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Beaviz81 wrote: Of course, even a demi-god can be worn down and tire from slashing apart Supermen. And small injuries even with accelerated healing will eventually be too much.
Also BL is very contradicting with this - In one book you have primarch with the god-like power...In the next he is a sissy...That is why we have many vs threads...
I mean primarchs wore PA, so their skin isn't super resistant to some kind of fire IMHO....
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 19:42:07
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
DarthMarko wrote: Also BL is very contradicting with this - In one book you have primarch with the god-like power...In the next he is a sissy...That is why we have many vs threads...
I mean primarchs wore PA, so their skin isn't super resistant to some kind of fire IMHO....
Frankly I have to question the context of the sniper incident concerning Fulgrim.
Considering Graham McNeill, who wrote Angel Exterminatus, stated in the narrative that a punch that would have destroyed Tactical Dreadnought Armour could only slightly bruise the skin of a Primarch.
Would you like a bunch of nudists in the pictures of the Primarches and Empy instead Void? Empy and Horus picture would look less bad ass if both were in the flesh with a nude Sanguinius laying at the feet of Horus.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 20:10:30
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
DarthMarko wrote: Also BL is very contradicting with this - In one book you have primarch with the god-like power...In the next he is a sissy...That is why we have many vs threads...
I mean primarchs wore PA, so their skin isn't super resistant to some kind of fire IMHO....
Frankly I have to question the context of the sniper incident concerning Fulgrim.
Considering Graham McNeill, who wrote Angel Exterminatus, stated in the narrative that a punch that would have destroyed Tactical Dreadnought Armour could only slightly bruise the skin of a Primarch.
Spoiler:
Sharrowkyn sighted on his target’s skull, slowing his heart rate and letting his breathing even out as he applied the tiniest pressure to the trigger. Ready icons winked to life on his helm, a dotted line tracing the route his needle would take.
Right through a primarch’s eye.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
While the Angel Exterminatus sleeps, we will storm Asuryan’s gaol and take for ourselves the weapons forged in ancient times!’ roared Fulgrim.
Perturabo saw the tiny puff of blood appear on Fulgrim’s skull a second before he heard the crack of the shot. Fulgrim’s black eyes rolled back into his skull.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
‘Brother,’ said Fulgrim, coming forwards to embrace him again. ‘A miracle.’
Perturabo shook his head and said, ‘You live.’
Fulgrim lifted his hand to show Perturabo a long sliver of bloodstained steel, finely tapered and bent around its middle where its tip had flattened.
‘Barely,’ said Fulgrim. ‘Fabius had a devil’s job fishing that out. The angle of impact was just obtuse enough for it to deflect rather than penetrate. It travelled over the crown of my head and lodged on the opposite side.’
Fulgrim swept his bone-white hair back to show the raw incision Fabius had made in his opposite temple in order to remove the needle. A vivid purple line traced the route the projectile had taken, an arcing path of graceful curves and whorls that linked the two wounds and which had a pleasing symmetry to it.
‘Just as well you have a thick skull,’ said Perturabo.
Fulgrim laughed and said, ‘You have the truth of it, brother.’
So if weapon hit him in the eye - bye,bye Fulgrim
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 20:18:02
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
‘Fabius,’ said Fulgrim. ‘I can feel it in my head.’
Fabius addressed Perturabo. ‘What manner of weapon did this?’
‘I don’t know, but the entry wound is too small for a bolt-round. There’s too much impact trauma for a las-weapon, so my guess is some kind of solid-slug rifle.’
Also Fulgrim was knock out from the head shot...Which means that a squad of astartes bolting up a primarch head can indeed stun him...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 20:22:48
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
No, he rolled his eyes when he fell and the angle of the shot was curved if I understand it well - so RG missed the eye....
Spoiler:
The angle of impact was just obtuse enough for it to deflect rather than penetrate. It travelled over the crown of my head and lodged on the opposite side
I mean if I did undestand it, he hit him in the temple...
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/01/06 20:28:03
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
Superhuman strength, and the skull is the hardest place of the human body. Simple anatomy will learn you that it's the best place for being hit with a gun, not recommended though.
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
Beaviz81 wrote: Superhuman strength, and the skull is the hardest place of the human body. Simple anatomy will learn you that it's the best place for being hit with a gun, not recommended though.
I believe The hardiest place of the Human body is the femur. Not the skull.
Check out my slow progressing work blog Vlka Fenryka
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
The Skull is harder, it is protecting the brain. And I would imagine a Primarch's skull is at least a couple inches thick.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Grey Templar wrote: The Skull is harder, it is protecting the brain. And I would imagine a Primarch's skull is at least a couple inches thick.
^ This - ceramite (or no) thicked skull works well - but also Fulgrim was to my understanding just scraped and stunned- If it was a straight shot through the eye Fulrim would be 100% dead ...or cyclops...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 21:02:50
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
2013/01/06 21:04:47
Subject: Re:Ezekyle Abaddon vs. the Chaos Primarchs
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Yeah, the eye is not a garunteed kill shot, but its still pretty darn good. It also depends on the angle of entry. You could enter the eye and leave through the lower back of the skull and never even touch the brain. Or go down through the jaw.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Beaviz81 wrote: Would you like a bunch of nudists in the pictures of the Primarches and Empy instead Void? Empy and Horus picture would look less bad ass if both were in the flesh with a nude Sanguinius laying at the feet of Horus.
then it would be a tone of vs threads "who has bigger" literary...Imagine this - Sanguinius laying with the boner under Horus...:-)
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote: Yeah, the eye is not a garunteed kill shot, but its still pretty darn good. It also depends on the angle of entry. You could enter the eye and leave through the lower back of the skull and never even touch the brain. Or go down through the jaw.
So aim up - P dead; aim down - Magnus has a new buddy...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/06 21:23:41
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
Reminds me of an episode of Golden Goal (Norwegian talkshow about sports). A guy was hit i the head by a golf-ball, and he passed out getting a boner, I now can vision Empy and Horus in the flesh fighting while Sanguinius is laying there with a a boner. Yack, yack, yack, this is truly both sick and witty.
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
Beaviz81 wrote: Reminds me of an episode of Golden Goal (Norwegian talkshow about sports). A guy was hit i the head by a golf-ball, and he passed out getting a boner, I now can vision Empy and Horus in the flesh fighting while Sanguinius is laying there with a a boner. Yack, yack, yack, this is truly both sick and witty.
ha,ha,ha,ha
Also imagine custodians dragging Empy and inserting him to the golden throne while he is in full "heresy" mode....
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
Beaviz81 wrote: Ew. Lets be glad they choose to wear clothes.
Yes - also Abby wins as I said that...
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
If the Primarchs in the FW Heresy book are an indications, even fully-powered Abaddon is still not even close to being match for the big guys. And that is before their ascension to daemonhood, which likely cost them some of their fancy gear but boosted their natural abilities by a large degree.
In Boxing matches, you actually get paid to take a dive and make the other guy look good.
In Warhammer 40K, you're expected to pay cash out of your pocket for the privilege of having Marines and IG trample all over your Xenos/Chaos.
"It is the great irony of the Legiones Astartes: engineered to kill to achieve a victory of peace that they can then be no part of." - Roboute Guilliman
"As I recall, your face was tortured. Imagine that - the Master of the Wolves, his ferocity twisted into grief. And yet you still carried out your duty. You always did what was asked of you. So loyal. So tenacious. Truly you were the attack dog of the Emperor. You took no pleasure in what you did. I knew that then, and I know it now. But all things change, my brother. I'm not the same as I was, and you're... well, let us not mention where you are now." - Magnus the Red, to a statue of Leman Russ
It's pretty much pointless to try to gauge the strenghts of the Primarchs. I Flight of the Eisenstein we hear about how formidable Mortarion is, then he gets his heart tattood by some mortal random. Horus is second to the Emperor in power yadda yadda but the interex knife laid him low.
The fluff is so contradictory these threads will never come up with a clear answer.
I never understood the battles in HH novels. Astartes are such great fighters and train their entire lives and yet when the fighting begins they just randomly spray with bolters, or whenever the story requires it, make impossible semi-auto shots. Contradictions abound!
Yeah the Astartes seems to shift between Superman in powered armour without flying and heat vision, to not more competent than Terran Marines in Starcraft. And their aiming skills is as good or as bad as the plot demands them to be.
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
I think you could make a case for some of the most powerful Marines (Abby, Draigo, Mephiston, Sanguinor) being able to hold their own with the Primarchs.
But yeah, the background is pretty inconsistent about the power levels of... everything.
Playing: Droids (Legion), Starks (ASOIAF), BB2
Working on: Starks (ASOIAF), Twilight Kin (KoW). Droids (Legion)
Abaddon leads the Black Crusades as he is the the only one who can issue a call-to-arms of sufficient power to unite the legions and daemons under his banner.
The reason his call-to-arms is so powerful is that he's spent several editions of 40K honing this skill by calling to his own arms when they repeatedly fall off within a single battle.
Legend has it that the move to finecast has removed this innate ability, and the Chaos Gods now see several holes in his previously impenetrable armour opening up.
Abaddon knows this, however, and has replaced Drach'nyen with drops of superglue and liquid greenstuff to seal them.
Empy and Horus picture would look less bad ass if both were in the flesh with a nude Sanguinius laying at the feet of Horus.
5000 