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So, I am currently playing in a modified planetary empires campaign with some guys at the local store. Unfortunately, I have gotten to a bit of a rock and a hard place. Although early in the campaign, my Tau buddy is out for Necron blood, and thus is using several bonuses to stick it to me. Thus, in the zone in front of my HQ, I have 1300pts defending against 1800pts of attacking Tau. If I lose this then I will have another uphill battle to defend my HQ with or otherwise get knocked out :(. Thus I could use some ideas of how to win a game at a large disadvantage.

So, I'm thinking something like D lord, two full units of wraiths, 20 gauss immortals, and plus some other stuff. I believe we will just roll for one of the standard book scenarios. I had one previous game at a disadvantage last week, and took two flyers which helped, but just couldn't quite kill enough to make it worth it. He also has 3 broadsides so if I take any vehicles they will most likely give up first blood pretty quick. He also had in that game a crap ton of fire warriors, some kroot, a few battle suits, 1 unit of stealth suits, and the 3 broadsides. Any other shenanigans I should try? Mass scarabs? Flayed ones?

Thanks for the help

At a 500 point disadvantage you're screwed. Bring your most powerful list and hope he brings a weak or "fluffy" list and/or makes huge mistakes in the game. Do not expect to win.

Versus Tau. a 500 point difference isn't 'that' much, Tau are one of the most overcosted books there is.i would say if it was a current codex, it would be around a 1300 v 1500 points match. which is hardly unbeatable.
You also need to start with the mindset that you can win, and try to work out what you can do to achieve that. The most obvious thing to do is to take an ADL since it provides an awesome cover save. i would also probably take at least 1 solar pulse. i know tau have black sun filters, but his kroot don't have access, and i rarely see firewarriors with them, so you can limit incoming fire somewhat with them. you will need boots on the ground, and units to take the fight to him, while wraiths are awesome, pretty much anything in the necron codex will have an advantage versus tau.
My own favourite tactic (which is suprisingly effective) is to use veils to teleport units of immortals round the board and defeat the enemy in detail one unit at a time.
Obviously i'm not you, or your opponent, so you will have a much clearer idea of what to expect, but be assured, you can win, just play smart

Thanks Mad, some good points there.

I was going to avoid the pulse, since I need to get a overlord (kinda expensive for what he does) and usually the Tau guy takes black sun on every tau unit. I don't have a ADL (its in the mail).

I'm thinking of going with 3 N scythes or 3 A barges along with the 2 wraith units with D lord.

Flyers.

Anything you have on the ground on Turn 1 try to take out the AA/Railguns. Then zap him with Doom Scythes/Teslas.

Hope for the KP mission and enjoy the fact you have 500pts less of KP for him to kill?

He's really good at killing vehicles, so you're right not to give him any to kill. I'd suggest the fastest list you can possibly get backed up by hearty troop units. D-Lords and Wraiths and bricks of warriors. D-Lords and Wraiths speed up the field and hug cover to try to remain out of LOS, the warrior bricks deploy forward in your deployment zone and hopefully in cover, providing supporting fire. Your fliers are beast, so i'd suggest taking some of those as well.

In fact, since you're at such a severe point disadvantage you might just minimize troops and maximize Scythes and Wraiths. Go full cheese on his ass!

Just curious and it may seem a bit radical, but how this: Explain your situation.

First of all: The battle is incredibly one sided. Your opponent will most likely win it with ease. Explain that for you and for him it will not be any fun. Ask him if he ever got tabled and then ask him how he felt about it. (If that doesn't work, ask him how he would feel if you agreed to play a game and then you brought 500 more points, would it still be fair?) Then explain that it's exactly what will happen to you.
You could mention that warhammer 40k is just a fun game and not some sort of show-off, where you can beat someone into oblivion. (You take the time and effort to bring everything to the table, set it up and roll the dice, only to waste an entire evening.)

Afterwards, offer some sort of compensation for him, but not at a huge advantage. (Such as have him decide nightfighting and give him the first turn without you stealing the iniative. You may also attempt something else as long as both sides feel that it is fair.)

I assume your opponent is a normal human being and will understand that games like this are not fun for one side. If he isn't, just ask the TO about it and explain the problem to him. Say that you don't like tournaments/campaigns like this and look what he has to say about it. Mention that you don't like it to play games like this. Most TOs take such things very seriously.

As a last ditch attempt: Do you have to play the game? You play Warhammer 40k because you like it, right? No one forces you to play a game. If you don't feel like playing, if you don't feel like getting curbstomped, then don't go. This game is supposed to be enjoyable for both sides.

Either way, hope this helps. Sorry if i's not Necron related.
Have fun,
Loner

Me being a tau player, find a way to shut down his mobility.

200 points isn't that big of a disadvantage. Try playing FOW vs german heavy tanks with allied heavy AT guns.
(Shudders in the corner about overcosted tau/british units and whimpers for a new codex/armylist book)

loner wrote:
Just curious and it may seem a bit radical, but how this: Explain your situation.

First of all: The battle is incredibly one sided. Your opponent will most likely win it with ease. Explain that for you and for him it will not be any fun. Ask him if he ever got tabled and then ask him how he felt about it. (If that doesn't work, ask him how he would feel if you agreed to play a game and then you brought 500 more points, would it still be fair?) Then explain that it's exactly what will happen to you.
You could mention that warhammer 40k is just a fun game and not some sort of show-off, where you can beat someone into oblivion. (You take the time and effort to bring everything to the table, set it up and roll the dice, only to waste an entire evening.)

Afterwards, offer some sort of compensation for him, but not at a huge advantage. (Such as have him decide nightfighting and give him the first turn without you stealing the iniative. You may also attempt something else as long as both sides feel that it is fair.)

I assume your opponent is a normal human being and will understand that games like this are not fun for one side. If he isn't, just ask the TO about it and explain the problem to him. Say that you don't like tournaments/campaigns like this and look what he has to say about it. Mention that you don't like it to play games like this. Most TOs take such things very seriously.

As a last ditch attempt: Do you have to play the game? You play Warhammer 40k because you like it, right? No one forces you to play a game. If you don't feel like playing, if you don't feel like getting curbstomped, then don't go. This game is supposed to be enjoyable for both sides.

Either way, hope this helps. Sorry if i's not Necron related.
Have fun,
Loner

He could also let you take defenses, like turrets and fortresses to make it more fair. After all, if you are defending then why not give the defenders emplacements? It should be fun for both sides, not a curb stomp battle. This isn't a tournament after all and a siege scenario could be fun for the both of you.

D-lords and Wraiths. Get into melee with him. A D-lord and a unit of Wraiths will rip any suit unit to shreds.

If he didn't have the forsight to take Blacksun filters, Nightfighting could seriously screw him. Giving you enough time to make it into melee.

Take a Doomscythe and use the Deathray to take out his suits.

If he is near your same skill level then you shouldn't able able to beat him when he has a 50% point advantage. Play for a tie. Go 2nd in an objective base list with lots of night scythes. Don't get greedy and unload everything on turn 5, just enough to tie then just enough to tie on the next turn. If he lands any hits before then jink.

I think it will be a fun match, or at least challenging. The last game we played I was down on points and nearly tabled him, but with his last 4 models (3 kroot and a firewarrior) he contested my obj and held his and game ended on T5. He has been struggling with his army in the past, since he isn't up on all the rules so I tend to win the majority of the battles we play. So I think he's eager for some payback

I also made a couple minor errors in deploying the planetary empires board so he's had more points to throw at me, plus he is holding the 300pts bonus zone. I do need to play him because whatever points I can take out he will lose for next week's attack and the loser has all points wiped out (kinda like RISK). Thus if I lose by a lot he will have a huge advantage against my HQ. I usually don't go cheesy but I think it this case its warrented

I'm thinking:
D Lord + weave == 140
2x6 wraiths == 420
10 guass immortals == 170
9 tesla immoratals == 153
9 warriors == 117
3 N. scythes == 300

total: 1300

TheCustomLime wrote:
It should be fun for both sides, not a curb stomp battle. This isn't a tournament after all and a siege scenario could be fun for the both of you.

Or you could just play by the rules of the game instead of asking for pity points to make it more "fair". The whole point of a campaign like this is that people win and lose and it has a long-term impact on your future games, with players eventually losing too much, suffering crippling drawbacks, and being eliminated from the game in a final one-sided "last stand" with only a small chance of surviving and clinging to their last map tile. Playing a balanced game instead defeats the entire purpose of having a campaign in the first place.

 Peregrine wrote:

TheCustomLime wrote:
It should be fun for both sides, not a curb stomp battle. This isn't a tournament after all and a siege scenario could be fun for the both of you.

Or you could just play by the rules of the game instead of asking for pity points to make it more "fair". The whole point of a campaign like this is that people win and lose and it has a long-term impact on your future games, with players eventually losing too much, suffering crippling drawbacks, and being eliminated from the game in a final one-sided "last stand" with only a small chance of surviving and clinging to their last map tile. Playing a balanced game instead defeats the entire purpose of having a campaign in the first place.

Well, yeah, you could of course do that but I thought the idea was to give ideas to give him somewhat of a chance. Otherwise his only chance is to build his list with maximum power and hope the dice gods favor him.

TheCustomLime wrote:
Well, yeah, you could of course do that but I thought the idea was to give ideas to give him somewhat of a chance. Otherwise his only chance is to build his list with maximum power and hope the dice gods favor him.

The idea is to give strategy ideas that give him a chance. "Ask your opponent to make it easier for you" isn't a strategy.

 Peregrine wrote:

TheCustomLime wrote:
Well, yeah, you could of course do that but I thought the idea was to give ideas to give him somewhat of a chance. Otherwise his only chance is to build his list with maximum power and hope the dice gods favor him.

The idea is to give strategy ideas that give him a chance. "Ask your opponent to make it easier for you" isn't a strategy.

Sure it is! Just not a very good one.

In all seriousness, I understand that and I was just throwing out ideas I thought would be kinda cool to do. If tactical advice is what's called for then my advice to the OP is to get the most out of the 1300 Pts he can and cross his fingers. That's pretty much all he can do.

I am assuming a draw goes to the defender in this case - so what you really need to do is just survive. Since he wants nothing to do with your Wraiths (or scarabs for that matter) I would build a denial focused list.

The start is 4x Solar Pulse Crypteks - this lets you hide in 2+ cover from his long range units. I think this requires a normal lord - so I would grab Trazyn (I think he is the scoring one) so you can sit him on an objective out of los late game.

the rest fill withnight scythe warrors to come in late and rapid fire. Immortals w/ gauss are also great against tau. Dont be afraid to assault if you get the chance wit your troops.

Relying on Night Fight isn't the best idea against Tau - ever heard of Blacksun Filters?

Yeah, if he's got an extra 500 points and knows he's going up against an army that can force night fighting, than you can bet he's going to be using those points to bring blacksun filters on everything.
And nightfight isn't that much a problem for Kroot, as their guns are crappy bolters. Basically if they are shooting above 12" they are just taking potshots anyway, so the Tau player isn't going to expect much.