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For the moment I'm thinking 6x wraiths and a night scythe would do me the best.

... seriously, people, we have a forum for posting army lists.
Tactica threads should really be for tactics discussion, no?

 skoffs wrote:
... seriously, people, we have a forum for posting army lists.
Tactica threads should really be for tactics discussion, no?

I had that debate with myself before I posted this. I figured it was more of a tactical choice rather than a fully pointed list looking for critique. I've got no issue moving it if it's that big of an issue.

it's not a MASSIVE issue, but if new kids come along and see people posting their army lists looking for critique, suddenly the entire thread will become a "hey guys, what do you think about my list?" thread.
(hence the reason we try to discourage it)

 Brymm wrote:
I've been tempted to toss in an ADL but then I picked up the codex and said:
"Let me just thumb through this and find the best and cheapest BS 5 character to man the Quad gun and I will ju-"
then I just stop WE HAVE NO BS 5 GUYS! If I wanted to put a C'tan on it or pray for Okra-man to turn, well, I would just quit playing 40k.

What about a Tomb Blade with Nebuloscope for 25 points?
Granted, a turn sequence like this would get dizzy: Move to other side of Quad gun (or just move in a circle around the Quad gun and end up where you started) (I moved... I get jink). Fire Quad gun. Rinse. Repeat.

Saying about more tactical approach need to ask for Your opinion about LG's. In which wargear You table them, more arms power with warscythe or more durability with shields and phase sword ?
Just got myself box of them and not sure what should i choose.....

 Lithzur wrote:
Saying about more tactical approach need to ask for Your opinion about LG's. In which wargear You table them, more arms power with warscythe or more durability with shields and phase sword ?
Just got myself box of them and not sure what should i choose.....

Do not field them, far too expensive for what they bring and not worth their points. I've seen people using Anraykr and a unit of LG , but comp-wise, they suck.

Either use the box to make Crypteks or make TP, they fare well with a DL.

If you want close combat, you absolutely cannot beat wraiths. Warscythes will hit harder, but wraiths can get into combat fast, and they tend to shrug off most damage thrown at them.

And here is the rub. A Dlord with wraiths is a great cc squad but if you want a cc squad to take down termies you need a DLord with praetorians which I hardy ever see Necron players using. I know there are issued with praetorians ... don't get me wrong but we need to fill in the gaps in our lists. Right now we have plenty of AA, AT and anti-infantry. A few deathmark squads in Night scythes, a few warrior squads in scythes and one in a ghost ark and a some depairteqs and stormteqs and most of our needs are filled. The we need to decide what HQ we want. Do we still want barge lords or do we use Nemesor - I've beaten the stormlord HQ on too many occasions to have in him for myself. Do we take a secondary HQ in the DLord? Or just use Nemesor and a regular Lord?

Since I use Necs only as a small allied detachment my experience with a full Nec list is what I have faced and what gives me headaches. By far Nemesor is the hardest HQ for me to get around with phased reinforcements. It means as many scythes as my opponent wants generally can arrive turn one/two safely unless I use no reserves - which is never. How many armies fully deploy on turn one? These lists set up a devastating turn for my opponent and I need to be very careful how I deploy to counteract. And generally there are already a least a few barges and an ghost arc on the table. I think Necrons overall are one of my toughest match ups. Which is why I use them myself as allies.

I see your point Sigvatr, but I alrdy got wraiths hanging out with DL. Mainly wanted to make of them retinue for OL with orb on board of NS for backstabing co-op with DM's. Pretorians are great but OL gona have hard time to chase them up... Thats why I was thinkig about LG's

As far as praetorians go you need to use them with the right list. If you are fielding Nemsor and a Dlord with orb, you get prefered enemy, and your choice of furious charge or counter attack. I would not play Necs without Nemesor if I was using them as my primary force. So it is not a sacrifice. Praetorians in a phased reinforcement list can be quite good.

Alright then but if I field Nemesor, all what I can do with him is to keep him out of LOS as long as possible and take advantage from his specials. Without Oby or MSS's hes no good option for doing anything like add to cc squad or shooty. or i think it is not worth the risk.

I have had some good success with Zahndrekh in the backfield joined to a squad of 3 Heavy Destroyers, and a 2nd decked out Overlord with a squad of 7 Warriors and 2 regular Lords with WSs and one with a SW.

Zahndrekh gves the Destroyers a Metal Shield with the SW, PS, and RO. The Overlord and the Lords can put out 10 WS attacks on the charge for only 500pts. If I get a challege I ask what the other guy is using. If it is AP2 I except with my OL w/ PS, if it is AP3 I just use the regular Lord with the SW.

I should also note I run double Pulseteks with this list. The first turn Zahndrekh gives the Destroyers Night Vision to try and get 1st blood on an easy vehicle. The second turn he usually is giving the other OL something. I look out sir anything that is AP2 after the first wound, and then have him leave the Destroyers and join to the back of the Pulsetek+Warrior squad.

I really like the idea of putting Zahn in with Heavy Destroyers but I think it hampers on one of the main reason to field any form of destroyer at all: mobility. I use mine (when I do) to fly around the flanks and wreck side armor with ease. I can use it to spread my enemy out and make them deal with a mobile threat to their armor that is FAR away from my main force.
When I play Crons, I'll keep most of my army together as most of them have about a 24inch threat range. If I need something dead, I might split off some of the firepower to engage, but usually that doesn't happen till mid-end game. The only time I do something different from this is when I fly wraiths and scarabs up (then I'm playing a different list anywho) or use destroyers as mentioned.
By the way, Zahndrekh rules. How many times have you been asked "what does he do exactly?" or "He doesn't need line of sight for that?" or "What's the range on that power?" Everytime, I chuckle a little bit inside.


Oh and be cautious if you want to "tank" with Zahn. He doesn't have eternal warrior and as I have found out, it just takes one railgun to do him in. "Look out, Sir!" -1-... "Come'on 3+!" -1- ARGH!!!! When I play Chaos, Even if I do have Eternal Warrior (when I use Abby when I play Chaos), I just pretend LOS is another 2+ armor save. My character is always more valuable than the rest of the unit. This is espeically true with Necrons as we have some of the best IC's in the game.

I would field Nemesor at the back with a squad of warriors and destrukteg in an ark with a few Anni barges by his sides. The regular nec player around here does just that and other than a template I cannot touch him. Also night fighting is in efect turn one so his phased reinforcements are generally safer too. This combined with some nifty powers makes him a solid choice.

Now admittedly the list I play against him favors him - drop pod SW. So I need to worry about a lot of units - despairteq deathmarks, night scythes, et all.

How do you guys deal with Blood Angels? I've been playing my friend after his recent switch from Ultrasmurfs to Vampire Jesus Cult and I've been having a hell of a time dealing with his mobility and uncanny ability to get me locked into CC. Fast Vindicators lay waste to any larger units I may have while he flies his Assault Marines at me - usually with a Drop Pod Dreadnaught to take care of my back A. Barge line.

I know he isn't using an optimal list by far and neither am I - but what do you usually take when playing against BA? Are the Storm/Transmog Cryptek's worth it for their anti-charge capabilities? He has been able to reliably engage most of my units in CC by turn 2 or 3 at the latest.

Honestly - if you are going to tailor a list then wraithwing will carve him up if you use two DLord with warscythes, orb, weave and MSS and three squads of wraiths. Everything else in night scythes backed by barges. Good thing is that wraith wing is a rock hard list anyway and fun to play. Charge forward at those vindies early and use night fight turn one a and night scythes turn two.

Tactics question:
Does anyone deep strike their Flyers?
I always just fly mine on from the table edge, but I was wondering if it would be better to try other methods of insertion.
(I'm unsure on the rules for deep strike scatter/mishap, when it comes to flyers, so I don't want my Doomscythe to suddenly and inexplicably explode simply because it appeared flying over a guardsman)

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Lithzur wrote:
Saying about more tactical approach need to ask for Your opinion about LG's. In which wargear You table them, more arms power with warscythe or more durability with shields and phase sword ?
Just got myself box of them and not sure what should i choose.....

Do not field them, far too expensive for what they bring and not worth their points. I've seen people using Anraykr and a unit of LG , but comp-wise, they suck.

Either use the box to make Crypteks or make TP, they fare well with a DL.

LG are my current project, I've found them intriguing since the Dex dropped but focused my armies in other directions. I know of people using them in conjunction with either Nemesor or Trazyn quite effectively so I'm not sure I would label them far too expensive or sucky.

I think if you run them with Nemesor you should go with the Warscythes, for the potential S8 AP 1 attacks on the charge, plus Stealth+Cover will help mitigate the lack of save.

If Trazyn, Sword and Board, with a MSS/SW/WS/RO Lord.

Either way, Night Scythe, or maybe Oby with Nemie.

And you have to really commit to them. 5 LG will be taken down by focused fire. 8 to 10, especially arriving after two turns of firepower via a Nightschythe...not so much. If you can design them in a list where they get their RP rolls going until they reach CC, I think they have the potential to be quite competitive.

One thing I've noticed is as people get use to the Sword and Board reflecto shot they will naturally push everything back away from the LG (even more so then if they were just another CC unit). Use that to your advantage. Spread out, and keep the enemy away from your long range firepower. What's some really potent long range firepower that this pairs nicely with? Doomsdays, and a couple of them.

Here is a list I'm messing around with at the moment:



Pretty heavy Elite section, which is a bit unorthodox (although that tends to be a running theme for my lists, both heavy elites, and unorthodoxy). The C'Tan is there primarily to augment the Doomsday Arcs,as Grand Illusion tends to make them much more flexible (and survivable) as it dramatically lowers the chances of them getting placed in a bad place. He also combines with the Spyder to protect my back field (particularly the arcs, but my scoring elements as well) from fast/outflanking/DSing CC units. The Spyder of course keeps those big guns doing what they do best.

The LG/Stormtek Squads push the envelope forward and away from the Arcs so they can pewpew all game relatively unabated.

It's actually proven to be quite effective thus far, and extremely fun to play. It's got a decent Air unit with 3 NS, devastating firepower with the 2 DA's, strong anti-tank with the stormteks/Tesla Ds/DAs, very respectable CC with the C'Tan, 10 LG/Trazyn/Lord, and the Spyder. I recommend giving it (or something like it) a go. I still think it needs tweaking, but something along those general lines seems to be working well.

Edit: put my, ahem, visual aid of the army that was inculded for context of my LG tactics discussion under spoiler

Could you please keep Army Lists in the Army-list section?

 skoffs wrote:
Tactics question:
Does anyone deep strike their Flyers?
I always just fly mine on from the table edge, but I was wondering if it would be better to try other methods of insertion.
(I'm unsure on the rules for deep strike scatter/mishap, when it comes to flyers, so I don't want my Doomscythe to suddenly and inexplicably explode simply because it appeared flying over a guardsman)

Disclaimer: At the moment I do not yet own a flyer, but this is my plan with them.

With Zhandrekh as HQ, I would definitely Deepstrike them.
His rulings allow you to put all your Doom Scythes and Night Scythes in the game on T1 if the opponent happens to play with a Drop Pod or other nonsense that Deep Strikes T1.
Against the new DA and many DS-armies you will surely have them on T2.

Well, if one were to deep strike them in on the opponent's turn, where would you place them?
Normally, if I'm going to deep strike, I do so in the hopes to shoot whatever I aim to land next to. If I do that on my opponent's turn, I'm just going to sit there through both THEIR shooting and assault phases. Granted, assault is probably not going to matter most of then time for flyers, but shooting... something tells me this would be a bad idea.

So would you try to place them in enemy territory, or on your own side where it's safe?

 skoffs wrote:
Well, if one were to deep strike them in on the opponent's turn, where would you place them?
Normally, if I'm going to deep strike, I do so in the hopes to shoot whatever I aim to land next to. If I do that on my opponent's turn, I'm just going to sit there through both THEIR shooting and assault phases. Granted, assault is probably not going to matter most of then time for flyers, but shooting... something tells me this would be a bad idea.

So would you try to place them in enemy territory, or on your own side where it's safe?

If one were to deepstrike? If I were playing a competition, I would Deepstrike 4 right away.
And T1 Deepstriking flyers is something I would never do in a non-Apoc game with friends.

So to your question, assuming I DS them in their turn with Zahndrekh:
I would place them wherever I feel that they are safest, so probably somewhere in my own deployment-zone.
It are flyers, so in my turn I will move them close enough to shoot. But during my opponent's turn, I don't want every single one of his Marines to shoot at it.
I could even use a cheap Pulsetek to be sure it stays alive.

But I do not know how I would play it if I bring them out during my turn.

All that seems to working just fine but still, if anyone feels like to take advantage of Nemie 'phased reinforcments' and DS in T1, need to have Nemie alrdy on the table (again doing not much more then giving orders)...unless joined by vtek and whatever U wish to make opponent hurt.
Got this little combo on my mind but not sure if it would work out...
Nemie with lets say 10x warr on table, DSing monolith onto enemys back, use 'dementional corridor' to port in Nemie with warr's and in same moment (after deploying Nemie unit), use Oby's 'ghostwalk mantle' to shield them with Oby+TP/LG+stek with lightning field ....all in T1 ofc...not sure tho if after DS, portal of exile can be used in such way....?

KelCJ wrote:
One strategy I've seen go around is a full phalanx of 20 warriors with a destroyer lord giving the entire unit preferred enemy. Not a bad idea for a mini deathball. Some have also gone so far as to also include a decked out overlord with phaeron to give the squad the ability to charge after rapid firing to finish off whatever squad didn't get annihilated by rapid firing (assuming it's nothing like terminators or something )

I went up against this with my space wolves. My RP managed to kill the Destroyer Lord but he resurrected killing my RP the next turn. I also had 2 Grey Hunters in the squad that killed 4 Warriors. I lost the combat in the end due to the Resurrections.

What is everyone's thought on scarab bases. I'm going to field 6 backed up by 2 spyders. Do you think I should run them as 1x6 unit or 2x3 units.

 Lithzur wrote:
All that seems to working just fine but still, if anyone feels like to take advantage of Nemie 'phased reinforcments' and DS in T1, need to have Nemie alrdy on the table (again doing not much more then giving orders)...unless joined by vtek and whatever U wish to make opponent hurt.
Got this little combo on my mind but not sure if it would work out...
Nemie with lets say 10x warr on table, DSing monolith onto enemys back, use 'dementional corridor' to port in Nemie with warr's and in same moment (after deploying Nemie unit), use Oby's 'ghostwalk mantle' to shield them with Oby+TP/LG+stek with lightning field ....all in T1 ofc...not sure tho if after DS, portal of exile can be used in such way....?

Worth noting that the Veil of Darkness and Ghostwalk Mantles do not allow the unit to arrive via Phased Reinforcements, as the pieces of wargear do not actually confer the DS USR.

Drakmord wrote:

 Lithzur wrote:
All that seems to working just fine but still, if anyone feels like to take advantage of Nemie 'phased reinforcments' and DS in T1, need to have Nemie alrdy on the table (again doing not much more then giving orders)...unless joined by vtek and whatever U wish to make opponent hurt.
Got this little combo on my mind but not sure if it would work out...
Nemie with lets say 10x warr on table, DSing monolith onto enemys back, use 'dementional corridor' to port in Nemie with warr's and in same moment (after deploying Nemie unit), use Oby's 'ghostwalk mantle' to shield them with Oby+TP/LG+stek with lightning field ....all in T1 ofc...not sure tho if after DS, portal of exile can be used in such way....?

Worth noting that the Veil of Darkness and Ghostwalk Mantles do not allow the unit to arrive via Phased Reinforcements, as the pieces of wargear do not actually confer the DS USR.

Oh man... I researched this and came up with some VERY conflicted people and answers. In the end the argument came down to some people believing that you did not need the Deepstrike universal rule - only the ability to Deepstrike at some point. They figure that since the ability itself bends the Deepstrike rules that it only needs to be able to Deep Strike (any means) for it to be able to use Nemesor's Phased Reinforcements.

As much as I'd like for it to be usable with Phased Reinforcements it just doesn't seem to be so and the argument for it is a little iffy itself. Personally I'd think that design wise they probably meant for it to be usable as such. You can only bring the Veil twice and one Obyron to the fight - even then is that really a great tactic?

Links to previous arguments...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/448849.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/484315.page

TL;DR
I'm not sure what the official response is to being able to Phase Reinforcements in with Veil of Darkness/Obyrons Mantle but it would appear that it could be a valid tactic if agreed upon in friendly games.

Maybe I put things wrong, forgive me..but what I have in mind is to DS only monolith itself, then through 'dementional corridor' port in Nemie and warriors, then use 'ghostwalk mentle' of Obie (6 inchies from Nemie i do not have to scatter right?), shield Nemie unit with him and some TP.
Yeah I messed up by thinking that i can use 'phased reinforcments' and activate 'corridor'. That rule of Nemie can be used in enemy trun which means that I can only show up, cant shoot or do other stuff. Excitement of that evil plan in T1 made me blind to basic rules

It gives them some targets to shoot at.

My army is still being built and I played a game using Nemesor and a DLord kitted out for dueling. I'd wait till he drop-podded a Dreadnaught then I'd DS my DLord over in his spawn next to his tanks. That guy is a great killer and at a 1500 pt game can usually take quite a beating. It's a suicide tactic - but it draws and usually wastes a turn of firing on the DLord while he will take out a tank or three.

Dsing Dlord also placing him in a prior "to shoot at" list of Ur enemy and cc units cant do much after DS as I'm sure U know. And I agree with U but most of tactics carry a risk, there is no fun without it Nonetheless monolith after DS can shoot (particle whip and flyers), Nemie with warriors coming out from monolith corridor also can shoot in a same turn, alike Oby with TP's+htek when ghostwalk out on front of Nemie unit, also can shoot. By taping into Oby unit Dlord+orb we have quite strong firepowerd, cc and resilient unit...anything that left after their shooting turn I rly doubt that can do much damage in return. Both Nemie and Oby units have orb and lets not forget---> theres that damn huge monolith

Guys please lets just forget about using here 'phaced reinforcments', that was my bad and I know where and why I was wrong. This time pure DS/reserves is on my mind.....and what do U think about that maneuver? Want to test it this saturday but I'm still not sure tho if 'dementional corridor' can be used after DSing monolith

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/506368.page <-- if anyone ask about full list to my plan

Hello Guys,
I'm hoping for a bit of help.

I made a mistake and deep struck my deathstar to close to my opponents Blood Angles Troops (and I only realized too late, HQ).

However once the assault begun (and finished) in 1 turn. (Damn you sweeping advances) I realized I might be screwed as Mephiston and Brother Corbulo continued across the board towards my main forces.

How would I defeat a Mephiston and Brother Corbulo combo? Mephiston with toughness 6 and has a 2+ armor save, and wounds that ignore his armor he just passes off to Corbulo who has a 2+ FNP.

I had 2 squads of Deathmarks (13 deathmarks total) (and a veil-tek) fire into him (he was marked), an annihilation barge, 4 destruct-teks and a night scythe fire everything they could into him, and between the two of them he only suffered 1 wound! (leaving Mephiston with 4 wounds and Corbulo with his two)

How could I beat that combo, just more shooting?

Any insight would be appreciated