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First Skorne List. I'm basically attempting to have one purchase get me to the necessary points levels each time. I'm auto including the battleforce.

Master Tormentor Morgul +7
Titan Gladiator 1 (8)
Cyclops Savage 5
Cyclops Savage 5
Min unit of Swordsmen OR Karax 4

15

Bronzeback Titan 10

25

This gets me to 15 and 25 in one purchase. The only issue is which one to buy. Would either be more useful given the list? Are either more likely to make it in a general Skorne list?

Critique away.

I like the Karax better, personally. They can advance in Shield Wall and protect the squishier casters by blocking LOS/charge lanes. Everything else you have will shred infantry if need be, but the swordsmen can't do anything else...

Get min Beasthandlers and a solo of your choice; beasthandlers are a must have in 99% of skorne lists. they're just sooooooo good!

15 pts:

Morg (+7)
-BB (10)
-Glad (8)
-min beast handlers (2)
-w/e 2 pt solo you want, agonizer is solid for general purpose.

25 pts:
You can literally add in your 2 savages and the list will be completely fine and playable with crazy savage missles.

You can also easily add in an infantry unit(I suggest swordsman + UA or nihilators, then add in another 2 pt solo.
Another suggestion thats interesting is adding in Full swordsman + witch doc croc + gobbers so you can make your swordsman undead/tough, you can also sac pawn swordsman to get rid of key high defense models/solos your opponent has.

In general I would avoid karax until you have a good idea of a specific list you want them in. I also feel they are lackluster at low points as they are just a tarpit in most cases since they cant hit reliably and have low pow.

Ideally my 25 pt list would be as below since its quite rounded, though going just pure beasts is really fun with morg.
Morg
-BB
-Glad
full swords + UA
witch doc
gobbers

Thank you for the suggestions! I guess I wanted to avoid the beast handlers at first, simply because i'm still learning to play. And it'll be much easier to figure out how to use a basic, no frills infantry unit, than one with so many options as the beast handlers.

I also would like to avoid the agonizer solo, mostly because I absolutely despise the model. And I think its stuff only works on Warbeasts, right? My FLGS is mostly warmachine.

 gpfunk wrote:
Thank you for the suggestions! I guess I wanted to avoid the beast handlers at first, simply because i'm still learning to play. And it'll be much easier to figure out how to use a basic, no frills infantry unit, than one with so many options as the beast handlers.

I also would like to avoid the agonizer solo, mostly because I absolutely despise the model. And I think its stuff only works on Warbeasts, right? My FLGS is mostly warmachine.

If you are playing skorne without beasthandlers in your list...thats like running a marathon without a leg, thats how big of a deal they are and they should be in literally every skorne list you make with the single exception of some Zaal lists. They should be the first infantry unit you learn with skorne, and honestly they are very simple as they will always move then either remove fury or enrage your beasts for the most part, maybe heal once in a while...they are honestly simplier then any other infantry units to learn. Also the agonizer works against warmachine(read its 3rd ability) and ya its model is a bit bleh, saxon yorick is also a solid 2 pt alternative especially with infantry in skorne lacking pathfinder.

My friend always runs the agonizer, and I have yet to be impressed with it. If it does get annoying, it's really not that hard to kill.

SilverSaint wrote:

If you are playing skorne without beasthandlers in your list...thats like running a marathon without a leg, thats how big of a deal they are and they should be in literally every skorne list you make with the single exception of some Zaal lists. They should be the first infantry unit you learn with skorne, and honestly they are very simple as they will always move then either remove fury or enrage your beasts for the most part, maybe heal once in a while...they are honestly simplier then any other infantry units to learn. Also the agonizer works against warmachine(read its 3rd ability) and ya its model is a bit bleh, saxon yorick is also a solid 2 pt alternative especially with infantry in skorne lacking pathfinder.

It hasn't seemed like i've been running with one leg yet. But that is possibly because I only have three beasts, two of which (the savages) I run as missles. Charge, max out fury, fail threshold, boosted attack and damage on their one attack they'd normally get. So I dont need much manipulation aside from the gladiator. I was going to purchase the handlers after I got a Bronzeback. With four beasts, it seems Morghul and his 5 fury would really struggle to control all of it.

And are handlers really easier to figure out than Swordsmen? I figured they'd be a point and click speed bump.

I took a look at Saxon Orrick and he has a beast model. Love it. I could find my way to ramming him into a list. He'd just be a cool model to paint. And pathfinder rocks.

Unless I start going to tournaments, which even if I did would be a long way away since i've only been in this thing for two weeks (5 games), I won't be taking the agonizer. Just cant stand looking at it! Which I guess is the point. At least fluff wise. I do see that he removes Jack's ability to allocate focus or be used as arc nodes. Can't believe I glossed over that. My apologies!

The biggest deal with the BH is that +2 str and a free charge, that makes your missles much deadlier.

 spyguyyoda wrote:
My friend always runs the agonizer, and I have yet to be impressed with it. If it does get annoying, it's really not that hard to kill.

Big thing is to hide the aggy behind things (heavies for example). If an agonizer gets into position against warmachine armies (Khador for example) that REALLY need their jacks to knock out heavies, it greatly hurts them.

Well, I guess it could be because I play Menoth (enough weapon masters kill heavies just fine) and Legion (I loves me some Forsaken).

I played a game recently with the beast masters and they handled ably. I probably just didn't use them correctly. They aren't hard to figure out. That said, I did lose that game but it was against eLylth.

I'm starting to see the limitations of the box though. Played Minions yesterday and got trashed. He had a heavy warpig, two cannon pigs, and lord carver. I couldn't get a good charge in, did very little damage, and got smashed. Admonition totally got shut down by quagmire and my heavies got mulched!

So, where to go from here is causing me more and more thought.

 gpfunk wrote:
I played a game recently with the beast masters and they handled ably. I probably just didn't use them correctly. They aren't hard to figure out. That said, I did lose that game but it was against eLylth.

I'm starting to see the limitations of the box though. Played Minions yesterday and got trashed. He had a heavy warpig, two cannon pigs, and lord carver. I couldn't get a good charge in, did very little damage, and got smashed. Admonition totally got shut down by quagmire and my heavies got mulched!

So, where to go from here is causing me more and more thought.

pMorghoul is a very limited caster; hes very easy to figure out, and his small control range means he'll always be toward the front. He plays very well against other armies of the same type (rush up and smash!), but does poorly against any armies with crazy tricks or debuffs. Personally, I don't much like pMorg above 25 points, his small control and lack of support for anyone aside beasts, not to mention his low fury count, hurts. That said, I feel Morg operates best with 3 heavies, no lights, support solos, and self sufficient units (Nihilators). Morg likes to make his beasties hit hard, and a P+S 22 Bronzeback is no joke (enraged/abused). Beasthandlers basically just have to follow around the beasts managing any fury Morg cannot take, and enraging those beasts that you need to. After losing them early in an eIrusk matchup with pMakeda, I realized quickly how much I missed that +2 str (I had issues killing Spriggan without it).

Yeah, i'm finding out his limitations as of now. It's personally hard for me to get him in the perfect position to throw the gladiator forward to kill the baddest beasty simply because I feel from the card that this guy wants to slam. But, with his ability to follow up being the one that really does damage, I usually have to activate Morghul first and and him out from behind the gladiator at weird angles to hopefully be in control range for the follow up attacks I'd want to buy on a knocked down opponent.

This caused me pain against eLylth as she then just sniped me, circumventing my attempts to block LOS with a savage with ease. Against pigs, it meant that my Glad charged to early and then got stomped by return fire.

Yeah, slams have to be very selective; the gladis crushes face pretty easily, and I was like you when I started, I always slammed. But it always puts her out of position, and Morg is super squishy if someone can actually hit him. Tiberions a really good escort for Morghoul, as is a Cyclops Brute.

But yeah, once you learn positioning and when to do stuff, Skornes pretty powerful. Our beasts are top notch, and we can manage high amounts of fury like no other faction. Skornes probably the only faction that you can run an army of all beasts with some handlers and it'll work fine lol