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Gorm is the one model I'm not impressed with. I really dislike how the wrist/ankles are done on that model. It is a serious detraction.

I am just wondering if Adam is keeping in mind a total price to get all "game content" add-ons.

At this rate, it's going to be rather high. And while I love the look of this game, once I go past $300 for what is ostensibly a board game... I don't know, it starts to sound crazy!

Sooooooo yeah... I just sold my Rhulic to help fund this, but I'm usually "all or nothing", so if I can't get all, I get drawn back towards nothing...

I would really like to see some stretches that double the remaining armor sets for Survivor level.

Even things like the Gorm box- is the retail box really only going to have 4 armor sets? Is this game not designed for 6 players? That's what I find confusing... and a bit frustrating.

I know he's holding things back to goose the campaign along through the center (which he's doing quite well) but in my mind for Kickstarters, stretch goal does not always equal "add more money".

I'd like to see some that don't cost 1/3 - 1/4 of my original pledge (since this one was $40, for one large model, 4 small models, and the cards...). That's not a terrible deal, but you can only stack up so many of those until people start to hit their limits.

Now, if this was the Lion Knight, I probably wouldn't be talking this way............. but at $40 with a supposed MSRP of $60, this one just didn't seem to be that alluring imo. Clearly, it's gotten lots of people to up their pledges, but I'm just saying you can only do that for so long before folks max out, and you need to make the base deal a bit sweeter to draw in more backers instead of squeezing the current ones for every last drop!

Agreed with RiTides, especially the part about typically not having to pay extra for stretch goals. Some? Sure. But it seems like most of them are costing extra dough.

I'm already in for $300 as well, and as you said, it's a board game! Never in my life did I think I'd spend $300 on a board game, even though this one comes with some beautiful models.

I am in for 300 as well however that is my max unless he offers upgradable settlements and an official gameboard.

I should clarify that I mean a 2'x3' board kind of like what they demo on with the 3d faces.

primalexile wrote:
I am in for 300 as well however that is my max unless he offers upgradable settlements and an official gameboard.

The game is going to come with a 2'x3' game board.

 Lt. Coldfire wrote:

primalexile wrote:
I am in for 300 as well however that is my max unless he offers upgradable settlements and an official gameboard.

The game is going to come with a 2'x3' game board.

I'm pretty sure the issue people have is that the only hint of the official board we've seen is the concept sketch. All the actual pictures of the game provided are on that much smaller stand-in. I'm not sure, has it been confirmed what the 2'x3' board will be made of? Plastic? Cardboard?

I'm currently up to $200 and I'm debating as to whether I want to include enough add-ons to reach $300. That seems like the optimal level to get "everything" for the game in plastic (to this point), but to get there from the Survivor level, I'd need to add all the expansions (including Gorm) and most of the pinups (as I don't really want face bases). I'm still undecided as to whether I want the pinups or not, though they are starting to win me over.

Here's what Poots has said about the board in this thread:

kingdomdeath wrote:Right now I have a 2'x3' board illustrated but not painted. The entire thing was unique and was put together the extremely talented artist that handles the majority of the concept art. ( Not the Pinup Stuff ) I plan on having it printed and mounted to a proper foldable game board so that you can use it when its time for a showdown with a monster! I can also so it being used for any popular grid based game as a board, however I will mention that the squares are a little larger then 1". I prefer the extra room and it doesn't feels better from a design standpoint when a model can fit in a square with a little breathing room. Your more "in it" then kinda on it

kingdomdeath wrote:
I thought it made for nicer presentation since when I started the pitch video I didn't have much artwork for the game board yet. At this point and time the line work is done, there is a little shot of 1/6th of it towards the end of the video.

 Breotan wrote:
Gorm is the one model I'm not impressed with. I really dislike how the wrist/ankles are done on that model. It is a serious detraction.

Agreed. The face is great... the body. well... doesn't invoke fear.

The more I think about it, the more I think I'm just going to cap my pledge at $300 no matter what is released.

In which case I'll just pick my favorite of his releases and, if I love it so much that I want to spend more on it than that later, I'll add the others.

So for now that'd be:

Early Survivor $129
Flower Knight $15
Dragon King $30
Manhunter (Free for being at $300)
Total: $174

My priority of add-ons would be:

Face Bases $40
Beyond the Wall $15

However, that'd put me at $229 and with the cost of the add-ons he's putting in here, I don't think that'd be enough to get the rest of the game content expansions, which is what I'm really after.

So, likely I'm still at $174 of my $300 allocated, since the more I look at it (and google painted pics of it) the more I think I'll give the Gorm a pass, and spring for the Lion Knight / spidericules / other game-adding-content when we unlock it.

Here's hoping for some stretches that are easy to add, and thus free... doubling the armor sets is probably being held till closer to the end but that's high on my list. Even better would be added game content that doesn't add cost... like a monster that gets included in Survivor level.

But I'm not holding my breath hence my prioritizing my list and deciding face bases and Beyond The Wall can probably wait till later if I really want them, and Gorm till much later if ever.

@phaeron
The pin ups will apparently all be available to one extent or another in the future, and I don't think there's anywhere close to as substantial a discount on those as there is on the game content.

I love the options to buy the armor packs.

 plastictrees wrote:
@phaeron
The pin ups will apparently all be available to one extent or another in the future, and I don't think there's anywhere close to as substantial a discount on those as there is on the game content.

Thanks for pointing that out. Now that I look at it, I see the pinups aren't really discounted at all. I guess I have plenty of time to wait until Jan 7th to see if there is any more compelling game content to add to my pledge.

You know, the purpose of this Kickstarter isn't to offer a killer discount but to raise money to finance the production of the product line. Some established companies like Reaper and Coolminiornot do use Kickstarter in this way, offering amazing deals primarily to generate interest and sell models. In those cases Kickstarter becomes an elaborate pre-ordering system, where financing is a secondary goal.

This isn't the case with Kingdom Death. The purpose of this Kickstarter is to finance the production of a board game. Adam is asking us to make an investment. In return for that investment we get some nice rewards, and there are further incentives for larger investments. The point isn't to get a bunch of free stuff (as much as we love free stuff), or even a great deal (as much as we love a great deal). The point is to raise enough money to get the game made. Investing in a Kickstarter is an act of patronage, not a purchase or a pre-order (oven if some companies like to treat it that way). There's nothing wrong with wanting a good deal or getting free stuff, but it's important to remember that we're contributing to finance a project we all want to see. The rewards Adam is offering are already quite nice and in many cases well discounted. The more money he spends on free stuff for backers the less money he'll have for producing the game.

I've run a few Kickstarters and I know that there's a point where you're not going to really get many more contributors by adding more free stuff. There's also a point where the contributors you have just can't afford to pay for more extra content. I don't know if Adam has reached either of those points yet, but I think he'd be smarter to focus on add-on purchases over free stuff from now on.

(Not that I wouldn't love more free stuff).

 The Fragile Breath wrote:
I'm rather on the fence about this expansion, everything it comes with is pretty cool, I just don't like the Gorm model itself. Yet, it is another monster to fight. The armor is pretty sweet and the black sword looks awesome, if the rest of the weapons from this expansion look that good, I might end up getting it..

Same here. I like the look of all of the stuff in the box except for the Gorm model itself, which I'm not keen on at all.

I'll probably skip this particular expansion and wait to see what else appears.

 kingdomdeath wrote:
@Grot 6,

Do you mean the 4 starting survivors?

There might be weapons sprues in the future, its too early to tell and depends how the molds are setup during production.

The survivors won't be available until backers have their rewards shipped to them. It would be sorta unfair for me to release them in advanced. I might make an exception for a con ( most likely not ), but only if backers could "pick up" parts of their rewards. Otherwise I take being respectful to backers very seriously!

What figures are there on the website that are in scale and available for the game?

The survivors, in relation to the game is what I'm asking about. Are you going to put additional survivors ( basic, out of the womb ones) up for presale on the KS, such as with the other 15.00 options.

As for "advanced, I would like to purchase some figures, even through other means to start putting work in on for the game.

The game has a whole bunch of ways and things you could do. Those Gorn guys, for example, I was thinking of something like those. Skin masks/ clothing, some scrap weapons, and even in as much as the settlement, I could easily put a 4X 4 table together with this game. Even with the small though of it as a boardgame, I could easily use 5 each a side, give them all a side or portion of the table and play campaign style with.

As for a reward, I was more interested in cobbling together a batch of figures, at what scale am I looking to make them out of? 32MM, 35MM, 1/35 scale? 1/48? 28mm?

They seem to only be toga clad, with either a shard, stick, club, or whatever to start with, and then as the game progresses, they get the armor kits, or portions thereof. ( Is that correct?)
I see an issue in using the survivors, and wanting to either 1, use different weaponry, or use different numbers and types of survivors. Toas are fine, but if I was to just pop up like that, I'd start prying up those stone sections, and making some weapons out of, and adding in stuf like ropes, bags, food stock, and other survival needs in there. I wouldn't be just having a guy with a toga and... nothing else, except as a beginning player.
Reason I asked- Not so much for gimme gimme some free stuff, but I'd actually like to buy some sets of them, if possible.
I would like to get ahold of at least 12 or 20 of those basic guys, and arm them up with different types of stuff in there. some with the basic weapons, some with the stuff they get from wasting those other types of settlements, and the like. One even with a gorn tenticle whip, or in much the same way as with on AVP, where the girl put together weapons out of an Alien skull, and it's tail spike.

I was on the fence about the game, until I saw the gameplay. I'm honestly pretty excited about it, now. Really good looking stuff in there, and a good variety.

Im not sure i understand the above post, It certainly looks like you can make equipment from the stones, check out the sling rule when combined with cloth. Are you wanting to have all possible equipment represented phsyically?

Is there any indication of how long a game/campaign will take?

Jake, agreed, but $300 is a pretty darn generous pledge and I and others have to look out for our own finances just like Kingdom Death does.

So far the best deals are the game itself or Survivor, then the Flower Knight and Dragon King. It makes sense to wait on some of the extras at $15 for a single PVC model without rules.

Not that I don't love this KS- I do. But it's going to be almost impossible to get everything, so especially at this time of year with holiday expenses, I have to set limits.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
A good value example is the armor add-on price. Buying a second game could be a lot better, unless you only want a lot of one armor type.

It is actually because of the holiday season I'm waiting till after the holidays to pledge.. since I believe it ends the first week of January ? As far as how much I am down for the survivor pledge with 1-2 extras but I cannot go past $200. That is usually the cut off point for kickstarters that I limit myself to.

Survivor $155
Flower Knight mini Expansion $15
Dragon King Expansion $30

Is the most cost effective way to pledge $200, imo. IF the Survivor bonuses continue.

Otherwise you could save $55 and get just the game, and put that towards expansions- the choice will be clearer closer to the end, but I think Survivor will win out (hopefully!).

These great KS campaigns keep sucking my wallet dry. And I like it...

RitTides, I agree. That's currently my exact pledge. I like the looks of the Dragon and Flower Knight. Survivor level is an excellent deal on its own, and the bonus items that are included at Survivor level and beyond are very generous.

Jake, I understand that the purpose of Kickstarter is patronage, and I'm happy to participate, but this patronage in a lot of the successful Kickstarters is exactly an "elaborate pre-ordering system" as you put it and this one seems to meet that criteria as well. We're not investors in a real sense, as we don't own a stake in the game or the company. I'm paying to receive a copy of the game and its expansions, nearly a year in advance, based on the promise shown in Mr. Poots' videos and webpage.

I really like the look of the game, and I'm happy to help fund it, but this isn't the same as donating to the local ballet or symphony.

 spears wrote:
Im not sure i understand the above post, It certainly looks like you can make equipment from the stones, check out the sling rule when combined with cloth. Are you wanting to have all possible equipment represented phsyically?

Is there any indication of how long a game/campaign will take?

Adams said a game session will 60-90 minutes ending in a hunt (and I think he's said a campaign could be around 15 sessions, the old memory is a bit fuzzy on that)

The Regeneration Suit is just about in!

So... what's next?

 jake wrote:
You know, the purpose of this Kickstarter isn't to offer a killer discount but to raise money to finance the production of the product line. Some established companies like Reaper and Coolminiornot do use Kickstarter in this way, offering amazing deals primarily to generate interest and sell models. In those cases Kickstarter becomes an elaborate pre-ordering system, where financing is a secondary goal.

This isn't the case with Kingdom Death. The purpose of this Kickstarter is to finance the production of a board game. Adam is asking us to make an investment. In return for that investment we get some nice rewards, and there are further incentives for larger investments. The point isn't to get a bunch of free stuff (as much as we love free stuff), or even a great deal (as much as we love a great deal). The point is to raise enough money to get the game made. Investing in a Kickstarter is an act of patronage, not a purchase or a pre-order (oven if some companies like to treat it that way). There's nothing wrong with wanting a good deal or getting free stuff, but it's important to remember that we're contributing to finance a project we all want to see. The rewards Adam is offering are already quite nice and in many cases well discounted. The more money he spends on free stuff for backers the less money he'll have for producing the game.

I've run a few Kickstarters and I know that there's a point where you're not going to really get many more contributors by adding more free stuff. There's also a point where the contributors you have just can't afford to pay for more extra content. I don't know if Adam has reached either of those points yet, but I think he'd be smarter to focus on add-on purchases over free stuff from now on.

(Not that I wouldn't love more free stuff).

But on the converse the investors need to get what they regard as value for money from the sponsorship; they won't get a share of the profits, so the deal needs to be such that they are willing to part with the money a full year before the product ships. Most of the people paying are doing so as some sort of investment rather than pure sponsorship (we'd love to do that, but we can't all afford to just give companies money). Of course Adam shouldn't be giving away the stuff at cost, and needs to make enough from the project to get the production up and running and pay for the pledge orders.

Reaper suffered a bit from their own success with the free stretch goals; as they had so many pledges the cost to provide the freebies to everyone was far outstripping the stretch values, hence the stretch goals being further and further apart towards the end. I.e. with the pledge count, adding 4 figures meant a production run of 10's of thousands of figures, which became impossible with $25k stretches.

It's definitely a very fine balancing act and Adam seems to be doing pretty well so far

This quote here:

For +$20 you can add the Man Hunter expansion to your rewards, the retail price will be $30 and I am sorry I can't quite hack making it $15 like the flower knight, the math sadly did not add up right... However! I have added a special level that any backer that has pledged $300 can claim:

THE HERALD OF DEATH
As a herald of death, you will get the Man Hunter expansion for free. At this price point you guys have done so much for the project and have been so BADASS, that is is a little something I can do for you. Keep in mind, that international shipping DOES count towards reaching the $300, so its also a little thank you to the international backers whom have been sucking up the hefty shipping fee. Thank you!

seems to imply that he is 'doing the math' and making sure that everything makes sense.

I think this KS offers a good amount of 'value' for what you are pledging, but of course like much else in life, that's all a matter of perspective, I suppose!

Raised the pledge to Herald of Death. Good move making the postage cost applicable to the $300 for international chaps.

I am like a see saw on Gorm right now, I really do not like the model but I love the idea of getting an expansion, as of right now I am keeping 300.00 as my max pledge but I am most likely going to pass on Gorm as well.

I would also love to see 6 starter humans released as it only makes sense seeing as it is a 1 - 6 player game. My gaming group has more than 6 interested so we may be doing 2 campaigns or running it as 2 settlements in the same world.

The decision to only have 4 human starters kind of boggles my mind though.

Don't you get the four starter humans AND the two named humans?

I presume the desision to have 4 rather than 6 starting survivors in the game box is a cost decicion

Adam has said that retail was looking like it had to be $115-120 round about the time he made the last addition to the basic box

If you had an extra 2 survivors that would be higher,

and then folk would be 'if you've got 6 survivors, what if they all get lion armour, we need 6 of those etc'

All the figures are doing is acting as counters like your 'random mini' in an RPG or the dog in monopoly.

Now it's MUCH nicer to have a real representation of your character if you are a wargamer (who cares about WISIWYG),

but many board gamers will probably end up just sticking with the basic easily assembeled figure all the way through.

RPG gamers will be used to figures that don't actually match what they are (we like them to, but it's not essential by any means)

And a slew of extra kits that allow you to assemble a lot of extra humans...