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2012/12/01 15:29:17
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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With all this talk of Draigo, Calgar, the Primarchs and whatnot, there isn't much discussion of the characters who aren't the most epic things ever
Angelos from the Blood Ravens (I haven't read the CS goto novels yet) is a believable character, in DoW
Tsu'Gan from the Nick Kyme novels also is character that while hate-able, is incredibly real and its understandable how he became the way he is and is someone you really want to do the right thing (Like a rival more than a villain)
Also 'Try Again' Bragg
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2012/12/01 16:03:31
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus
Norway
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With the Blood Ravens, they are either a chapter of kleptos, or they call their equipment up after other chapters Primarches without permission (and calling something up after Leman Russ is like them calling toilet-paper Angelos because the BR are basically committing sossery infront of king Uthor in the recent Merlin-series, due to them being very much stocked with Librarians). Neither is a very good solution in my humble opinion. But Angelos to my knowledge doesn't fall into the main trap of a Space Marine-novel. So I will give him that at least.
For that see a John Cena or Hulk Hogan-match or watch a movie regarding Superman and Batman. The recipe is as simple as it is boring. Early to middle, the "hero" is struggling, then comes late. The hero is suddenly curb-stomping everything, and I awakes due to noise.
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If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing. |
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2012/12/01 16:05:13
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
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The protagonist of Path of the Warrior is a whiny teenager who gets thrown into some pretty nasty situations; he's obnoxious, but he's also understandable and relatable at some level.
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2012/12/01 16:18:59
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Hellacious Havoc
Commorragh
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Blood Ravens are the worst kleptos ever (not just equipment)...Why? Because GW likes to confuse fanboys with their origin,so that everyone can claim something and we can all play DOW...
Besides,half of the chapter and chaptermaster (who is librarian) goes c-style, Angelos goes renegade and (with player) saves his chapter ( feth you "I", for once do your job)....
-I'm sorry but this for age 12-15....
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The Wolves go for the throat. We go for the eyes. Then the tongue. Then the hands. Then the feet. Then we skin the crippled remains, and offer it up as an example to any still bearing witness. The wolves were warriors before they became soldiers. We were murderers first, last, and always."
-- First Captain Sevatar, when asked why the Night Lords aren't the Emperor's sanction force against other Legions.
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2012/12/01 16:50:45
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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I'd love to learn more about the Unforgiven chapters instead of more Ultramarines BS.
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My Armies:
5,500pts 
2,700pts 
2,000pts 
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2012/12/02 16:01:45
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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 Harriticus wrote:I'd love to learn more about the Unforgiven chapters instead of more Ultramarines BS.
Do you mean UM only or UM and sucessors? Also Unforgiven have always confused me as to loyalty.
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2012/12/02 16:06:03
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Rough Rider with Boomstick
Guelph Ontario
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Gaunt still hasn't got that planet he's owed.
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Think of something clever to say. |
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2012/12/02 16:13:38
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Perfect Shot Black Templar Predator Pilot
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I hhavent read any fluff books other than wiki pages and codices, but I think that Grimaldus is a character who shows a lot of promise and bad assery that really hasn't been expanded upon in the way that it could be.
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2012/12/02 16:30:50
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Road-Raging Blood Angel Biker
on the MOOOOOONNNNAAAHHHH
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one of the characters who no one ever mentions that i think should get more time is capitain tyco of the blood angels, he is a verry interesting character who unless i am missing something dosnt get alot of time
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Blood Angels  : 3500+ points
Imperial Guard  3000+ points
Mechanicum  4000+ points |
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2012/12/02 16:50:48
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
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 Garvy wrote:Blood Ravens are the worst kleptos ever (not just equipment)...Why? Because GW likes to confuse fanboys with their origin,so that everyone can claim something and we can all play DOW....
The Blood Ravens are a home-brew chapter from Relic. Can't really blame GW for that. Look at the Storm Wardens from Fantasy Flight Games, lol.
Even the game developer guys love to build their own "Special Unique Snowflake Mysterious Origins" Chapter, thinking that mysterious origins makes a Chapter cooler.
I imagine at some point, the Blood Ravens Storm Wardens were written by their developers as the missing II & XI Legions, until GW said they couldn't do that.  I wouldn't blame GW too much for the nuts and bolts of Dawn of War. That's just fanfiction storylines at work.
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2012/12/02 17:28:29
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Rough Rider with Boomstick
Guelph Ontario
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Yeah god forbid they actually move the story forward
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Think of something clever to say. |
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2012/12/02 17:30:37
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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amudkipz wrote: Harriticus wrote:I'd love to learn more about the Unforgiven chapters instead of more Ultramarines BS.
Do you mean UM only or UM and sucessors? Also Unforgiven have always confused me as to loyalty.
I mean Ultramarines mostly. Though their successors don't come off as very interesting either.
As for Unforgiven, yes that ambiguity is what makes them interesting.
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My Armies:
5,500pts
2,700pts
2,000pts
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2012/12/02 17:43:44
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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I know it's more Ultramarines, stuff, but what about Captain Invictus of the 1st Company, or Ancient Helveticus the Chapter Standard bearer (who is believed to be the oldest marine in the Chapter)? They both got written right out of the army books after 2nd edition!
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"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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2012/12/02 22:00:06
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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Invictus died at the Battle for Macragge.
Dunno about Helveticus.
I want to see more about Agemman.
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 warboss wrote:Is there a permanent stickied thread for Chaos players to complain every time someone/anyone gets models or rules besides them? If not, there should be.
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2012/12/03 03:43:31
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Invictus died at the Battle for Macragge.
True. Though to be thorough Dante is dead, too. And without knowing the Grey Knights fluff, Draigo basically can't affect the material world anymore, can he?
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"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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2012/12/03 06:56:43
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Veteran Wolf Guard Squad Leader
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Lukas the Trickster should be grey hunter
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2012/12/03 07:00:53
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Ferocious Black Templar Castellan
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 AegisGrimm wrote:Invictus died at the Battle for Macragge.
True. Though to be thorough Dante is dead, too. And without knowing the Grey Knights fluff, Draigo basically can't affect the material world anymore, can he?
Dante is still very much alive; you're probably thinking of Tycho.
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For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back. |
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2012/12/03 07:59:53
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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No,I would put him straight to the "Lone wolf" status
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ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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2012/12/03 08:02:08
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
New Zealand
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Harriticus wrote:
As for Unforgiven, yes that ambiguity is what makes them interesting.
For real? Their ambiguity is hardly unique.
Dark secret, somehow kept hidden from the Inquisition for 10,000 years? It's predictable, dull, and to be fair quite unlikely as well. Chapters have been excommunicated for less.
Personally I'd rather see something written from the perspective of the Fallen, preferably something that doesn't conclude with yet another guy in stasis somewhere in the Rock.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/03 08:03:26
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2012/12/03 08:17:44
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws
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the fact that Dante, the oldest non-dreadnought space marine doesn't have EW confounds me.
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GW: "We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants" |
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2012/12/03 18:12:57
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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The blood Ravens are interesting to me not because nobody know where they came from definitively ( although most like Thousand Sons loyalists), it's that even the Blood Ravens don't know, and it seems to me that the Blood Ravens don't even care who their Primarch is. I feel they would rather not know who their Primarch is, because to them it is irrelevant. It makes them devout to the Emperor instead of a book like the UM. They serve only the Emperor.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/07 09:17:31
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2012/12/06 08:18:56
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Renegade Inquisitor de Marche
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He couldn't be a Lone Wolf...
I'd make him a Wolf Scout and see where that goes...
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Dakka Bingo! By Ouze
"You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain  " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry. |
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2012/12/06 09:01:59
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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 purplefood wrote:
He couldn't be a Lone Wolf...
I'd make him a Wolf Scout and see where that goes...
Well things would be interesting 4sure; I mean this would happen very often
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ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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2012/12/06 09:14:22
Subject: Charecters who don't get their due?
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Renegade Inquisitor de Marche
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That's one of my favourite parts of his background...
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Dakka Bingo! By Ouze
"You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry. |
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2012/12/07 00:12:39
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Dante is still very much alive; you're probably thinking of Tycho.
Whoops. Tycho was indeed who i was thinking of. Never been a BA player, so even after 15+ years, I get them mixed up!
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"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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2012/12/07 02:37:47
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Been Around the Block
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The Phoenix lords of the Eldar. These guys supposedly have lived/existed for the better part of 10 mill and the only one we know much of anything about is Maugan Ra
Jain made an cameo in a 'recent' book, but what about Asurmen, Barroth, Fuegan, or Karandras? They need some love too! And their origins could use some fleshing out. At the very least it would be nice to get a snap shot of how the Eldar adapted to life during, and right after the fall.
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"It is the fate of all living things to die. It is the destainy of the warrior to choose how.'
'There is no Victory without the risk of Defeat'
'The commissar only sees the faithful, and weak.' -Guardsmen Bob |
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2012/12/07 03:47:03
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Even in Path of the Warrior Karandras makes a cameo, but as a faceless powerful being.
I can totally see the merit of giving them backstories, but at their basis, they are really just mega Exarchs, a combination of all the spirit stones of the Exarchs they have subsumed over the millenia - and even basic Exarchs really have no identity anymore as normal Eldar, being in a permanent "warrior" mental state.
So basically, their beginning would be interesting, but since then they really don;t have any more identity than a Wraithlord/Guard.
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"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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2012/12/07 05:13:32
Subject: Re:Charecters who don't get their due?
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The Conquerer
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
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The Pheonix Lords are odd though, because they are actually just aspect warriors that have donned the armor of the Pheonix Lords.
The best way to describe it would be that they get posessed by the Spirits of all the previous Pheonix Lords that have worn the armor in the past. They have ceased to have their own personalities and have become an amagamation of souls.
The Pheonix Lord is actually the armor itself, not the flesh wearing it.
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Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
MURICA!!! IN SPESS!!! |
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