Which eldar heavy support

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**Bladur**

Im a new eldar player and ive been thinking about wich heavy support i should buy. Im focusing on anti space marines, because my freind that ill play a lot against plays ultramarines. He has many tanks so ive already bought fire dragons and ive been thinking about buying a falcon to mount them and put a bright lance on him to shoot down his terminators and tanks. I would like any tips for wich heavy support i should buy or just a tactica to take his units or tanks down.

**HarryLeChien**

For utility, firepower and relative cheapness it's hard to go wrong with Warwalker squadrons. 2 scatterlazors on each machine in a 3 man squadron gives you 24 S6 shots for 180 pts. Add guide/prescience and they're even more effective.
Lots of people like to run multiple walker squadrons but you can make a case for any of the other choices, even the lowly Dark Reapers - their launchers will crack open PA marines like walnuts. The reason walkers are favoured over the rest is that unlike most of the current codex they're not overpriced for their effectiveness

**Tyranid Horde**

Yeah, war walker squadrons really are the way to go for heavy support choices, one squadron all with scatter laser for 180 pts is a steal. They have outflank so any rhinos are vulnerable with rear AV 10 against str 6 weapons. The number of shots will surely give enough of a chance for terminators to fail their saves at some stage.

I love Dark Reapers. People say they are overpriced for their points but with the amount of str 5 shots they put out from just a small squad can decimate MEQs. An exarch with tempest launcher and crack shot is nice to have aswell. Hide these guys in buidlings at your end of the board and shoot away those marines. You can also try and glance any rhinos to death with sixes leaving his marines in the open for other units to kill off.

I think a falcon is a bit of a waste of a heavy support slot as a wave serpent can do just as good a job as any falcon and they have more capacity and they are dedicated transports. Give the serpent some cheap weapons and an underslung scurican cannon and use that as a good transport for your dragons.

**wuestenfux**

Well, generally, if you play Eldar, you should always max out HS (and Elite).
Three Warwalkers with scatter lasers are a must have.
The other choices depend on the rest of your army: If you play Iyanden, take 2 Wraithlords w/ brightlance and eml, and if you field a (semi-)mech army, pick 2 Fire Prisms w/ underslung shuricannon.
Dark Reapers and the cannons got better in the 6th and are options too.

**Bladur**

I didnt realise how cheap in points they are, there is no doubt im going to buy them,im also gonna buy eldrad so then i can cast guide on them and maybe ill also use fortune to make them harder to kill, but if i would put two scatterlasers on each walker wouldnt it just count as three twinlinked, but with guide it means i can reroll three times.so i would have 12 S6 shots and i would maybe swap one or two for bright lances or missile lunchers for a bit higher cost. But spiritstones are they worth to take for extra 15 points??? If i would equip three walkers, all with one scatterlaser, two with missile lunchers and one with bright lance then it would be 215 points and maybe 15 extra for the spiritstones. With all this equipment arent they getting to expensive?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ill maybe buy a squad of dark reapers a bit later i think its better to buy the warwalkers first and put them together.

**HarryLeChien**

Bladur wrote:
I didnt realise how cheap in points they are, there is no doubt im going to buy them,im also gonna buy eldrad so then i can cast guide on them and maybe ill also use fortune to make them harder to kill, but if i would put two scatterlasers on each walker wouldnt it just count as three twinlinked.

Nope, they're counted as 2 seperate weapons with 4 shots each (so 8 per walker, 24 for a 3 model squadron).

2 weapons the same on a Wraithlord are TL, so this is maybe where you're getting the idea from.

**CrowSplat**

Are the people you play with cool with using forgeworld? If so the 3 warp hunters from IA 11. easily the most cost effective heavy eldar have access to. If not then the above advice is the way to go.

**Bladur**

then a walker squad with 2 scatterlasers each for 180 points is a must take, a lot of firepower on a low cost, im gonna buy them really soon. The people i play with is not cool on using forgeworld for my bad luck :(

thanks for those tips they have been very helpful.

**AegisGrimm**

I personally don't have any Warwalkers, simply because WW with scatter lasers are the usual knee-jerk reaction for Eldar because they are so cost effective, and I always tend to like to be different. I currently have a Wraithlord and a squad of Dark Reapers. I mostly play against marines (who doesn't, really, lol) and Reapers can really lay out the MEQ hurt, especially in smaller games.

I have builds for very small (1K or less) games that include a simple squad of three.

**wuestenfux**

AegisGrimm wrote:
I personally don't have any Warwalkers, simply because WW with scatter lasers are the usual knee-jerk reaction for Eldar because they are so cost effective, and I always tend to like to be different. I currently have a Wraithlord and a squad of Dark Reapers. I mostly play against marines (who doesn't, really, lol) and Reapers can really lay out the MEQ hurt, especially in smaller games.

I have builds for very small (1K or less) games that include a simple squad of three.

You are already different when you play Eldar in the 6th. They got seriously nerfed so that I've decided to shelve them.

**bahzakhain**

WW with scatter lasers are also good against light fliers. Guide them for max effectiveness

**wuestenfux**

bahzakhain wrote:
WW with scatter lasers are also good against light fliers. Guide them for max effectiveness

In fact, scatterlasers are one of the best weapons in the game. Warwalkers with scatterlasers are anti-infantry, anti-light-tank, and anti-light-flyer.

**Bladur**

So im definitely getting those six scatterlasers on war walkers into my army but, i started to think about the eldar fast attack and eldar rangers/pathfinders. Are rangers/pathfinder, and/or the fast attack choises something worth to buy???

**Tyranid Horde**

Getting at least one squad of Pathfinders I think is a must for any Eldar army. I believe they got a pretty big buff with the ability to focus fire on a sergeant now am I right? Always upgrade to pathfinders; they get +2 to their cover saves so just sit them in what would usually be 4+ terrain instead would be a lovely 2+ save. GET THEM!

For fast attack, Swooping Hawks got a small buff with Haywire grenades, but really they will get shot down far too easily to make them worth taking. They are very expensive too, not what I'd get for fast attack. Warp Spiders are sort of a one trick pony. Deep Striking in, hoping to get some rear armour. The downside is you have to be close to utilise their weapons, so if you don't get that tank in the first round of shooting, you are a sitting duck unfortunately. I like them, you could pick up a squad later to try them out. Shining Spears are a waste of points for what they do. Finally, there's Vyper Squadrons. They are cheap enough gun platforms, arming them with scatter lasers and then a shurican cannon, they are nice I think for some extra strength 6 firepower. Maybe think about getting a few vypers later on too?

**AegisGrimm**

You are already different when you play Eldar in the 6th. They got seriously nerfed so that I've decided to shelve them.

Haven't played a game of 6e with them, yet! My buddy and I are still rocking older editions.

**Tyranid Horde**

AegisGrimm wrote:
You are already different when you play Eldar in the 6th. They got seriously nerfed so that I've decided to shelve them.

Haven't played a game of 6e with them, yet! My buddy and I are still rocking older editions.

In 6th, trust me, they are hard work to do well with.

**Trondheim**

I prefer Fireprisms and Wraithlords because I like the models for said things. I seldom worry about the optimal unit for the job since I prefer to bring an army I find pleasing to the eye, but notting really beats WW with scater lasers for sheer effectivness

**MandalorynOranj**

Well, as everyone else has said, the WW are a must. I also run two Fire Prisms because I love their versatility. They can do anti-armor, and anti-infantry (heavy or light). Only thing they can't take on is flyers, but that's what the ADL Quadgun is for. I have been thinking about bringing my Dark Reapers back out since I haven't tried them in 6th yet, but they're just soooo expensive, I don't know what I'd drop for them.

As for FA, Warp Spiders have been really shining for me. I usually deep strike them to hit rear armor, but in a couple games I've had them work really well staying close to my Rangers and jumping out to protect them when baddies came near their objective. They're also very durable for an Eldar with the 3+ save, and if you give the Exarch Hit-and-Run you can get a lot of mileage out of them.

On Rangers vs. Pathfinders, I always find that the 5 pts per guy is better spent elsewhere (I run two squads of 6 Rangers at 2000). A 3+ save in a ruin or behind my ADL is usually plenty, especially since if I'm doing my job right my opponent has more important things to shoot at.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tyranid Horde wrote:
AegisGrimm wrote:
You are already different when you play Eldar in the 6th. They got seriously nerfed so that I've decided to shelve them.

Haven't played a game of 6e with them, yet! My buddy and I are still rocking older editions.

In 6th, trust me, they are hard work to do well with.

They've been doing better for me in 6th than they were in 5th, weird how reactions have been all across the board.

**cox.dan2**

Swooping hawks, Skyleaping in and out and dropping the grenade pack (if that's legal in 6th) can get really annoying for your opponents and cause enough trouble to get in there with something else. Hawks can get very dead very quick if you don't use them right.

**Dunklezahn**

So, harking back to Heavy Support don't underestimate the power of D-Cannons. They are pretty cheap with a shortish range but they will create a bubble of death around them that can put the hurt on any kind of unit that enters. 6th buff for Artillery didn't hurt either and made them much hardier.

In terms of Fast Attack, for several editions now my Warp Spiders have been the stars of the show. Massed S6 shots will shread light infantry, force a lot of saves on even good save troops and have the mobilty to play at sniping out special weapons and the like with their kills which is only helped by the fact their Exarch can take a 4 shot gun...

Pathfinders are great and I generally take them over Rangers to increase my rend potential and survivability. One thing I will say though, don't try to snipe characters, half the time they will look out sir out of it, the precision shot rule really excels for putting a round in the head of special equipment guys who aren't characters but have a significantly higher cost per head. Your opponent will likely hide them centrally in a unit and Pathfinders excel at taking these guys out.

**KitKat**

Dunklezahn wrote:
So, harking back to Heavy Support don't underestimate the power of D-Cannons. They are pretty cheap with a shortish range but they will create a bubble of death around them that can put the hurt on any kind of unit that enters. 6th buff for Artillery didn't hurt either and made them much hardier.

Got to agree, I've used them a few times in conjunction with aegis lines and they've been pretty successful. The barrage ability adds an added fear factor for ICs too, particularly with the instant death on a 6 rule. They also pack a punch against armour as they behave like AP 2 Haywire weapons. So far people have commented that they're very scary and didn't expect to come up against them, I've really enjoyed trying them out.

**Erik_Morkai**

While Eldar are difficult to work with in 6th I am still doing allright with them.

Scored victories against Necrons, Blood Angels, Tyranids and Chaos so far.

I do not have a set list I am still testing the 6th and variations on certain units depending on point level but what I found to be doing well is this.

Farseer or Eldrad
1 squad of Fire Dragons in Wave Serpent

2 squads of Dire Avengers with power weapon/shimmershield, bladestorm and wave serpent.

2 squads of 5 Pathfinder (the 2+ is also a dissuasive effect. Sometimes my opponent will not waste shots on them and leave them alone)

1 squad of 3 jetbikes with shuriken cannon

1 or 2 squads of Warp Spiders (5 to 7 guys as to not have too big of a "footprint").

2 Warp Hunters, sometimes a Night Spinner or I have a variant where I run a squad of Reapers in a Bastion.

There is also a Fuegan list I run with a bunch of Harlies which I built as a joke first aside from the fact they are kicking serious @ss so I might put that list in the "Proven 2000 pts" folder.

**MandalorynOranj**

Harlies are certainly not a joke, especially when they're Fortuned, they'll last forever and usually kick serious tail if they get the charge. I have a squad in every list.

Also, it's not too on topic, but I've found Eldrad to be an incredible guy for challenges. Fortuned, he'll hardly ever fail a save, and he's pretty reliably doing a wound per turn. I've been using him like that to keep big baddies out of my lines when all else fails.

**bobamus87**

Bladur wrote:
I didnt realise how cheap in points they are, there is no doubt im going to buy them,im also gonna buy eldrad so then i can cast guide on them and maybe ill also use fortune to make them harder to kill, but if i would put two scatterlasers on each walker wouldnt it just count as three twinlinked, but with guide it means i can reroll three times.so i would have 12 S6 shots and i would maybe swap one or two for bright lances or missile lunchers for a bit higher cost. But spiritstones are they worth to take for extra 15 points??? If i would equip three walkers, all with one scatterlaser, two with missile lunchers and one with bright lance then it would be 215 points and maybe 15 extra for the spiritstones. With all this equipment arent they getting to expensive?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ill maybe buy a squad of dark reapers a bit later i think its better to buy the warwalkers first and put them together.

Dude, get the Reapers. I played Eldar for years, and they ALWAYS did something useful. Warwalkers are going to get hit with an autocannon/plasmagun/missile

launcher/psi-bolt stormbolter, and die in short order. They are open topped as well if memory serves. Their BASE cost is 35pts, which is the same a dark reaper.

I just think they aren't really that great TBH. Reapers cost the same as a barebones walker, and can be put in a fortification as well. Idk, I just never found them

that great, even guided, and I had 9. Reapers should be an auto-take against marines. And Wraithlords are good too, if you can keep thier pts down, like barley

over 100pts per. only way I can see walkers being feasable is the walk on, so you almost have to get a com link to help reserves, to guarantee they make it in when needed. If standing around for a turn or two their toast.

**Bladur**

Ive been reading all the comments and i think ill take a squad of warpspiders or swooping hawks, and adding a small squad of pathfinders. But wich do you think that will work best warp spiders or swooping hawks? And when ive bought all that stuff i think i am ready to start playing small games. That would be the army list then:

Hq:
eldrad
(and maybe ill buy another farseer or an avatar)

Elite:

Striking scorpions*
Firedragons

Troops:

Dire avengers*
pathfinders
Guardian squad*

Fast attack:
Warp spiders/ swooping hawks

Heavy support:

War walkers
Dark reapers

Thats how it would look and ill maybe add some things like wave serpents and another heavy choose later. If you see something i should chance i would like to hear it, and hearing some tactics that worked for you would also be nice, specially some anti heavy tank like vindicators.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And models marked with * are some i already own

**bobamus87**

Bladur wrote:
Ive been reading all the comments and i think ill take a squad of warpspiders or swooping hawks, and adding a small squad of pathfinders. But wich do you think that will work best warp spiders or swooping hawks? And when ive bought all that stuff i think i am ready to start playing small games. That would be the army list then:

Hq:
eldrad
(and maybe ill buy another farseer or an avatar)

Elite:

Striking scorpions*
Firedragons

Troops:

Dire avengers*
pathfinders
Guardian squad*

Fast attack:
Warp spiders/ swooping hawks

Heavy support:

War walkers
Dark reapers

Thats how it would look and ill maybe add some things like wave serpents and another heavy choose later. If you see something i should chance i would like to hear it, and hearing some tactics that worked for you would also be nice, specially
some anti heavy tank like vindicators.

Anti tank with Eldar is tough, our lances are WAY over priced on vehicles, and Firedragons are good, but getting them there is the problem.

I'd suggest getting at least 2-3 serpents, I know they are also pricey in the dex (what isn't in that codex?) but you need to have some mobility,

A cheaper(notice I didn't say cheap?) lance alternative is guardians with a platform, look into whether or not the warlock can fire it. But guide

them, and they should have a decent chance of taking out/weapon destroying a Vindicator. The old deepstriking autarch with meltagun is good,

but could give first blood if he fails to destroy a Vindicator. Platforms are your best friend, just make sure to include a warlock with embolden,

so your men don't run away if they survive being shot. Mobility with Eldar is really their last real answer to things, the dex is overpriced, and certain

entries really aren't showing their age too well. Ally with Dark eldar, but use eldar models would be cool, so you can have a ravager, and a trueborn

squad with some dark lances. DE would actually be a great choice for you, IMO, because they are battle brothers, and can fill in some of the gaps eldar

are lacking. DE also ignore nigthfighting too.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And models marked with * are some i already own

Automatically Appended Next Post:
*Oops, didnt mean to include that in the quote*
Thats how it would look and ill maybe add some things like wave serpents and another heavy choose later. If you see something i should chance i would like to hear it, and hearing some tactics that worked for you would also be nice, specially
some anti heavy tank like vindicators.

Anti tank with Eldar is tough, our lances are WAY over priced on vehicles, and Firedragons are good, but getting them there is the problem.

I'd suggest getting at least 2-3 serpents, I know they are also pricey in the dex (what isn't in that codex?) but you need to have some mobility,

A cheaper(notice I didn't say cheap?) lance alternative is guardians with a platform, look into whether or not the warlock can fire it. But guide

them, and they should have a decent chance of taking out/weapon destroying a Vindicator. The old deepstriking autarch with meltagun is good,

but could give first blood if he fails to destroy a Vindicator. Platforms are your best friend, just make sure to include a warlock with embolden,

so your men don't run away if they survive being shot. Mobility with Eldar is really their last real answer to things, the dex is overpriced, and certain

entries really aren't showing their age too well. Ally with Dark eldar, but use eldar models would be cool, so you can have a ravager, and a trueborn

squad with some dark lances. DE would actually be a great choice for you, IMO, because they are battle brothers, and can fill in some of the gaps eldar

are lacking. DE also ignore nigthfighting too.

**MandalorynOranj**

Definitely go with Spiders over Hawks. They have better damage output and survivability. And anti-tank is somewhat less of a problem this edition than in 5th, so at smaller-point games I think you should be ok for now. The Fire Dragons can deal with any AV 13+, which you usually don't see more than one of in an army, and the WW, Spiders, and Reapers can handle lighter vehicles and transports. Also, Walkers are NOT open topped, regardless of what anyone tells you. The models are, but they do not have that rule.

I also can't endorse the ADL enough. With the quadgun, it's only 100 points, and that gets you awesome anti-flyer support, as well as a cover save for every static shooty element in your list. I know you have the Scorpions now, so I'll say this as something for the future: think about Harlequins. They're more expensive, but better for their points. I used to have a lot of fun with Scorpions assaulting out of Outflank, but that's not allowed anymore unfortunately.

**Tyranid Horde**

Bladur wrote:
Ive been reading all the comments and i think ill take a squad of warpspiders or swooping hawks, and adding a small squad of pathfinders. But wich do you think that will work best warp spiders or swooping hawks? And when ive bought all that stuff i think i am ready to start playing small games. That would be the army list then:

Hq:
eldrad
(and maybe ill buy another farseer or an avatar)

Elite:

Striking scorpions*
Firedragons

Troops:

Dire avengers*
pathfinders
Guardian squad*

Fast attack:
Warp spiders/ swooping hawks

Heavy support:

War walkers
Dark reapers

Thats how it would look and ill maybe add some things like wave serpents and another heavy choose later. If you see something i should chance i would like to hear it, and hearing some tactics that worked for you would also be nice, specially some anti heavy tank like vindicators.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And models marked with * are some i already own

I think with the addition of a few Wave Serpents this list is pretty good. Definitely go for Warp Spiders over Swooping Hawks.

I used a small squad of guardian jetbikes for the first time recently and they are really, really good. Even a bare bones squad of three can be great to get the win if its an objectives game you are playing. Keep them in reserve and turbo boost them in the shooting phase (they get a 4+ jink save), then use the 2D6 assault move to reach any far flung objectives or contest some close ones. Consider getting a good few of those.

For anti-heavy tank, well you've got your dragons if you mount them in a wave serpent, but get a Fire Prism. They are a fairly reliable means to pop tanks of all shapes and sizes. A strength 9 AP2 small blast isn't anything to be scoffed at.

**Bladur**

Bladur wrote:
Ive been reading all the comments and i think ill take a squad of warpspiders or swooping hawks, and adding a small squad of pathfinders. But wich do you think that will work best warp spiders or swooping hawks? And when ive bought all that stuff i think i am ready to start playing small games. That would be the army list then:

Hq:
eldrad
(and maybe ill buy another farseer or an avatar)

Elite:
Striking scorpions*
Firedragons

Transport:
2 wave serpents

Troops:
Dire avengers*
pathfinders
Guardian squad*

Fast attack:
Warp spiders/ swooping hawks

Heavy support:
3 War walkers
Dark reapers

Thats how it would look and ill maybe add some things like wave serpents and another heavy choose later. If you see something i should chance i would like to hear it, and hearing some tactics that worked for you would also be nice, specially some anti heavy tank like vindicators.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And models marked with * are some i already own

Automatically Appended Next Post:
The thing i fear most about the vindicator is his guns ability to ignore coversaves so he will just kill my pathfinders in one shot, thats one of the main reasons i need anti heavy. Getting a fire prism to take him down sounds great. Because it also fills up the third heavy support space. And getting 3 jetbikes also sound nice to get objectives. For hq ive also been thinking about adding an avatar or an farseer with eldrad but wich one should i take???

**Tyranid Horde**

If you outflank your War Walkers near the vindi, they could easily get rid of it in one round of shooting, the only strong part of the vindi is the gun and the front armour. That's the joys of having war walkers. But I still would get the Fire Prism as a fall back option.