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There's the Emperor, made from a ritualistic sacrifice of thousands of shamans.

There's the Chaos Gods made from the gravitation of emotions in the warp.

In the story's of omnipotent genesis, where did the C'tan come from, and the Eldar Gods? They don't seem like direct creation of the Old Ones, and seem to me like loose ends (more like loose cannons since they're so powerful.)

Thoughts?

C'tan were birthed by the Big Bang, says so in the Old Cron codex if I recall correctly. (Gotta remember that they're gods of the Materium).

I think the Eldar Gods are in the same category as the Chaos powers, just not nearly as strong and with a narrower focus, which would reflect the psyche of the Eldar.

The old ones well they just "were"...in the old 'dex they were created from before time began, now IIRC they just "were"... Sometimes in the grand scheme of things it's nice to have "the unexplained" it adds realism to the story and I know that it sux from a logic stand point but that's what adds to whole mystery and suspense...with out it there would be no player imagination at all...

The C'tan are there from start, beiings of energy they are as old as the Galaxy.
The old ones were the first species to venture from their homeworld, became powerful. Created Eldar and Orks.

Both aren't born as "Gods" but seen as such by some.

The Eldar Gods, are "gods" of the Eldar, they fell when the Eldar found a new playground and "created" a chaos "god".
The ork Gods, are like the Eldar gods an ork-exclusive thing, so both races founded by the old ones have Gods. But I doubt they still remember the old ones or see them as Gods at all....

Some of the Eldar most certainly remember the Old Ones, as they remember their war with the Necrons and know what they're supposed to be doing about them.

Eldar Gods were beings formed from the Eldar psyche in the Warp, they dwelt there and were consumed there by the Chaos Gods, which were formed from the psyche of all psychically sentient races (including Eldar, which fed Slaanesh).

C'tan were cosmic entities formed from the afterbirth of the creation of the universe.

I haven't read the old 2e Eldar Codex, but I'm not sure it's even been touched upon where the Eldar Gods actually came from. Hell, I don't think it's even been clarified if they were gods at all, or if maybe the ancient Eldar were just far, far, more powerful than the ones now. It is basically said that the Eldar history started over a million years ago, and is obviously lost to myths, which they treat as gospel, so it's possible they used even more super-science than they do now.

I mean, like Vaul? Supposedly he was a god, but at the same time created the Blackstone Fortresses, among other items.

It's entirely possible that Eldar of the current game time are as degenerate to their own anscestors as Orks are to Eldar, for example.

Liber Chaotica goes into how during the War in Heaven the Eldar bought summoned the Eldar Gods from the warp to assist them in the fight, but also bought forth Daemons.

I guess that they are much like the Chaos Gods in a way.

Kaela Mensha Khaine fought with the Eldar against the Nightbringer and the Silver Host with the blades that Vaul crafted for him. If that is the case then Vaul might have had the opportunity to build the Talismans whilst the war was going on. The Blades were made before the war in Heaven in a pact between Vaul and Khaine to free Kurnous and Isha.

My totally unsupported fan theory is that Eldar Gods are Old Ones that have evolved beyond needing a physical form. A bit like Emperor reborning as a Starchild.

Well the ONLY Eldar gods still in existance in any form are Khaela Mensha Khaine is fragmented as all the craftworld avatars and Cegorach the laughing God, who fled into the webway while Slaanesh was doing battle with Khaine.

And possibly Isha.

One craftworld believes her to be Nurgle's imprisoned taste-tester..

 Ascalam wrote:
And possibly Isha.

One craftworld believes her to be Nurgle's imprisoned taste-tester..

She is. It's in the Demon codex.

Thats where i was getting it from.

It's not stated as categorical truth, but as a legend on one craftworld IIRC

It would make sense of a sort though. Eldar deity of fertility and life with chaos deity of fertility and life

Ugly Green Trog wrote:
Well the ONLY Eldar gods still in existance in any form are Khaela Mensha Khaine is fragmented as all the craftworld avatars and Cegorach the laughing God, who fled into the webway while Slaanesh was doing battle with Khaine.

Cegorach is actively working with the Dark Eldar - from my understanding, Lady Malys is being helped/has been taken over by Cegorach.

Or other extraplanar entity- it doesn't specify, bt it seems possible,,

Ugly Green Trog wrote:
Well the ONLY Eldar gods still in existance in any form are Khaela Mensha Khaine is fragmented as all the craftworld avatars and Cegorach the laughing God, who fled into the webway while Slaanesh was doing battle with Khaine.

And don't forget Isha. She is alive, even though she is currently "enjoying" the hospitality of Nurgle.

 AtoMaki wrote:


And don't forget Isha. She is alive, even though she is currently "enjoying" the hospitality of Nurgle.

You say this sarcastically, but being with Nurgle is waaay better than if Slaanesh had kept her.

As far as the nature of gods: C'tan and Old Ones are living creatures. C'tan just happen to have reality warping powers. Old One's powers come from their tech and massive psychic powers. These two are only gods in the same sense as the classical Greek gods: immensely powerful, but not omniscient or omnipotent, can be killed, etc.

Pretty much any other being referred to as a god is a daemon, more or less. Or rather, a psychic lifeform native to the Warp. In that sense, all gods, from the Eldar pantheon to the Orks', are gods of Chaos. They have the same nature as the Ruinous Powers, just not the same power level. That was the main reason Khorne and Nurgle fought the newly born Slaanesh to rescue Khaine and Isha, respectively. They were kindred souls that fell into the same domain.