Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

how viable is the idea of chaos worshiping eldar? i know that there are eldar in the eye, but i was wondering about what a chaos worshipping eldar would be like (this is more of a how could they be possible, and what would they be like than a; are they real yes/no deal.)

Also in the story of the fall of kher-ys it says that the eldar maiden's 'soul blazed in the warp, but at its heart was a dark shadow' im wondering what this might be, and also just how much her love for ail'slath'sleresh would go? far enough to worshipping?

.... dark eldars ?

Despite common belief, the Dark Eldar do not actually worship chaos. In fact, they spend every waking moment of their lives trying to avoid chaos, which is why they allowed their psionic abilities to decay.
All that torture and decadence? That's just to avert Slaanesh's attention away from them. They just happen to enjoy as well, because, why not? If you are damned to torture and maim for eternity, why not enjoy it?
That's the tragic aspect of them. And it's delightfully Grim Dark.

And I'm not sure if an Eldar would want to fall to chaos. They are kinda all being hunted by Slaanesh.

^ Demon World guardian.

 Brometheus wrote:


^ Demon World guardian.

Oh, what an interesting picture!
Well, I guess it is possible that an Eldar could find protection from Khorne. I mean, Khorne really hates Slaanesh, so I could see him "safe-guarding" (using that word in its loosest possible meaning) a few of them, just to piss Slaanesh off.
Problem is though that he also really hates psychics...like Eldar.

The only Eldar rumoured to have fallen (Ahrha), came back and is now an uncorrupted member of Dark Eldar.

So there is currently no evidence that any Eldar has fallen and survived (most souls are eaten immediately).
Not to speak a whole army. So Chaos Eldar are not supported by current fluff.

The picture I posted definitely shows what a demon world would look like if it had Eldar inhabitants.

I agree with you that they would not live long ; )

 Kroothawk wrote:
The only Eldar rumoured to have fallen (Ahrha), came back and is now an uncorrupted member of Dark Eldar.

So there is currently no evidence that any Eldar has fallen and survived (most souls are eaten immediately).
Not to speak a whole army. So Chaos Eldar are not supported by current fluff.

Dark Eldar are if anything more fearful of She Who Thirsts but seem to stave of its attentions by constantly drip feeding her strong emotions such as pain and fear.

The path is partially there to prevent the Eldar falling to Chaos so the potential is there for each and everyone of them – its what they try to avoid – Falling.

There is the Path of Damnation - whether this represents an Eldar becoming a "Dark Eldar" or falling to Chaos is not clear.

The Path of the Outcast novel states that the Solitaires soul is owned by Chaos (hence being able to play Slaanesh) but is retrieved and protected by the Laughing God......

The other Three Chaos Powers are one of the few things that could prevent She Who Thirsts from taking an unprotected Eldar’s Soul (*) and so its perfectly possible for an Eldar group to worship one of them - whether they get any real benefit from this is debatable but that’s Chaos worship for you - and if they rise to Daemon Prince then pretty much safe from Slaanesh,

(*) its not clear (to me at least) how an Eldar in transition from Eldar to Dark Eldar (or vice versa)) protects their soul.

Forgot to say - thats an awesome image

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:
The only Eldar rumoured to have fallen (Ahrha), came back and is now an uncorrupted member of Dark Eldar.

So there is currently no evidence that any Eldar has fallen and survived (most souls are eaten immediately).
Not to speak a whole army. So Chaos Eldar are not supported by current fluff.

Dark Eldar are if anything more fearful of She Who Thirsts but seem to stave of its attentions by constantly drip feeding her strong emotions such as pain and fear.

The path is partially there to prevent the Eldar falling to Chaos so the potential is there for each and everyone of them – its what they try to avoid – Falling.

There is the Path of Damnation - whether this represents an Eldar becoming a "Dark Eldar" or falling to Chaos is not clear.

The Path of the Outcast novel states that the Solitaires soul is owned by Chaos (hence being able to play Slaanesh) but is retrieved and protected by the Laughing God......

The other Three Chaos Powers are one of the few things that could prevent She Who Thirsts from taking an unprotected Eldar’s Soul (*) and so its perfectly possible for an Eldar group to worship one of them - whether they get any real benefit from this is debatable but that’s Chaos worship for you - and if they rise to Daemon Prince then pretty much safe from Slaanesh,

(*) its not clear (to me at least) how an Eldar in transition from Eldar to Dark Eldar (or vice versa)) protects their soul.

Well, I would imagine it to be more effective. A Dark Eldar doesn't have to rely on a Soul Stone; he only has to cause as much suffering as possible, and in return he can live a relatively free (and horrible) life. As opposed to the craft world eldar who appears to put strict limitations on themselves, so as to not attract Slaanesh's gaze.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Well, I guess it is possible that an Eldar could find protection from Khorne. I mean, Khorne really hates Slaanesh, so I could see him "safe-guarding" (using that word in its loosest possible meaning) a few of them, just to piss Slaanesh off.
Problem is though that he also really hates psychics...like Eldar.

In a sense, every being in 40k that isn't soulless is psychic to some degree, the amount of manifestation and use varies and most are only psychic enough to be a small light where they can be seen in the warp.

The Eldar themselves are a warrior race. The first thing they did was fight, and in the Craftworld societies what path people actually get lost on is the Warrior one for the most part.

I would say Khorne are the best match for Chaos Eldar, though the others aren't too far either.

 Kroothawk wrote:
The only Eldar rumoured to have fallen (Ahrha), came back and is now an uncorrupted member of Dark Eldar.

So there is currently no evidence that any Eldar has fallen and survived (most souls are eaten immediately).
Not to speak a whole army. So Chaos Eldar are not supported by current fluff.

Chaos Eldar are mentioned to exist on the Krone Worlds, and there's been nothing to contradict this since: "Even so, these planets are not devoid of life, but are home to countless mortal followers and champions of the Chaos Powers as well as immortal daemons and their masters. Among the mortal inhabitants can still be found Eldar, some preserved since the time of the Fall, who champion the cause of Chaos on the Daemon Worlds and throughout the galaxy."

what about the the kher-ys girl?
it seems to me that there is a void of information on them, but still a possibility.

It's very viable, GW hasn't implemented it mainly because Dark Eldar cover the "evil Eldar army" and having another faction like that would be too confusing.

There's the Slaanesh excuse, yes, but really the Eldar are perfect children of Chaos. An Eldar's psychic might and desire to know the future/control their own fate would make them fall into the trap of Tzeentch. An Eldar strong emotions means they can despair like no other race can, making them perfect for Nurgle. Eldar Exarchs are trapped on the path of the warrior, unable to remove their warmask and risking bloodlust/insanity, suitable to Khorne's touch. Really, there's no reason Eldar don't fall to the trepidation of the 3 other Chaos Gods, who in turn protect them from Slaanesh.

 Daba wrote:
Chaos Eldar are mentioned to exist on the Krone Worlds, and there's been nothing to contradict this since: "Even so, these planets are not devoid of life, but are home to countless mortal followers and champions of the Chaos Powers as well as immortal daemons and their masters. Among the mortal inhabitants can still be found Eldar, some preserved since the time of the Fall, who champion the cause of Chaos on the Daemon Worlds and throughout the galaxy."

Guess you accidentally forgot to mention that this source is 18 years old and since then has been deliberately deleted from all Eldar Codices. In Rogue trader years, GW produced all kinds of crazy stuff including 2 or 3 Chaos Eldar miniatures, but since then has retconned all fluff. The only possible evidence for at least one Chaos Eldar has now been proven false. That's why I speak of current fluff, not 18-25 year old fluff.

WD127 is as valid as any, and basically everything introduced has been left unchanged.

They have not contradicted it since, so it's still valid.

But GW's method of retconning something is just to ignore it, so of course they've not contradicted it!

 Kroothawk wrote:

 Daba wrote:
Chaos Eldar are mentioned to exist on the Krone Worlds, and there's been nothing to contradict this since: "Even so, these planets are not devoid of life, but are home to countless mortal followers and champions of the Chaos Powers as well as immortal daemons and their masters. Among the mortal inhabitants can still be found Eldar, some preserved since the time of the Fall, who champion the cause of Chaos on the Daemon Worlds and throughout the galaxy."

Guess you accidentally forgot to mention that this source is 18 years old and since then has been deliberately deleted from all Eldar Codices. In Rogue trader years, GW produced all kinds of crazy stuff including 2 or 3 Chaos Eldar miniatures, but since then has retconned all fluff. The only possible evidence for at least one Chaos Eldar has now been proven false. That's why I speak of current fluff, not 18-25 year old fluff.

I think you're reading a lot more sneakiness into that than there is. Many people consider all old fluff valid unless it has been contradicted.

Chaos eldar are not only possible, but are featured with Chaos eldar sorcerers and led by a dark eldar prince who is offering an imperial world as a sacrifice to become a daemon prince of slanesh. In the soul drinkers omnibus. And it is an entire warband of dark eldar so there is strong evidence that Chaos dark eldar exist. The sorcerers even have Chaos mutations!

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
But GW's method of retconning something is just to ignore it, so of course they've not contradicted it!

That's not what ret-conning is.

But yeah, there are still Eldar on the Crone Worlds and they're said to be amongst the strongest mortal champions of Chaos.

Frozen Ocean wrote:But GW's method of retconning something is just to ignore it, so of course they've not contradicted it!

To be fair, GW's method of retconning is to write something different. Unless they do publish something that clearly contradicts an earlier source, any claims about expired validity are personal opinion.

And since 40k doesn't have a proper canon anyways, there certainly is a lot of room for interpretation on a rarely covered topic like this.

If an Eldar worshiped Chaos, the Chaos Gods wold quickly and promptly eat their soul.

could the Kher-ys eldar girl who let heartslayer in be corrupted?
could that be the darkness in her soul? if not what could it be (in your opinions?)

thanks for the all replies by the way! you have all been helpful so far!

DOOMBREAD wrote:If an Eldar worshiped Chaos, the Chaos Gods wold quickly and promptly eat their soul.

Sure, if that Eldar (a) would actually die and (b) wouldn't use a soulstone.
Chaos Gods don't just pop into the real world and nom people to eat their souls right there and then, they lurk in the Immaterium and prey on people's essence as it enters the Warp after death. At least that's how I understood it works; I've never heard of a Chaos God consuming one of its followers in the material plane.

"When their spirits eventually left their mortal bodies they dissolved peacefully back into the Warp to be reborn again, for the Warp did not have such a thirst for Eldar souls as it does today. [...] If upon death an Eldar's spirit is not captured by his waystone it is sucked into the nightmarish depths of the Warp. To a Human, such a fate means nothing, for virtually no Human mind is strong enough to retain a sense of consciousness after death - the psychic energy of the Human mind being paltry compared to that of an Eldar. Yet for an Eldar to enter the Realm of Chaos as a conscious spirit represents the ultimate horror. In the Warp there is nowhere an Eldar spirit can hide from the predations of Slaanesh; the nemesis of the Eldar awaits to consume them as it did their ancestors."
- 4E C:Eldar

Chaos Emperor wrote:could the Kher-ys eldar girl who let heartslayer in be corrupted?
could that be the darkness in her soul? if not what could it be (in your opinions?)

Quite possible, it's as good a theory as any. The Heartslayer obviously understood to toy with her emotions, which is the way of any daemon to corrupt a being's heart and turn it into a willing pawn of Chaos.

Perhaps it may be worth keeping the assessment of one Ralamine Mung from the Ordo Xenos in mind. Obviously a biased mind, but his conclusions sound eerily logical:
"It is all too easy for an Eldar to embrace the obscene virtues of Chaos, for Slaanesh is nothing more than a manifestation of the Eldar mind in its most wild and unconstrained form. Human morality is meaningless to the Eldar, and to the dark side of the Eldar mind all life is to be expended at a whim. Cruelty and generosity are but the impulse of a moment. Beauty and sensuality are virtues that can be expressed in bloodshed just as easily as in song. To an unfettered Eldar mind there is neither sanity nor madness, but merely a wave of perfect existence fulfilled by its own savage momentum."

tl;dr: it's all a matter of self-control, and although the Eldar have a vastly superior willpower, the temptation will always be there.

Also, the little fluffbox about "the shadowy Eldar of Altansar" in the 4E 'dex seems to allow for quite a bit of interpretation.

 Lynata wrote:

DOOMBREAD wrote:If an Eldar worshiped Chaos, the Chaos Gods wold quickly and promptly eat their soul.

Sure, if that Eldar (a) would actually die and (b) wouldn't use a soulstone.
Chaos Gods don't just pop into the real world and nom people to eat their souls right there and then, they lurk in the Immaterium and prey on people's essence as it enters the Warp after death. At least that's how I understood it works; I've never heard of a Chaos God consuming one of its followers in the material plane.

"When their spirits eventually left their mortal bodies they dissolved peacefully back into the Warp to be reborn again, for the Warp did not have such a thirst for Eldar souls as it does today. [...] If upon death an Eldar's spirit is not captured by his waystone it is sucked into the nightmarish depths of the Warp. To a Human, such a fate means nothing, for virtually no Human mind is strong enough to retain a sense of consciousness after death - the psychic energy of the Human mind being paltry compared to that of an Eldar. Yet for an Eldar to enter the Realm of Chaos as a conscious spirit represents the ultimate horror. In the Warp there is nowhere an Eldar spirit can hide from the predations of Slaanesh; the nemesis of the Eldar awaits to consume them as it did their ancestors."
- 4E C:Eldar

there is also the piont that if an eldar did fall to slaanesh, they would pledge their soul to him, so when they die, he would get it, but in the mean time, they would be able to work for and further the plans of slaanesh, so it would better for slaanesh if he didnt instantlly nom them, as they could render their services to him and help him, in the same way as any champion would.

Chaos Emperor wrote:there is also the piont that if an eldar did fall to slaanesh, they would pledge their soul to him, so when they die, he would get it, but in the mean time, they would be able to work for and further the plans of slaanesh, so it would better for slaanesh if he didnt instantlly nom them, as they could render their services to him and help him, in the same way as any champion would.

Yep, that's how the Chaos Gods treat all their followers - after all, it's not as if there are no Daemon Princes around (whose souls the Chaos Gods could claim at any moment due to their hybrid existence, afaik?).

There are always the Mandrakes as well.
It is implied that they were Eldar who entered into foul unions with Daemons/Warp Creatures before/during the Fall.

To add to what WD127 says, everything in there still exists today almost in exactly the same form albeit updated to the modern rules. The biggest change was Laspistols and Lasguns on the units being changed to Shuriken weaponry or not being available at all now.

Any proof of a single Chaos Eldar in an official rulebook less than 15 years old? Guess not.

BL books did some crazy stuff: C.S.Goto was famous for his Chaos Eldar fetish before he was sacked mostly because of this.

Any contradiciton of the original fluff anywhere in GW books - guess not. In fact there is quite the opposite.

P9 present codex:

"The Eldar of the Craftworlds have developed strict controls over their inner natures so that their civilisation will never again fall to Slaanesh"

So there is a constant danger that Eldar can fall to Chaos and one fo the main defences is the Path.

Exactly the same quotes from the old sources are still used including referenceing the Path of Damnation (p38 present Codex) - again whether this relates to becoming Dark Eldar or falling to Chaos worship is unclear.

p 53 of the Codex referencing Corsairs:

"Some of these are bloodthirsty individuals who fall prey to the same weaknesses of character that led to the Fall."

p 59 Codex:
"It is all too easy for an Eldar to enmbrace the obscene virtues of Choas............." Inquisitor Mung, Ordo Xenos

Its all there.....................

 Brometheus wrote:


^ Demon World guardian.

Wow, neat picture. I thought khorne hated psykers, but if it pisses off slaanesh, I'm sure it's worth it.

 Mr Morden wrote:
Any contradiciton of the original fluff anywhere in GW books - guess not. In fact there is quite the opposite.

P9 present codex:

"The Eldar of the Craftworlds have developed strict controls over their inner natures so that their civilisation will never again fall to Slaanesh"

So there is a constant danger that Eldar can fall to Chaos and one fo the main defences is the Path.

Exactly the same quotes from the old sources are still used including referenceing the Path of Damnation (p38 present Codex) - again whether this relates to becoming Dark Eldar or falling to Chaos worship is unclear.

p 53 of the Codex referencing Corsairs:

"Some of these are bloodthirsty individuals who fall prey to the same weaknesses of character that led to the Fall."

p 59 Codex:
"It is all too easy for an Eldar to enmbrace the obscene virtues of Choas............." Inquisitor Mung, Ordo Xenos

Its all there.....................

Actually ... no.
1.) The Codex is explicit that all Eldar on Croneworlds died instantly during the fall. No official rulebook younger than 15 years gives any hint that a single Chaos Eldar exists. Not actively denying red skinned Orks or Space Marines with 15 legs doesn't mean they exist.
2.) Making sure that no Eldar falls to Chaos is not the same as the existence of Chaos Eldar obviously. Grey Knights warding themselves against Chaos influence is no proof for the existence of Chaos Grey Knights.
3.) If a hostile Inquisitor calls all Eldar pieces of gak doesn't mean they really are. And living the old Eldar ways doesn't mean worshipping Chaos.