Did I get the wrong end of the stick on that one?
2013/10/27 02:22:49
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Wishing I was back at the South Atlantic, closer to ice than the sun
Thanks for the answer Mythos but I didn't phrase my question properly, I should have put [sotto voice] [/unsotto voice] around the last 4 words.
Would the jury be aware that in awarding damages to GW, GW would then be in a position to claim that they were the 'prevailing party' and as such were entitled to claim costs from CHS?
Cheers
Andrew
I don't care what the flag says, I'm SCOTTISH!!!
Best definition of the word Battleship?
Mr Nobody wrote:
Does a canoe with a machine gun count?
2013/10/27 02:40:28
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
AndrewC wrote: Thanks for the answer Mythos but I didn't phrase my question properly, I should have put [sotto voice] [/unsotto voice] around the last 4 words.
Would the jury be aware that in awarding damages to GW, GW would then be in a position to claim that they were the 'prevailing party' and as such were entitled to claim costs from CHS?
Cheers
Andrew
I doubt they would have been made aware of the costs issue, same as how they weren't told about CHS being represented pro bono. It's an extraneous consideration, they are there to determine facts. I think there is a copy of the jury instructions on the recap archive (or at least the proposed instructions) if you felt like checking.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
OsitioRojo wrote: What I meant to ask was, did the court actually rule that GW didn't have trademark or copyright on things that it said it did? I got the impression (from one reference to court documents) that the 'Chaos Star' symbol was not their trademark, as they claim on the legal page of their website. Did I get the wrong end of the stick on that one?
Some stuff was withdrawn, some with prejudice, some tossed out, and some fair use defences accepted. It will be a bit muddled until the judge has his final say.
Also a bit muddled because the claims chart is a dog's breakfast. But you'll note CHS is still in business and still referencing GW.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/10/27 02:42:14
2013/10/27 02:58:35
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
I doubt they would have been made aware of the costs issue, same as how they weren't told about CHS being represented pro bono. It's an extraneous consideration, they are there to determine facts. I think there is a copy of the jury instructions on the recap archive (or at least the proposed instructions) if you felt like checking.
The pro bono was not to be mentioned, that I do remember, but the bit about prevailing party I though was a judicial rule that Weeble referenced a few pages back, especially when people have been arguing about it in post trial motions.
GW wanted CHS out of business, realised that they couldn't do it via this trial so asked for a low damages figure to ensure the prevailing party bit and put CHS into bankruptcy on the award of costs.
Of course I could also be completely paranoid and giving far to much credit to GW and that this is simply an unintended consequence that is being overthought by me.
Cheers
Andrew
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/27 02:59:39
I don't care what the flag says, I'm SCOTTISH!!!
Best definition of the word Battleship?
Mr Nobody wrote:
Does a canoe with a machine gun count?
2013/10/27 13:38:21
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
OsitioRojo wrote: What I meant to ask was, did the court actually rule that GW didn't have trademark or copyright on things that it said it did? I got the impression (from one reference to court documents) that the 'Chaos Star' symbol was not their trademark, as they claim on the legal page of their website. Did I get the wrong end of the stick on that one?
No.
No marks were found to be invalid. In fact, it was not even teased out in the verdict form. Generally speaking, for a huge amount of marks, the Court affirmatively found them to be both valid and in use in commerce (including a drawing of a skull found only on page 88 of a book), so that was off of the table for the jury. Of the marks not affirmatively found to be valid and in use in commerce, the Court accepted a verdict form that only asked infringement (yes/no) fair use (yes/no). There was no question of validity explicitly on the verdict form. The jury might have found some marks to not be infringed because they found that the marks were not valid, but there is no way to know that from the verdict form.
Games Workshop did, however, drop plenty of claims for both copyrights and trademarks, some of which were dropped during the trial! Most of those dropped claims were dismissed with prejudice, meaning Games Workshop cannot assert them against Chapterhouse Studios again, but it also makes it more difficult to assert them in the US, especially in the 7th circuit.
For example, Games Workshop dropped claims to the "chaos star." Generally speaking, Games Workshop dropped claims that it could not support, such as when Games Workshop dropped claims related to the Mantis Warriors iconography after Gary Chalk swore an affidavit that he had never transferred ownership of the work. Games Workshop dropped that claim immediately, and in the giant context of the suit it was quickly forgotten by the Court.
Games Workshop says that these claims were dropped in order to "simplify" the case, but A) the Court has been unilaterally dismissing them with prejudice, and B) most claims have been dropped when evidentiary support is critically lacking, such as dropping the "Games Workshop" trademark during the trial and the Mantis Warrior example above.
This is one reason it will be interesting to see this case on appeal, because there have been a lot of squirly things going on in this litigation, such as Games Workshop counsel failing to produce correspondence with the copyright office and then using the Court's ruling (absent this communication) to try to overcome a rejection by the copyright office. Again, before this case even got to a jury there were some weird rulings and some bad behavior on the part of Games Workshop. That sort of stuff will likely get fresh attention at the appellate court should the case go up on appeal.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
czakk wrote: Undoubtedly this was a consideration when asking for 25k from the jury. If they had asked for a million, they would have looked insane.
The judge does have discretion whether or not to award costs. It's not automatic.
If you look at the case law cited by both parties, it is easy to see just how much discretion Courts have in awarding costs. The FRCP says that costs should be awarded to the prevailing party unless the Court thinks there is a reason not to. The case law is a ton of examples in which costs have/have not been awarded on various grounds.
Chapterhouse's argument is pretty clearly laid out in the brief:
1: Chapterhouse is the prevailing party and should get costs.
1a: Chapterhouse won 70% of all claims in the entire context of the trial and succeeded in its trial goal: being allowed to sell accessories for GW products using GW trademarks to identify fit and compatibility.
2: If Chapterhouse is not the prevailing party, neither is Games Workshop.
2a: At the very least, the verdict is mixed, and neither party should be awarded costs.
3: Even if GW is the prevailing party, it would be manifestly unjust to award GW costs.
3a: GW asked for 25K in damages, saying that it was not trying to be punitive, but now asks for 250K in costs. CHS is a defendant, and thus obligated to engage in a defense, and is essentially indigent in comparison to GW and was therefore represented pro-bono. GW clearly did not litigate with the goal of obtaining monetary damages, so an award of ten times the jury verdict would serve only to unduly burden CHS and therefore result in manifest injustice.
For its part, GW's argument runs thusly:
GW is the prevailing party because it won substantial relief. GW asked for 25K and got all of it. Further, if you look at the case in terms of products, not only were the top grossing CHS products among those found to infringe, but between copyright and trademark infringement, a majority of the CHS products infringed something.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/10/27 15:48:56
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
2013/10/27 17:17:24
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Thanks to everyone who replied to my posts. It's a bit clearer now.
So, as I understand it, Games Workshop had some claims upheld and some dismissed, but only in relation to the relevant Chapterhouse products, and on certain claims they can never sue Chapterhouse again. GW can still sue other companies over the same copyrights and trademarks, albeit with possible precedent issues over the claims that were dismissed with prejudice (and then only in the US). Chapterhouse is still in business selling many, or most, of the products it was selling before, as we can all see from their website.
All in all, it doesn't sound to me like much has changed in the industry as a whole, although GW has been left with egg on its face.
What happened in the end about that infamous Space Marine shoulder-pad copyright(?) application? Has GW been successful? I'm no expert on law, but I assume that before one sues someone one should have all one's ducks in a row. That's what I meant about GW either being incompetent or dishonest: they were a bit of both in that episode.
Is there any indication that any of these rulings may be changed at the post-trial hearings, or are they just discussing costs? I read in recent posts that there were Judgement as a Matter of Law (JMOL) motions from both sides. I understand a JMOL to be something like a directed verdict in British (and American?) criminal law, except that it can also be applied retrospectively to a jury verdict: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_as_a_matter_of_law
I suppose I should just shut up and wait for the final rulings. Who knows, maybe it'll all be over by Christmas.
2013/10/27 17:45:21
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Is there any indication that any of these rulings may be changed at the post-trial hearings, or are they just discussing costs? I read in recent posts that there were Judgement as a Matter of Law (JMOL) motions from both sides. I understand a JMOL to be something like a directed verdict in British (and American?) criminal law, except that it can also be applied retrospectively to a jury verdict: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_as_a_matter_of_law
Judgment as a matter of law is the new term that United States Federal Rules of Civil Procedure use for directed verdict or rather, renewed judgment as a matter of law is the new term being used in place of directed verdict, so in some instances you're you're going to see caselaw referring to "directed verdict" even though the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure uses the term "renewed judgment as a matter of law."
Nowadays, the parties simply renew the motions for judgment as a matter of law that they made at the conclusion of the opposing parties case in chief. So, what you do is, you submit your judgment as a matter of law after the case in chief of the opposing party, and then after the conclusion of the trial you can within 30 days renew your motion for judgment as a matter of law.
In practice, what this does is allow the court some flexibility in giving the jury a chance to sort of do the right thing. What happens is that if there's a jury verdict, there's generally less room for a retrial than there would be if there was a mistake in the court's ruling. So, rather than ruling at the time during trial, the courts generally withhold their rulings because the parties can renew JMOL after the jury verdict. If the jury comes to the "right" verdict, then there's no need for the JMOL, and you have a jury verdict wrapped in a bow. If, on the other hand, the court had ruled on a JMOL during trial, and then was reversed on appeal, it would probably go to reman which we would require a whole new trial. So, what this whole process sort of does is protect the court and the public from the expense of repeated trials.
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
2013/10/27 20:55:00
Subject: Re:Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Thanks for the link. So, the pre-verdict JMOLs are still being contested, in fact with some changes.
Scenes a faire was a new term for me: basically a genre staple that no-one can claim exclusive use of. Would it be fair to say that it's analogous to 'state of the art' in patent law? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scenes_a_faire
I also found this article useful in explaining the concept: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idea-expression_divide. Basically you can copyright a specific text, piece of visual art, photograph, film, sculpture etc. (and fictional characters contained within a work), but you can't copyright the basic concept of the thing. Games Workshop could sue someone for making and and distributing scanned PDFs of their books, but they couldn't touch anyone for producing a generic rehash of Warhammer Fantasy Battle or 40K.
This has been interesting and instructive for me. I'm trying to write something and this gives me a better idea of where the boundaries on the use of ideas lies.
2013/10/27 23:54:01
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
BaronIveagh wrote: My question is: how much of this becomes relevant precedent the next time GW plays this game? It seems like they're trying to minimize that atm.
My understanding is if GW pulls this again it won't be for the exact same parts so the defendant can't just say 'but in the chapterhouse case X' BUT it will mean GW will have an uphill battle going into it rather than the nice strong position it looked like they had waaaay back when this started.
Fafnir wrote: Oh, I certainly vote with my dollar, but the problem is that that is not enough. The problem with the 'vote with your dollar' response is that it doesn't take into account why we're not buying the product. I want to enjoy 40k enough to buy back in. It was my introduction to traditional games, and there was a time when I enjoyed it very much. I want to buy 40k, but Gamesworkshop is doing their very best to push me away, and simply not buying their product won't tell them that.
2013/10/28 14:38:14
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
I suppose the question is: how similar is a 'claim dismissed with prejudice' to a legal precedent in cases like this? The other rulings, for or against either party, are presumably only relevant to this particular case.
Personally I think that GW is claiming IP on a lot of things that are generic or 'scenes a faire'. For instance, a lot of 40K vehicles are obviously based on real-world designs. What if another company made a 28mm miniature of fantasy orcs in Nazi uniforms riding a Kettenkrad? Could GW make a cogent legal argument that their combination of the three generic elements made something original and unique?
Then there's the issue of the 'Chaos Device' which, as GW very well know, was invented by Michael Moorcock.
So, I think it would have been great if this case had resulted in a ruling that GW cannot claim IP on things they simply copied from other fictional and real-world sources, if only because their nonsense gets on my nerves. However, I can't see that it has.
2013/10/28 14:51:11
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Personally I think that GW is claiming IP on a lot of things that are generic or 'scenes a faire'. For instance, a lot of 40K vehicles are obviously based on real-world designs. What if another company made a 28mm miniature of fantasy orcs in Nazi uniforms riding a Kettenkrad? Could GW make a cogent legal argument that their combination of the three generic elements made something original and unique?
That is essentially Games Workshop's argument. What Games Workshop has argued is that because its works choose a specific combination of otherwise "generic" elements from a near infinite buffet, that combination of elements is itself a unique expression. For example, with regard to the Games Workshop Croxigors, Games Workshop argued that it is a unique combination of a bipedal reptile with mesoamerican weapons and jewelry.
Games Workshop said that this combination is a unique artistic expression, and therefore anything that uses a similar combination of elements is substantially similar, regardless of how those ideas(?) are expressed in the accused work. So long as you express a bipedal lizard with mesoamerican weapons and jewelry, that is substantial similarity so says GW, especially if you sell it on a website that violates GW's trademarks (which of course has nothing whatsoever to do with copyrights).
Now, bear in mind that copyright does not extend to ideas, but the idea/expression dichotomy is a bit muddled, so to speak, in the case law. Even so, the jury found that Chapterhouse's Lizard Ogre did not infringe Games Workshop's asserted croxigor/painted croxigor/drawing of weapons from the Lizardmen Army Book. But the jury did find several infringing products with respect to which Games Workshop made essentially the same type of argument.
There are several really important issues that arise from that. First, what exactly is Games Workshop's asserted expression? One of the Croxigor models, the set of the Croxigor models, the photograph of the painted Croxigor models, the drawing from the Lizardmen Army Book? Are those asserted in severality? And what is accused? The Lizard Orgre model, the picture of the painted Lizard Ogre model on the website, or some weird combination of both?
It is clear that Games Workshop asserted some mad, Frankenstein amalgam of all of those discrete expressions. How? Because Judge Kennelly said it was cool, that's how, over vehement objections by the defense. And moreover, the accused work was also some sort of mad combination of not only the actual physical Lizard Ogre model, but also the painted image on the website, and GW even put the NAME of its product on the copyright claims chart, which was also an asserted trademark! Did that cause some confusion among the members of the jury? Was that proper?
What would the infringing thing be? Is it the model in combination with the website photo? One of Games Workshop's specific arguments regarding infringement was GOLD jewelry, which is obviously only GOLD in the photograph of the painted model! So if that product had been found to infringe, what is the proper injunction? Is it JUST the model sold in combination with the website photo? Are both found to infringe separately? The evidence in the case, from numerous witnesses both from the plaintiff and defendant was that the products of both parties are sold unassembled and unpainted. The Lizard Ogre is not sold as shown in the website photo, though the website photo could in theory infringe copyright as it is a public display. But the Court ruled that the website photo was somehow part of the physical product.
And then in terms of trademarked icons, the icons are obviously in color (for the most part), as are the images of the painted Chapterhouse products. Now, if Chapterhouse was found to infringe an icon mark, that was asserted in color, and the evidence of infringement was a website photo of a painted shoulder pad product, does the physical product infringe the asserted trademark? The physical product is not in color. So can the product still be sold? What is the proper injunction on that? And what about the name of the icon, which was sometimes also an asserted word mark, and appeared in combination with the image of the icon on the verdict form?
All the verdict form said was Infringe (yes/no) Fair Use (yes/no).
These sorts of issues could wind up in front of the appellate court. Certainly, Chapterhouse objected to and argued against all of these rulings by the Court. Chapterhouse even objected to the verdict form.
This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at 2013/10/28 15:13:12
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
2013/10/28 17:26:40
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Personally I think that GW is claiming IP on a lot of things that are generic or 'scenes a faire'. For instance, a lot of 40K vehicles are obviously based on real-world designs. What if another company made a 28mm miniature of fantasy orcs in Nazi uniforms riding a Kettenkrad? Could GW make a cogent legal argument that their combination of the three generic elements made something original and unique?
That is essentially Games Workshop's argument. What Games Workshop has argued is that because its works choose a specific combination of otherwise "generic" elements from a near infinite buffet, that combination of elements is itself a unique expression. For example, with regard to the Games Workshop Croxigors, Games Workshop argued that it is a unique combination of a bipedal reptile with mesoamerican weapons and jewelry.
Games Workshop said that this combination is a unique artistic expression, and therefore anything that uses a similar combination of elements is substantially similar, regardless of how those ideas(?) are expressed in the accused work. So long as you express a bipedal lizard with mesoamerican weapons and jewelry, that is substantial similarity so says GW, especially if you sell it on a website that violates GW's trademarks (which of course has nothing whatsoever to do with copyrights).
Now, bear in mind that copyright does not extend to ideas, but the idea/expression dichotomy is a bit muddled, so to speak, in the case law. Even so, the jury found that Chapterhouse's Lizard Ogre did not infringe Games Workshop's asserted croxigor/painted croxigor/drawing of weapons from the Lizardmen Army Book. But the jury did find several infringing products with respect to which Games Workshop made essentially the same type of argument.
...
...
A good example is the Doom Seer / Fate Seer / Far Seer figure.
GW’s Farseers are all male humanoids in plate armour with robes, and tall helmets.
CH’s figure was a female humanoid in plate armour with robes and a tall helmet. None of its individual elements replicated any of the individual elements of any of the GW models. The overall look was obviously similar, because arguably all figures in plate armour with robes and tall helmets have clear points of similarity.
Thus, GW now apparently own a copyright on such figures. Which IMO is wrong.
ORDER
The motions of Donald Steinberg, Louis Tompros, Kevin Goldman, and Elizabeth
Mooney to appear pro hac vice are all granted [dkt. nos. 441, 442, 443 & 444]. These
attorneys are directed to promptly contact the Clerk of Court to establish e-filing accounts
in this district.
2013/11/07 22:29:57
Subject: Re:Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
"[Ms. Hartzell] And you testified that it was a wholly original Games Workshop design?
[Mr. Merrett] Wholly original Games Workshop idea, and therefore that's a copy of a Games Workshop idea, and the expression of the idea is illustrated opposite.
[Ms. Hartzell] On the right-hand side?
[Mr. Merrett] Yes."
To orient you, the GW products are on the right hand side of the exhibit Mr. Merrett and Ms. Hartzell are referring to, and the accused Chapterhouse products are on the left hand side. So here Mr. Merrett is specifically testifying that the asserted Games Workshop work is an expression of an idea, but that the accused product is a copy of a "Wholly original Games Workshop idea."
"In no case does copyright protection for an original work of authorship extend to any idea, procedure, process, system, method of operation, concept, principle, or discovery, regardless of the form in which it is described, explained, illustrated, or embodied in such work."
Merrett is saying, with a straight face, that Chapterhouse infringes because it copied an idea. The record is chock full of these little gems. I really should make a line of T-shirts.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2013/11/07 23:05:42
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
2013/11/07 23:10:00
Subject: Chapterhouse Lawsuit update-we have a verdict!
Merrett is saying, with a straight face, that Chapterhouse infringes because it copied an idea. The record is chock full of these little gems. I really should make a line of T-shirts.
A cut down version of Chapterhouse's response with the legalese cut out for the work crowd:-
CHAPTERHOUSE STUDIOS’ REPLY IN SUPPORT OF ITS BILL OF COSTS
Spoiler:
Chapterhouse is the prevailing party in this case and thus is entitled to its costs. Games Workshop (“GW”) brought this action to shut down—or, at a minimum, radically alter—the business of Chapterhouse, claiming in a letter to Chapterhouse that “all of the 106 products currently marketed on your website infringe in some way our client’s intellectual property rights.” But GW failed—Chapterhouse can still sell many of those products. And factoring in summary judgment, trial, and dropped claims, Chapterhouse won over two-thirds of GW’s copyright and trademark claims. GW was only successful in obtaining a small fraction of the damages it initially sought. Indeed, GW would not have invested in this case as heavily as it did simply to slap Chapterhouse on the wrist.
Chapterhouse recognizes that this is a mixed judgment case and understands the Court’s view that in such a case, seeking attorney’s fees may not be warranted. Chapterhouse therefore did not seek fees in this case. But Chapterhouse is, on balance, the prevailing party and should be reimbursed out-of-pocket costs that were imposed based on GW’s overreaching claims.
I. Chapterhouse Is The Prevailing Party And Is Entitled To Costs. No matter how the case is sliced, Chapterhouse won substantial relief. GW suggests that the only thing that matters is that it won something at trial. Chapterhouse successfully defended against dozens of claims and hundreds of thousands of dollars in potential damages.Therefore, Chapterhouse is the prevailing party whether one considers the number of claims, the parties’ litigation goals, or the amount of damages.
A. Chapterhouse won the vast majority of the claims asserted.
Chapterhouse won over two-thirds of the copyright claims asserted in this action. More specifically, Chapterhouse won 34 copyright claims on summary judgment. At trial, Chapterhouse won an additional 67 copyright claims. All told, Chapterhouse can continue to sell, without modification, at least two-thirds of the accused products. Similarly, Chapterhouse won over 70% of the asserted trademark claims. Though GW added and dropped marks throughout the case, a comparison of its interrogatory responses reveals that GW asserted infringement of over 140 unique marks. But only 92 trademarks remained for trial. Of these, Chapterhouse won on 54. On sheer math alone, Chapterhouse is the prevailing party.
B. Chapterhouse, not Games Workshop, achieved its litigation goal.
By any metric, Chapterhouse met its litigation goal: it can still sell the vast majority of products GW had accused of copyright infringement and can still use GW’s trademarks to inform consumers that Chapterhouse products are compatible with GW products. In a case such as this, where a defendant in a copyright case has achieved “substantially all the benefits [it] hoped to achieve in defending the suit,” courts have not hesitated to consider it the prevailing party and award costs.
C. Games Workshop received only a small portion of the damages it originally sought.
GW makes much of the fact that the $25,000 jury award was precisely the amount of damages it had requested. But originally, GW sought far more. It elicited testimony from Nick Villacci that Chapterhouse “ha[d] sold $427,226.35 of materials” through January 8, 2013. This was all GW had the burden to do; the burden was on Chapterhouse to prove its expenses. GW let this Sword of Damocles hang over Chapterhouse throughout the thirty months of pretrial litigation and right up until closing argument.
But GW receded from its original demand after Chapterhouse established costs to offset its revenue. As GW now admits, Chapterhouse operated at a 10-15% profit margin. Realizing that it would not prevail on its request for $400,000, GW radically reduced its request to a closing argument plea for $25,000. Indeed, GW would not have incurred the expenses it did if its only goal was to give Chapterhouse a $25,000 slap on the wrist. GW’s allegedly taxable costs alone total over $250,000. And its attorneys’ fees likely reach seven figures, given the length and complexity of this litigation. GW cannot now claim that it received everything it wanted.
D. Games Workshop’s arguments are meritless.
GW’s principal theme is strikingly narrow: nothing else matters but the trial. The 370-plus pre-trial docket entries, the thirty months of pre-trial litigation, the multiple summary judgment decisions—these simply disappear from GW’s field of vision. All that matters, according to GW, is that “[t]he jury found that a majority of Chapterhouse’s products infringed either copyright or trademark or both.” But “substantial relief” requires an assessment of the entirety of the case, not just the claims actually brought to trial. Indeed, GW seeks costs for depositions that were not played at trial and depositions of witnesses that did not testify at trial. GW cannot now contend it is entitled to these costs based on the trial alone.
Finally, GW contends that thirteen of Chapterhouse’s top twenty products were found to infringe. There are two problems with this argument. First, it is irrelevant. Even if all of Chapterhouse’s top twenty products were found to infringe, GW asserted at least 150 total copyright claims. GW cannot escape the consequences of its decision to assert a multitude of meritless claims, whether these claims were “important” or not. GW did not prevail on the majority of its claims, and must now lie in the bed it made. Second, even if the Court were to take into account the relative “importance” of the accused products, that would be counterbalanced by Chapterhouse’s victory on all of GW’s core registered trademarks.
All told, over the course of summary judgment and trial, Chapterhouse won the majority of the claims asserted against it. Despite GW’s best efforts, Chapterhouse can still sell many of the accused products. Chapterhouse is the prevailing party and should be awarded costs accordingly.
II. If Chapterhouse Was Not The Sole Prevailing Party, The Parties Should Bear Their Own Costs.
Even if this Court were to accept GW’s arguments, the jury’s verdict was, at most, a mixed result. And “courts have especially broad discretion to award or deny costs in mixed result cases, including cases in which liability was established but recovery was nominal relative to what was sought.” This Court should use its discretion to deny all costs to GW, as GW’s request would inflict a burden on Chapterhouse that far exceeds the outcome of the trial. Here, Chapterhouse is the defendant—it did not choose to litigate this case. And Chapterhouse is a small company; it was represented in this case pro bono.
In asking the jury for $25,000 in damages (all GW wanted, it now claims), GW claimed in its closing argument that it was “not looking to be punitive.” But it now seeks a cost award that is more than ten times greater than the damage award it requested. Such an award would inflict tremendous financial burden on Chapterhouse. It should be denied. Further, GW won little of what it sought. GW has failed to cripple Chapterhouse’s business. And it lost on the majority of its originally asserted copyrights and trademarks. And it obtained only a small fraction of the damages it initially sought.
GW did not win substantial relief, and a cost award would hurt Chapterhouse far more than the verdict at trial. Accordingly, Chapterhouse respectfully requests that GW not be awarded costs.
CONCLUSION For the foregoing reasons, Chapterhouse should be awarded $134,097.31 in costs as the prevailing party. Chapterhouse can still sell many of the accused products, having won nearly 70% of the claims asserted by GW in this litigation, and GW did not win substantial relief.
Alternatively, the parties should bear their own costs.
Some of those witness depositions don't half make me laugh. Here are some of the juicier ones.
Merrett-Cross Examination
Spoiler:
Q So you don't believe that any external robots were
considered by any designer of any Tau product?
A Not to my knowledge, no.
Q But do you have knowledge what they referred to?
A Well, they didn't refer to anything. What we did is we
generated concept drawings, and the guys that were working on
the project brainstormed concepts of -- for the Tau idea.
Q And none of them had ever seen a robot?
A Well, that's preposterous to suggest, isn't it?
Q It is.
A Yeah, of course it is.
Q So the designers could have drawn inspiration from
existing robots?
A They could have done. They could have drawn inspiration
from the clouds in the sky.
Spoiler:
Q And you have never heard of any other miniatures or action
figures that used the word "Space Marine"?
A Not miniature. Well, no, not miniatures, and not action
figures or dolls or anything else like that.
Q Games Workshop --
Although you testified that at the time that you
created Warhammer 40K, Games Workshop did not maintain a
library of reference materials; you currently have reference
materials at Games Workshop, correct?
A We have -- well, in the 25 years subsequent to that, yes,
we have accumulated all kinds of reference materials, yes.
Q And many of those are not published by Games Workshop?
A Many of those are not published by Games Workshop, that's
correct.
Q And those books include books about military history?
A Yes.
Q And about heraldry?
A Yes.
Q And about weapons?
A Yes.
Q Each designer at Games Workshop has access to those books?
A No.
Q Many designers at Games Workshop have access to those
books?
A Yes.
Q And we talked a little bit earlier about the fact that
Games Workshop has licensed work from other science fiction
universes, right?
A Yes. Sorry, I have to just go back in time because it's a
long time ago. So I have to go back and think, were those
science fiction universes.
It's debatable whether some of them were or not, but,
yes.
Q And Games Workshop, as we already discussed, licensed
Michael Moorcock's Eternal Champions products?
A Yes.
Q And for a period of time, Games Workshop also licensed
Dungeons and Dragons miniatures?
A Yes, it's true.
Q And for a period of time, Games Workshop licensed Judge
Dread miniatures?
A Yes.
Q And for a period of time, Games Workshop licensed Lord of
the Rings miniatures?
A Yes.
Q So while during the periods of time that those were
licensed, Games Workshop designers had access to each of those universes?
A To a lesser or greater degree depending on their
involvement in the various projects, and for some of the
licenses, there were no reference materials.
Jones Cross examination
Spoiler:
Q. Games Workshop hasn't conducted any studies to determine the
brand recognition for any of its alleged trademarks, right?
A. Correct.
Q. And Games Workshop hasn't commissioned any market share
studies by any independent research service to evaluate its
trademarks in the U.S., correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And Games Workshop has not engaged an independent expert in
this case to give his or her opinion about the trademarks at
issue, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. Let's talk about another example. Games Workshop contends
that the word exorcist is one of its trademarks, right?
A. Um --
THE COURT: You have to say yes or no.
THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. Yes.
Q. Games Workshop has never received a trademark registration
for the term exorcist, right?
A. That's correct.
Q. And you understand that the term exorcist is used outside of
miniature tabletop board games?
A. Yes.
Q. You understand that the term exorcist has a generally
understood meaning of referring to individuals that remove
demons?
A. Yes.
Q. And in the Games Workshop universe, the exorcists are demon
hunters, correct?
A. Yes.
Goodwin Cross-Examination
Spoiler:
Q. Fine. And so, the Imperium, the civilization, that's the
setting in which this game is to take place; is that right?
A. Yep.
Q. And that game is an amalgamation of so many ideas that were
floating around, taken from sources like 2000 AD, right? Isn't
that true?
A. That just doesn't finish off the sentence, does it?
Q. Well, let's look at the rest of the sentence. Taken from
2000 AD and Michael Moorcock novels and real history all put
into a big pot and regurgitated by us. Do you see that?
A. Yes.
Q. Isn't that what Games Workshop did?
A. That's a very, very simplistic reading of it, yes.
Q. And that's in The Art of Warhammer book, right?
A. Yes.
MR. ALY: No further questions.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/08 00:07:00