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I have a quandry: I'm running Huron aka Mr. Infiltrate in my list, and I need a unit to go with him. I can do Terminators, Chosen, or Mutilators. If I do chosen, I can infiltrate them in a Rhino to get into CC faster. If I do Terminators or Mutilators, I have to rely on walking to get into CC. I face mostly Crisis-heavy Tau and Dark Angels, if that helps. I'm leaning towards 6 Chosen, 5 power weapons, MoS and IoE preferably in a Rhino. Thoughts? Suggestions?

 McNinja wrote:
I have a quandry: I'm running Huron aka Mr. Infiltrate in my list, and I need a unit to go with him. I can do Terminators, Chosen, or Mutilators. If I do chosen, I can infiltrate them in a Rhino to get into CC faster. If I do Terminators or Mutilators, I have to rely on walking to get into CC. I face mostly Crisis-heavy Tau and Dark Angels, if that helps. I'm leaning towards 6 Chosen, 5 power weapons, MoS and IoE preferably in a Rhino. Thoughts? Suggestions?

Wait what?
Why would you have to walk to get into Close Combat?

Also I'd really recommend not doing Chosen with Power weapons in a Rhino. Not only is it a flimsy AV 11 vehicle with some high profile cargo, Chosen with Power Weapons inexplicably cost more than Chaos Terminators.

Your suggested proposal for the Chosen is 265 points.

I personally suggest this instead:
Chaos Terminators-95
3x Additional Terminators
Mark of Slaanesh
Icon of Ecstasy

Believe it or not, this comes out to 252 points. Then, what you can do is take 3 combi plasmas/meltas for a further 15 points, coming out to 267, aka 2 more points than yours and significantly more powerful. (I'd recommend meltas since they ID crisis suits and ignore FNP for Dark Angels, but plasmas are always fun as well)

close combat chosen are terrible. In fact chosen arent particularly good. When taken as troops their special weapon spam(plasma or melta) can be effective but otherwise they are just kind of ok unit.

If you want to take them take 5 plasma and MoN in a rhino. Naked champ as the wound catcher.

Terminators can be ok if you are infiltrating them. A rather large but cheap squad can be both effective and scary. Nothing would scare a gunline more than 10 terminators 12-18" from their lines. Try to get them for under 400 points though.

Also note that terminators can take a land raider as a decidated transport which means it can infiltrate. Even if it sucks a ton of firepower and wrecks first turn you can use the hulk to screen a large part of your army.

Mutilators, leave them on your shelf until 7th edition.

 Exergy wrote:
In fact chosen arent particularly good.

Snuh? Chosen are the most efficient unit in the army at firepower concentration.

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
Also I'd really recommend not doing Chosen with Power weapons in a Rhino. Not only is it a flimsy AV 11 vehicle with some high profile cargo, Chosen with Power Weapons inexplicably cost more than Chaos Terminators.

The biggest issue with the rhino rush for assault is that you cannot exit the vehicle and assault in the same turn. Even if you rush up 18" after infiltrating, your earliest assault opportunity is turn 3. That is not a recipe for success.

If your going to be assaulting in the CSM book, you need to be assaulting out of a LR. Its AV 14, so its not going to be punked by some ML. You can assault out of it, and you have an effective 17" threat range where you can realistically expect to get that assault off.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Exergy wrote:
In fact chosen arent particularly good.

Snuh? Chosen are the most efficient unit in the army at firepower concentration.

Havocs are cheaper. You only get 4 special weapons but they come in a lot cheaper.

If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

Infiltrating Land Raider with Terminator Squad... Hohoho. I think I just found my latest toy to try out...

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

Me, I take the chosen : 10 chosen, 4 with flamer, 6 ccw and mark of khorn.

 Exergy wrote:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

definatly they would make an excellent bodyguard for a lord

I've never seen a list on here where someone has taken mutilators. Posessed either for that matter.

hellpato wrote:
Me, I take the chosen : 10 chosen, 4 with flamer, 6 ccw and mark of khorn.

you dont need to give them CCWs they come with them stock. You could also push up to 5 flamers. Why not?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

definatly they would make an excellent bodyguard for a lord

No Champion means you can too easily single out the lord in a challenge.

I've never seen a list on here where someone has taken mutilators. Posessed either for that matter.

Really. I use them in my list ...

HQ: Typhus *** {warlord personal}

Elite: 5 Chaos Terminators, 2 Combi-Plasma, 1 Combi-Flamer, Chainfist, Reaper Autocannon, Champion, MoN 239
Elite: 2 x Helbrutes with Multi-Melta 200

Troops: 4 x 25 Zombies 440

Fast Attack: 2 x Heldrakes with Flamer 340
Fast Attack: Chaos Spawn

Heavy Support: 2 x Maulerfiends with Lasher Tendrils 270
Heavy Support: 5 Chaos Havocs with 4 Autocannons, MoN 130

The spawn escort the mutilators - or vice versa ... Mutilators can be effective in the correct list. In the OPs list I think terminators fit the bill best.

 felixcat wrote:

I've never seen a list on here where someone has taken mutilators. Posessed either for that matter.

Really. I use them in my list ...

HQ: Typhus *** {warlord personal}

Elite: 5 Chaos Terminators, 2 Combi-Plasma, 1 Combi-Flamer, Chainfist, Reaper Autocannon, Champion, MoN 239
Elite: 2 x Helbrutes with Multi-Melta 200

Troops: 4 x 25 Zombies 440

Fast Attack: 2 x Heldrakes with Flamer 340
Fast Attack: Chaos Spawn

Heavy Support: 2 x Maulerfiends with Lasher Tendrils 270
Heavy Support: 5 Chaos Havocs with 4 Autocannons, MoN 130

The spawn escort the mutilators - or vice versa ... Mutilators can be effective in the correct list. In the OPs list I think terminators fit the bill best.

I see neither Possessed nor Mutilators here

^thats what I was thinking when I just read that.

I've been meaning to buy typhus. I really want to try out zombies

 felixcat wrote:

I've never seen a list on here where someone has taken mutilators. Posessed either for that matter.

Really. I use them in my list ...

HQ: Typhus *** {warlord personal}

Elite: 5 Chaos Terminators, 2 Combi-Plasma, 1 Combi-Flamer, Chainfist, Reaper Autocannon, Champion, MoN 239
Elite: 2 x Helbrutes with Multi-Melta 200

Troops: 4 x 25 Zombies 440

Fast Attack: 2 x Heldrakes with Flamer 340
Fast Attack: Chaos Spawn

Heavy Support: 2 x Maulerfiends with Lasher Tendrils 270
Heavy Support: 5 Chaos Havocs with 4 Autocannons, MoN 130

The spawn escort the mutilators - or vice versa ... Mutilators can be effective in the correct list. In the OPs list I think terminators fit the bill best.

Uhmmm, there are no mutilators on that list...

See what happens when you get no s;leep. I read maulerfiends for some strange reason. Go figure. So I agree ... don't like possessed or mutilators ...

 felixcat wrote:
See what happens when you get no s;leep. I read maulerfiends for some strange reason. Go figure. So I agree ... don't like possessed or mutilators ...

i see. I couldnt understand why mutialtors would be escorting spawn. They cant move at the same speed.

 felixcat wrote:
See what happens when you get no s;leep. I read maulerfiends for some strange reason. Go figure. So I agree ... don't like possessed or mutilators ...

I've seen plenty of lists with maulerfiends. lol. We've all been there and misread something. hahaha

I thought transports carrying infiltrated squads defaulted to outflanking rule. Unless you can somehow deploy the squad disembarked 12-18" away from the enemy.

 Exergy wrote:

 felixcat wrote:
See what happens when you get no s;leep. I read maulerfiends for some strange reason. Go figure. So I agree ... don't like possessed or mutilators ...

i see. I couldnt understand why mutialtors would be escorting spawn. They cant move at the same speed.

Are the Spawn models big enough that you can reliably get 25% concealment off of the Maulerfiend?

 Enigwolf wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

 felixcat wrote:
See what happens when you get no s;leep. I read maulerfiends for some strange reason. Go figure. So I agree ... don't like possessed or mutilators ...

i see. I couldnt understand why mutialtors would be escorting spawn. They cant move at the same speed.

Are the Spawn models big enough that you can reliably get 25% concealment off of the Maulerfiend?

mutilators and maulerfiends are different things

neither need 25% cover as they both have a 5++ invunerable stock

Well, Termies and Multilators have the option to deepstrike, and this is the best way to bring them into the battle. Outflanking is a gamble when they arrive at the wrong side.

One problem with mutilators is that they have no ranged weapon. So you bring them in either from reserve, deepstrike or outflank, and they just sit there for a turn before they can attempt to charge. Putting an HQ makes them worse, because it just makes the target juicier. Now you have a unit that at most can fire with one weapon and overwatch with one model. Unless the gods of deployment are aligned in your favor, your opponent is going to tarpit them and run anything you want to hit away.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, Termies and Multilators have the option to deepstrike, and this is the best way to bring them into the battle. Outflanking is a gamble when they arrive at the wrong side.

And then they will die very fast when they sit there in deepstrike formation waiting for the next turn to do something...

 Enigwolf wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, Termies and Multilators have the option to deepstrike, and this is the best way to bring them into the battle. Outflanking is a gamble when they arrive at the wrong side.

And then they will die very fast when they sit there in deepstrike formation waiting for the next turn to do something...

MoN doesnt help against plasma cannons one bit.

 Exergy wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Me, I take the chosen : 10 chosen, 4 with flamer, 6 ccw and mark of khorn.

you dont need to give them CCWs they come with them stock. You could also push up to 5 flamers. Why not?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

definatly they would make an excellent bodyguard for a lord

No Champion means you can too easily single out the lord in a challenge.

Because at first, I did my chosen with 5 plasma gun and they became the main target. I switch the plasma with the flamers (i had only 4 made for my CSM) and I didnt tought to use one more. But is fun to see that nobody care of chosen armed with flamers until you charged. In best case, 30 hit and 5 flamers attacks.

hellpato wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Me, I take the chosen : 10 chosen, 4 with flamer, 6 ccw and mark of khorn.

you dont need to give them CCWs they come with them stock. You could also push up to 5 flamers. Why not?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

definatly they would make an excellent bodyguard for a lord

No Champion means you can too easily single out the lord in a challenge.

Because at first, I did my chosen with 5 plasma gun and they became the main target. I switch the plasma with the flamers (i had only 4 made for my CSM) and I didnt tought to use one more. But is fun to see that nobody care of chosen armed with flamers until you charged. In best case, 30 hit and 5 flamers attacks.

30 attacks? Taking 3 attacks each (2 base + 1 for 2 pistol/CCW = 3) means that you're fielding 10-men Chosen squads? That's a waste of points, IMHO. Anything above 5 Chosen all toting special weapons is a waste of points - you're better off getting terminators instead.

 Enigwolf wrote:

hellpato wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Me, I take the chosen : 10 chosen, 4 with flamer, 6 ccw and mark of khorn.

you dont need to give them CCWs they come with them stock. You could also push up to 5 flamers. Why not?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

Crimson-King2120 wrote:
If they FAQ mutilators to have 5 men squads id take them in a heartbeat i would say termies MoS IoE 7 2+ 5++ FNP models infiltrating within charge range would scare the gak out of just about everyone

First they would have to Errata Mutilators to 5, not FAQ.

But really, 5 of them would make you consider it. They are LD8 with no way to get fearless other than attaching a very expensive character.

definatly they would make an excellent bodyguard for a lord

No Champion means you can too easily single out the lord in a challenge.

Because at first, I did my chosen with 5 plasma gun and they became the main target. I switch the plasma with the flamers (i had only 4 made for my CSM) and I didnt tought to use one more. But is fun to see that nobody care of chosen armed with flamers until you charged. In best case, 30 hit and 5 flamers attacks.

30 attacks? Taking 3 attacks each (2 base + 1 for 2 pistol/CCW = 3) means that you're fielding 10-men Chosen squads? That's a waste of points, IMHO. Anything above 5 Chosen all toting special weapons is a waste of points - you're better off getting terminators instead.

first in order to get 5 special weapons, you have to have 6 models as the champion cannot take a special weapon.

Also at 18 points a model, they have the same attacks as a 19 point Khorne Bezerker on the charge and more in subsequent rounds of combat. The also keep their bolters and can carry special weapons At 20 points they can pack MoK for death company like attacks(5 on the charge)

like the elite cult troops, they are only good if taken with coresponding HQ making them troops but they arent terrible.