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This is a Star Wars related question.

So, when you first watched A New Hope and Obi Wan described the Clone Wars, how did you imagine it compared to the prequels? What was the same? What was different?

I saw A New Hope when I was seven I think and for some reason I imagined like five or six of the last Jedi, save Obi Wan, being slaughtered in a dark forest by Darth Vader, who I imagined as an ugly looking guy that became a cyborg on purpose because he wanted to be stronger. I have no idea why this memory stuck with me. I also assumed there were more than two Sith; hell there was probably a whole army but all of them were killed except Darth Vader and Palpatine. To me, the Clone Wars was like an Age of Legend when the force was the strongest. There were more Jedi, more Sith and everything seemed more epic in scope.

Also, I never imagined Yoda or Palpatine personally fighting in it. They were both old, weak and smart dudes. I assumed that if they did fight, they never used light sabers; they used the force. It would be ridiculous for someone as short as Yoda or as arthritis ridden as Palpatine to swordfight.

I never really though about the term 'Clone' or whether or not any clones were involved. All I really thought about were the Sith and the Jedi killing eachother off until there were only two on each side left, and then Palpatine conquering the galaxy.

I'm wondering if anyone else imagined the Clone Wars as differently as I did when they were a kid.

I used to be a dedicated star wars fan, but then i took 40k to the knee

But seriously now,
I had similar toughs to yours, basically Darth Vader being a total , betraying everyone then killing nearly all the jedi.
I also found it ironic that he fell to chao... Ehm dark side because he wanted to protect his wife (or something similar) but ends up killing her.

I always felt that the fall of the Old Republic should have been more than 20 years previously. When you think about it, their whole democracy collapsed, the jedi were wiped out, and then within 20 years they too were overthrown. It renders the whole Empire a bit less epic, the timescale of the evil empire is turned into something a lot less grand. The feeling I got when seeing the original films was that the Empire had been there for as long as anyone could remember, with the Republic and Jedi largely being something that was in the distant past.

This seemed suggested as such in the original films, the impression from the way that things were discussed, it just seemed more epic. The Old Republic was in the distant past and the jedi had been heading extinct for a long time. The jedi and the force are legendary/mythical, they are seen as some old spooky religion without any real substance, is you believe what Han Solo and Admiral Motti say. Yet it turns out according to the prequels that the Jedi and Republic were apparently at full strength within living memory of both.

I imagines much similarly that the Empire had been around much longer, and that Obiwan spoke of days of old being like 50, 80, 100 years ago (people in the future live longer in my head). I never ever expected that Darth Vader had a wife who willingly had his children.

I always imagined that sometime after the empire was well established and Darth Vader was an up and coming leader he had concubines and conquests and one of these women after escaping, bore his children, hiding them away.

Etc, etc etc.

I agree with Howard.... The prequel movies sort of, well, did ruin my view of the "fall" of the republic and the hunting of all Jedi.

It is rather hinted that a full Jedi doesn't age the way that the "rest" of us do, and even in New Hope, I dont recall Obi Wan mentioning exactly which war he and Anakin were in... its mentioned several times that its the Clone WarS, which means multiple times there was a war dealing in or with clones.
It's funny to mention now, but I remember in many of the books, that when Luke is searching for old Jedi stuff, alot of what he finds to rebuild the Jedi Orders, is in the thousands of years old, which to me definitely suggests that Palpatine and the Sith were working over the Empire for a good long time.

Of course, Admiral Motti may believe that there's no substance to The Force, because he hadn't had any or very much dealings with Vader?

I imagined the Clone Wars as a time of great heroes, Jedi kicking butt, and Anakin being a noble guy. Not a whiny bitch. Also, "already a great pilot" did not mean 'won his first podrace after losing all others.' Darth Vader starting as a hero, okay-it's doable after hearing Obi Wan tell Luke the story, but the prequel does not do justice to what Obi Wan had mentioned to Luke. There was no holy war-there was a war of pawns brought on by the Sith, and a war of tragedy.

I thought, even at their height, the Jedi would have been fewer in number, but much more powerful individually, and a bit more distant from the government.

I imagined them not sucking

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
I always felt that the fall of the Old Republic should have been more than 20 years previously. When you think about it, their whole democracy collapsed, the jedi were wiped out, and then within 20 years they too were overthrown. It renders the whole Empire a bit less epic, the timescale of the evil empire is turned into something a lot less grand. The feeling I got when seeing the original films was that the Empire had been there for as long as anyone could remember, with the Republic and Jedi largely being something that was in the distant past..

Part of the problem with Star Wars, at least for me, is that a lot of what I think regarding the universe has been shaped by the EU rather than the movies themselves. After seeing the prequels, and re-watching the originals, I get the impression that what George had in mind regarding the universe was very different from what lots of people took from it, and a lot less well considered. The originals now seem, in terms of the universe, more about what a kid would find cool than a well crafted world.

Its more Eragon than A Song of Ice and Fire.

I always imagined that the clones were the BAD GUYS. Hordes of clones being unleashed upon the republic with the jedi fighting them. At great cost they finally kill the clones and at their moment of triumph they were betrayed by Vader and killed.

If the better movies are Eragon, then what does that make the prequels? That fanfiction about Doom that ends with "The radio said “No, John. You are the demons”
And then John was a zombie."?

Sgt_Scruffy wrote:
I always imagined that the clones were the BAD GUYS. Hordes of clones being unleashed upon the republic with the jedi fighting them. At great cost they finally kill the clones and at their moment of triumph they were betrayed by Vader and killed.

Add this to what I posted earlier and you get my exact thoughts. Good call, man.

 Ahtman wrote:
If the better movies are Eragon, then what does that make the prequels? That fanfiction about Doom that ends with "The radio said “No, John. You are the demons”
And then John was a zombie."?

I was thinking more Fifty Shades of Grey.

 dogma wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
If the better movies are Eragon, then what does that make the prequels? That fanfiction about Doom that ends with "The radio said “No, John. You are the demons”
And then John was a zombie."?

I was thinking more Fifty Shades of Grey.

I was thinking this: http://www.fanfiction.net/s/8355520/1/FALLOUT-DESERT-FEAR

Three things:

1) Anakin is an adult when Obi-Wan finds him, and is a legitimate character for the entire prequel trilogy, not comic relief. Oh, and he's played by an actor with talent.

2) The clone wars are fought against the clones. I always imagined the clones being this great enemy, enough to break the Republic and allow the Empire to rise. And I certainly expected more than a combination of "let's make a new line of toys" and "oops, we have droid enemies, but now we need to add clones".

3) A greater gap between the prequels and the original trilogy. Even on planets far from the center of civilization the Empire is a fact of life, and the time before it seems like a distant memory. Obviously Luke's age puts a limit on things, but I imagined a slow process, with the Empire taking over in name and gradually eliminating the power structures of the Republic (with the senate the last to go) and the destruction of the jedi happening late in this process.

4) I expected a story focused on the fall of the Republic, with epic conflicts, adventure, etc, and no awkward love stories.


Unfortunately they never made a prequel trilogy, so I'll never know how my expectations might have matched reality.

I know for certain I never thought of all that 'a Jedi never loves nonsense'. How does any of that even make sense when they kept talking about great Jedi families? Does Lucas even know where children come from?

That means there would have to be another way to explain Anakin's treachery while making him sympathetic, which is quite a challenge. Perhaps show him as being raised or mentored by Senator Palpatine, and his eventual betrayal as a choice between loyalty to his father figure and loyalty to his friends (it'd be an interesting contrast to Luke's own challenge in RotJ).


I guess I envisioned a conflict centred around the Clone War, a mass of clones that slowly whittle down the Republic forces, including the brave Jedi leading them. I don't think it'd really work to make those clones just less cool looking storm troopers, either. Give them their own unique look, maybe play on their manufactured nature, making them huge, bulking troops.

The first film would be the assembling of our band of heroes, and be about the discovery of the amassing clone army, and the defeat of the first clone attack. It would contain the seeds of Anakin's eventual treachery, perhaps concluding with Anakin using dark Jedi powers, with good intent but as the first step along a path to the dark side.

The second movie would show the Republic being hammered by the vast numbers of the clone army. The bulk of the movie would show our heroes pulling off a desperate but ultimately successful attack, changing fortunes in the war dramatically, albeit at great cost. This has left the Jedi order and other Republican forces much reduced, leaving the door open for Anakin's sudden treachery and then Palpatine's coup.

The third film would then start with our heroes being hunted down by Anakin (now Vader). The film would then show the sacrifices made by some of our heroes to ensure the others live to fight another day. The critical moment would come when something happens to Vader, and he thinks of his own children, turning his attention towards getting them back. This leads to a pursuit, and eventual showdown between Obi-Wan and Vader, in which Vader's defeat allows the children to be hidden away.

Am i incorrect, but that the "clone wars" consisted of a few lines in Star Wars correct? I always envisioned the Clone Wars to be a separate event from the rise of the Empire. Else it would have been "fall of the Republic" or something.

But yes, gazillions of clones, who couldn't shoot either.

Yeah, I had a much different impression of the clone wars and the times before the empire. I also figured on a longer timeline between the fall and rise of the empire. I think Obiwan was a big reason for that. When I was small I saw that guy as incredibly old and that he had fought in the wars in his 20's so I figured 50 years easy without the fact that force users could live longer. That being said I didn't think much about the clone wars till I started reading the EU starting with Zhan's Trilogy.

Basically I still think Lucas is an idiot. But it's his sandbox and he can do what he wants. Even if it means spitting in the eye of some incredible stuff.

Oh, and I imagined the Jedi Order as much different.

To me, the Sith were selfishness and the Jedi were being kind. It was as simple as that. If Jedi wanted, they could have families, love people and gak. It would be the Sith who couldn't love people.

I was 7, I was just awesome to see lightsaber battles.

hotsauceman1 wrote:I was 7, I was just awesome to see lightsaber battles.

I was a nerdy, obsessive kid from a young age. When I was watching Star Wars all I cared about were the lightsaber battles, but after watching the movies I couldn't stop thinking about them. Hell, I was probably obsessed with Star Wars for the next three or four years, before moving onto being obsessed with Battletech.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I imagined the Clone Wars as a time of great heroes, Jedi kicking butt, and Anakin being a noble guy. Not a whiny bitch. Also, "already a great pilot" did not mean 'won his first podrace after losing all others.' Darth Vader starting as a hero, okay-it's doable after hearing Obi Wan tell Luke the story, but the prequel does not do justice to what Obi Wan had mentioned to Luke. There was no holy war-there was a war of pawns brought on by the Sith, and a war of tragedy.

This.

I saw it as a Golden Age, and my dream prequel would have Anakin and Obiwan running around as an established duo, maybe filling in some of their back story together with flashbacks, building the team dynamic, making their friendship the REAL story, making the sudden, yet inevitable betrayal in Episode 3 all the more moving and painful. Clones I figured were exactly what it said on the tin... I just thought they'd be the bad guys, with the Old Republic's valiant normal troopers and Jedi fighting off the unending tide.

I pictured it as the Clones were the bad guys like it seems the majority of star wars fans did. (the EU even wrote it that way at first)

That the Republic existed before being invaded by the Clone forces. The Republic was nearly destroyed in the process but ultimately they won the war.

The reason for this victory was because humanity took the brunt of the fighting (like in the Galactic Civil War). Coming out of the war feeling confident in human superiority, Palpatine stood up and lead the now politically powerful humans to overthrow the government which was weak in the war and created an Empire to better defend human interest from the ashes of the Republic

I was disappointed by the Clone Wars saga, it was not as epic as I thought it would be. The only redeemable characters were Mace and Grevious.

Wait Count Dookey was pretty good too, but thats just Christopher Lee playing himself. I also liked the Spass Emprah, er Palpatine.

 Frazzled wrote:
Wait Count Dookey was pretty good too, but thats just Christopher Lee playing himself. I also liked the Spass Emprah, er Palpatine.

Hmm, true. Count Doku was pretty good but I expected a lot more from Christopher Lee. Though, compared to his other roles, it was lacking something.

 rockerbikie wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
Wait Count Dookey was pretty good too, but thats just Christopher Lee playing himself. I also liked the Spass Emprah, er Palpatine.

Hmm, true. Count Doku was pretty good but I expected a lot more from Christopher Lee. Though, compared to his other roles, it was lacking something.

Even great actors are limited by the director...

They could certaintly have been better.

I actually imagined the Jedi knights being like, well, knights. The galaxy is a republic that has the Jedi order as its nobility. The republic has basically the Jedi order and the senate as its 2 branches of government. Jedi are non-elected and gain their station by their abilities as well as by lineage, so some "jedi" knights may not actually be force sensitive but are rather the children and family of jedi.

I always envisioned Obi-Wan having squared off against Anakin on a lava planet. Looking back, I think this was because I pored over the old Ralph McQaurrie art book and there was a concept of Luke fighting Vader before the Emperor in a lava-lit setting. That and I think somewhere (in the novelizations?) there was mention of Obi-Wan leaving Anakin for dead in a lava pit.

The prequels are not great by any stretch but I like them much, much better than about 90% of the EU. The big exception for me regarding the EU are the Knights of the Old Republic games, which at least felt like Star Wars. I also like the X-Wing series of novels (the earlier more than the later ones) and Dark Empire. Dark Empire is apparently kind of controversial but maybe that's what I like about it -- a darkness that struck me as a more appropriate result of the tumult of galactic war than a teddy bear luau.

All in all, I think the prequels are better than what I had imagined them (to the limited extent that I had as a kid) with two major exceptions. First, as has already been mentioned, the idea of Darth Vader as a toddler was even worse than Ewoks beating up the Empire's crack troops. Second, I think almost anyone could think of a more compelling love story than what we saw in Attack of the Clones. That said, the lightsaber duels, space battles, and clone armies were above and beyond what I dared to hope for and I think they're a great treat to watch and re-watch.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 sebster wrote:
I guess I envisioned a conflict centred around the Clone War, a mass of clones that slowly whittle down the Republic forces, including the brave Jedi leading them.

I also expected that the clones of these mysterious Clone Wars would be the bad guys. Making them protagonists led by Jedi indicates to me that George Lucas is a lot more imaginative and smart than it's currently fashionable to say.

When it comes to the love story in the Prequels I believe it was famous whit and critic/character assassin Yahtzee Croshaw who described Anakin and Padme's chemistry as "Two chairs stacked together" and frankly comparing them to inanimate objects is being generous.