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You enjoy fantasising about a good old genocide, do you?

Fluff wise the Imperium is just surviving on the left overs of the great crusade, a war to unite all humanity and slash all opposition. Theirs a short story about the Space Wolves in which they fight alongside their mortal enemies who just tried to have them killed, they do it because even though their enemies they recognise their humanity, after the battle the Wolves shoot their former allies in the back.

ZSO, SAHAAL wrote:

You enjoy fantasising about a good old genocide, do you?

Fluff wise the Imperium is just surviving on the left overs of the great crusade, a war to unite all humanity and slash all opposition. Theirs a short story about the Space Wolves in which they fight alongside their mortal enemies who just tried to have them killed, they do it because even though their enemies they recognise their humanity, after the battle the Wolves shoot their former allies in the back.

Do you mean the story, Wolf at the Gate? If you do then you remember that story wrong. The spacewolves in that story do not fight alongside "their mortal enemies", they try to free a world enslaved by the Dark Eldar
( and with some help by the natives they succeed ), only to attack their erstwhile allies when they decide to remain free. There was no previous animosity between the wolves and the natives.
Of course, the idea that some people simply do not want to be "united" is quite puzzling to some...

 KingDeath wrote:
Of course, the idea that some people simply do not want to be "united" is quite puzzling to some...

Yeah, which human would not love to join a faschist human empire?

They all love it. Because its better than a fascist xeno Empire...

 1hadhq wrote:
They all love it. Because its better than a fascist xeno Empire...

They loved it so much that half of them rebelled at the first opportunity

 Kroothawk wrote:

 KingDeath wrote:
Of course, the idea that some people simply do not want to be "united" is quite puzzling to some...

Yeah, which human would not love to join a faschist human empire?

An idiot. Or a madman. Human tyrants and despots are more identifiable with and thus infinitely better than some alien philosopher-king, no matter how benevolent. Heck, even malevolent and ultimately uncaring deities born of Humanity's darkness are preferable to alien philosopher-kings.

I thought that generally the tau only visited/converted/mind controlled/traded/committed to poorly thought out inter species fan fic's/invaded, delete where applicable, imperial colonies on the border of Imperial space, hell until the Imperium fought back with the Damocles Gulf crusade most of these colonies hadn't seen hide nor hair of the Imperium, all they knew was every few decades some guys turned up in massive ships and demanded a percentage of their stuff for no appreciable reason, it wouldn't have taken much propaganda to make the Greater Good look like a better option.

As to how humans are treated under the Tau regime, well they trust them to carry fire arms into battle and Tau technology, their not conscripted and any story I've read describing the interaction between Tau humans and Imperial humans, the Tau humans don't seem to be under any duress.

As for how Ethereal's control the Tau, probably the same way politicians control out countries, the alternative is total destructive anarchy. Bare in mind the stories of the Ethereal's magically arriving and instantly diplomatically taming the warring nations MAY have been just a LITTLE exaggerated for posterity? I mean these events would have happened a while ago.

And while the Imperium of man is just one character in the 40k setting, bare in mind its the set of eyes that we mainly regard the universe through, most of the information we have on the tau is presented from either a magos biologis cutting one open, an Imperial commander bitching about their firepower or a Rogue Trader.... not exactly unbiased opinions....

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

An idiot. Or a madman. Human tyrants and despots are more identifiable with and thus infinitely better than some alien philosopher-king, no matter how benevolent. Heck, even malevolent and ultimately uncaring deities born of Humanity's darkness are preferable to alien philosopher-kings.

Yes, it's so difficult to live under xenos philosopher kings. No mass public burnings at the stake, no witch trials, free to worship the God Emperor or not, and, I saw, just the other day, a man with yellow hair walking the streets unmolested! Yellow! How does a hideous mutant like that go unkilled, with his non-brown hair and his blue eyes? And the judicial system! Why, I told one of their magistrates that I had a dream that one of my neighbors was a witch, and he not only did nothing about it, he told me that they needed facts, and suggested i should see one of their mind-physicians!

And their bizarre xenos tech! The trains run on metal rails! What ever happened to the good old days when huge lines of pilgrims would lay down and grab the ankles of the man in front of them so the sacred loco-motive could crush their bodies with it's holy weight! And they don't even run on burning babies! Some sorcery known as 'electricity' drives them along!

Can you believe it!?

 BaronIveagh wrote:

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

An idiot. Or a madman. Human tyrants and despots are more identifiable with and thus infinitely better than some alien philosopher-king, no matter how benevolent. Heck, even malevolent and ultimately uncaring deities born of Humanity's darkness are preferable to alien philosopher-kings.

Yes, it's so difficult to live under xenos philosopher kings. No mass public burnings at the stake, no witch trials, free to worship the God Emperor or not, and, I saw, just the other day, a man with yellow hair walking the streets unmolested! Yellow! How does a hideous mutant like that go unkilled, with his non-brown hair and his blue eyes? And the judicial system! Why, I told one of their magistrates that I had a dream that one of my neighbors was a witch, and he not only did nothing about it, he told me that they needed facts, and suggested i should see one of their mind-physicians!

And their bizarre xenos tech! The trains run on metal rails! What ever happened to the good old days when huge lines of pilgrims would lay down and grab the ankles of the man in front of them so the sacred loco-motive could crush their bodies with it's holy weight! And they don't even run on burning babies! Some sorcery known as 'electricity' drives them along!

Can you believe it!?

Exalt headed your way.

 BaronIveagh wrote:
...a man with yellow hair walking the streets unmolested! Yellow! How does a hideous mutant like that go unkilled, with his non-brown hair and his blue eyes?

Plenty of Valhallans are blondes.

And the judicial system! Why, I told one of their magistrates that I had a dream that one of my neighbors was a witch, and he not only did nothing about it, he told me that they needed facts, and suggested i should see one of their mind-physicians!

Yeah, if you said that to the Arbites, they'd have you checked first. Either they'd have you sent to the Medicae's Psychiatric Ward, or to the next Black Ship.

And their bizarre xenos tech! The trains run on metal rails! What ever happened to the good old days when huge lines of pilgrims would lay down and grab the ankles of the man in front of them so the sacred loco-motive could crush their bodies with it's holy weight! And they don't even run on burning babies! Some sorcery known as 'electricity' drives them along!

Can you believe it!?

No. Because I use never accept the codices' fluff verbatim, and only as a general guide to 40k

Why do people accept? Probably because the Tau have a significantly smaller number of genetically engineered cyborg babies flying around to deliver messages.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Why do people accept? Probably because the Tau have a significantly smaller number of genetically engineered cyborg babies flying around to deliver messages.

If you have a better idea of how to deliver mail I'd like to hear it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It has to do with what your used too. If your born in the Imperium and visit Tau land and see drones you've been taught from birth these are heretical abominations. So naturaly you'd think why can't they just use lobotomized baby cadaver like the good old Imperium?

Obviously many people choose to live under and have chose to live under dictatorships in real life. Looking in from the outside we think they're crazy but it's difficult to comprehend when how it is for someone who was born there and indoctrinated there.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Why do people accept? Probably because the Tau have a significantly smaller number of genetically engineered cyborg babies flying around to deliver messages.

If you have a better idea of how to deliver mail I'd like to hear it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It has to do with what your used too. If your born in the Imperium and visit Tau land and see drones you've been taught from birth these are heretical abominations. So naturaly you'd think why can't they just use lobotomized baby cadaver like the good old Imperium?

Obviously many people choose to live under and have chose to live under dictatorships in real life. Looking in from the outside we think they're crazy but it's difficult to comprehend when how it is for someone who was born there and indoctrinated there.

And just as many flee the country and even more hate it but are too afraid to do anything.

It's like N Korea but N Korea is the size of the rest of the world and the rest of the world is the size of N Korea and then 99.9% N Korea isn't even aware that the "rest of world" exists. Defections from N Korea would happen but be very low.

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

Plenty of Valhallans are blondes.

Actually black is more common to Valhallans, according to several sources, though blonde and red are not unknown, both are technically mutations. I'm trying to find the source, but I seem to recall an inquisitor declaring entire worlds exterminatus based on eye and hair color.

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

No. Because I use never accept the codices' fluff verbatim, and only as a general guide to 40k

So what you are talking about is Valerian40k rather than warhammer 40k.

 BaronIveagh wrote:

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

No. Because I use never accept the codices' fluff verbatim, and only as a general guide to 40k

So what you are talking about is Valerian40k rather than warhammer 40k.

Then by that logic, the works of the different BL authors aren't Warhammer 40k either, but rather Abnett 40k/Mitchells 40k/ADB 40k and so on since their works aren't codex verbatim either

 BaronIveagh wrote:

Yes, it's so difficult to live under xenos philosopher kings. No mass public burnings at the stake, no witch trials

The Imperium doesn't have witch trials: psykers are quite easily identified as such by sanctioned psykers. Being psykers, they have a tendency to just up and explode into daemons without proper training, to say nothing of what can be done by a rogue psyker intentionally.

, free to worship the God Emperor or not,

Technically speaking, Imperial citizens are free to believe whatever they want, provided they're not worshiping warp entities. Local authorities might take issue, but then local authorities are always like that.

and, I saw, just the other day, a man with yellow hair walking the streets unmolested! Yellow! How does a hideous mutant like that go unkilled, with his non-brown hair and his blue eyes?

In 40k, mutants have tentacles or extra limbs, and are caused by Xenos infestation, warp entities, or possibly toxic waste (which means the lowest social class, which means uneducated, resentful laborers far removed from the truth underlying the Imperium's actions, which means a hotbed for the worship of warpspawn and general malevolence towards all other human life), and so are serious cause for concern amongst the authorities. "Mutants" are not humans with slight morphological changes as a result of selection imposed by their environment or simply random variance within the population.

And the judicial system! Why, I told one of their magistrates that I had a dream that one of my neighbors was a witch, and he not only did nothing about it, he told me that they needed facts, and suggested i should see one of their mind-physicians!

It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

And their bizarre xenos tech! The trains run on metal rails! What ever happened to the good old days when huge lines of pilgrims would lay down and grab the ankles of the man in front of them so the sacred loco-motive could crush their bodies with it's holy weight! And they don't even run on burning babies! Some sorcery known as 'electricity' drives them along!

Can you believe it!?

Tau don't have trains. And imperial military vehicles (the land ones, at least) run on literally anything that can burn.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

Not to mention the Arbites are very particular about the letter of the law so they'd thoroughly investigate the matter rather than taking gossip at face value. No matter how much the Ecclesiarchy harps on about 'faith needs no proof', the Arbites are the ones who ultimately enforce the law, and they're quite professional at that. If it just ends up as mere gossip, they'd either send the dreamer to a shrink or the Senior Arbitrator will give him/her a stiff talking down to.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

The Imperium doesn't have witch trials: psykers are quite easily identified as such by sanctioned psykers. Being psykers, they have a tendency to just up and explode into daemons without proper training, to say nothing of what can be done by a rogue psyker intentionally.

Incorrect. See Codex: Witch Hunters and also Dark Hersey, which has an entire class that revolves around being a witch hunter in the classic sense. (Also, use your head, the number of sanctioned psykers is TINY compared to the haul of warm bodies the Black Ships bring in. There would never be enough of them to detect them that way)

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Technically speaking, Imperial citizens are free to believe whatever they want, provided they're not worshiping warp entities.

Incorrect. In fact, there are even some offshoots of the Imperial Creed which are forbidden, such as the Temple of the Savior Emperor.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

In 40k, mutants have tentacles or extra limbs, and are caused by Xenos infestation, warp entities, or possibly toxic waste (which means the lowest social class, which means uneducated, resentful laborers far removed from the truth underlying the Imperium's actions, which means a hotbed for the worship of warpspawn and general malevolence towards all other human life), and so are serious cause for concern amongst the authorities. "Mutants" are not humans with slight morphological changes as a result of selection imposed by their environment or simply random variance within the population.

Under Imperial law any mutation or deviation from the sacred human form is a crime. And Heresy. So yes, that does include things like people with an extra rib or vertebra just as much as an extra arm, as well as unusual hair and skin colors (The definition of which varies tremendously but, yes in fluff there have been purges and exterminatus based on things as silly as hair and skin color.)

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

And then pitch you on the burning pyre for it.

'A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.' - Inquisitor Lord Fyodor Karamazov

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Tau don't have trains. And imperial military vehicles (the land ones, at least) run on literally anything that can burn.

Tau do have maglevs, so, yes, they do have trains. They just don't run on burning babies and are not covered in bronze skulls nor carry lascannons like Imperial ones do.

 BaronIveagh wrote:

Under Imperial law any mutation or deviation from the sacred human form is a crime. And Heresy. So yes, that does include things like people with an extra rib or vertebra just as much as an extra arm, as well as unusual hair and skin colors (The definition of which varies tremendously but, yes in fluff there have been purges and exterminatus based on things as silly as hair and skin color.)

And the fact that blondes/redheads/abhumans exist and even serve in the Imperial Guard prove that such extreme measures are probably disapproved of by the greater Inquisition/Imperium.

'A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.' - Inquisitor Lord Fyodor Karamazov

I have no respect for the man; for one thing, he has poor taste in accessories, and has a MASSIVE stick up his ass. I'll take Valeria/Coteaz over Karamazov any day.

...they just don't run on burning babies...

Neither do Imperial trains. They either run on promethium derivatives or on geothermal/fusion-produced electricity.

...and are not covered in bronze skulls...

It's looks badass, so what's the problem?

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

Not to mention the Arbites are very particular about the letter of the law so they'd thoroughly investigate the matter rather than taking gossip at face value. No matter how much the Ecclesiarchy harps on about 'faith needs no proof', the Arbites are the ones who ultimately enforce the law, and they're quite professional at that. If it just ends up as mere gossip, they'd either send the dreamer to a shrink or the Senior Arbitrator will give him/her a stiff talking down to.

Ok say it with me now. The IoM is not reasonable. They aren't friendly. They are bat wing crazy and that's how they should be.

 BaronIveagh wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

The Imperium doesn't have witch trials: psykers are quite easily identified as such by sanctioned psykers. Being psykers, they have a tendency to just up and explode into daemons without proper training, to say nothing of what can be done by a rogue psyker intentionally.

Incorrect. See Codex: Witch Hunters and also Dark Hersey, which has an entire class that revolves around being a witch hunter in the classic sense. (Also, use your head, the number of sanctioned psykers is TINY compared to the haul of warm bodies the Black Ships bring in. There would never be enough of them to detect them that way)

They don't have witch trials, however. Being a witch or not is an easily discernible quality. Which is sort of the core problem with criticizing the Imperium for hunting witches: the term "witch hunt", used idiomatically, refers to a hunt for imaginary foes that, as it's fighting nothing but delusions, strikes randomly at innocents; when used in the context of a world where the "witches" in question are real, often insane, possessed of unstable and extremely dangerous powers, and in constant danger of just up and exploding into daemons, it takes on a rather more positive form.

Sanctioned psykers of one sort or another aren't that rare. Your fancy combat psykers, sure, but there are plenty of astropaths, and the lesser-but-stable psykers who are used for the sole purpose of detecting other psykers.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Technically speaking, Imperial citizens are free to believe whatever they want, provided they're not worshiping warp entities.

Incorrect. In fact, there are even some offshoots of the Imperial Creed which are forbidden, such as the Temple of the Savior Emperor.

Anything that's banned, is banned for a reason: subversion, xenos influence, warpspawn worship, etc. The Imperium itself doesn't care beyond preventing dangerous ideologies from taking root, though again, local authorities are just as free to do as they will, provided they avoid xenos and daemons, and pay their taxes, so they can impose, or attempt to impose, whatever they feel like upon their citizenry. There's no Imperial thought police, if only because anyone who's qualified for the job has more important things to deal with.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

In 40k, mutants have tentacles or extra limbs, and are caused by Xenos infestation, warp entities, or possibly toxic waste (which means the lowest social class, which means uneducated, resentful laborers far removed from the truth underlying the Imperium's actions, which means a hotbed for the worship of warpspawn and general malevolence towards all other human life), and so are serious cause for concern amongst the authorities. "Mutants" are not humans with slight morphological changes as a result of selection imposed by their environment or simply random variance within the population.

Under Imperial law any mutation or deviation from the sacred human form is a crime. And Heresy. So yes, that does include things like people with an extra rib or vertebra just as much as an extra arm, as well as unusual hair and skin colors (The definition of which varies tremendously but, yes in fluff there have been purges and exterminatus based on things as silly as hair and skin color.)

Only if you're counting something like "feathers" as a hair color, or "scales" as a skin color, and abnormal extra bones could well be a sign of genestealer infestation.

Would the "purges based on hair/eye color" be from the same era when space marines could be half eldar, and Orks didn't reproduce asexually? Because it sounds like it's either outdated, or else a matter of insane locals freaking out over the prospect of genestealers and killing anyone that looks the least bit odd.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

And then pitch you on the burning pyre for it.

'A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.' - Inquisitor Lord Fyodor Karamazov

You're aware that Karamazov was deemed an insane heretic after he burned dozens of worlds in a misguided attempt to produce a dead zone that tyranids couldn't cross, right?

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Tau don't have trains. And imperial military vehicles (the land ones, at least) run on literally anything that can burn.

Tau do have maglevs, so, yes, they do have trains. They just don't run on burning babies and are not covered in bronze skulls nor carry lascannons like Imperial ones do.

The point being it's an inaccurate view of Imperial technology that's fully detached from anything but the oldest and most poorly constructed fluff (and even then only tenuously) and entirely at odds with modern fluff.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

nomotog wrote:

Ok say it with me now. The IoM is not reasonable. They aren't friendly. They are bat wing crazy and that's how they should be.

Read the Eisenhorn and/or Ravenor trilogies, or the Dark Heresy rulebooks. That just isn't born out by modern depictions of Imperial society.

nomotog wrote:

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

Not to mention the Arbites are very particular about the letter of the law so they'd thoroughly investigate the matter rather than taking gossip at face value. No matter how much the Ecclesiarchy harps on about 'faith needs no proof', the Arbites are the ones who ultimately enforce the law, and they're quite professional at that. If it just ends up as mere gossip, they'd either send the dreamer to a shrink or the Senior Arbitrator will give him/her a stiff talking down to.

Ok say it with me now. The IoM is not reasonable. They aren't friendly. They are bat wing crazy and that's how they should be.

Arbitrators are Judge Dredd expies. They will follow Imperial Law to the letter. They're not good. They're not bad either. They are justice embodied, cold and hard, but balanced as far as the law is concerned.

I don't mind if you want to view the Imperium as a 'Lawful Evil' faction, and I can respect that, but I prefer to see it as a 'Lawful Neutral' faction and I'm going to have to ask you to respect that as well.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

And then pitch you on the burning pyre for it.

'A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.' - Inquisitor Lord Fyodor Karamazov

You're aware that Karamazov was deemed an insane heretic after he burned dozens of worlds in a misguided attempt to produce a dead zone that tyranids couldn't cross, right?

Actually, you're thinking of Inquisitor Kryptman, not Karamazov.

My mistake, never been all that good with the names of side characters/historical figures. I recall the events just fine, but the relevant names never seem to stick completely...

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

nomotog wrote:

 Admiral Valerian wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
It's already been pointed out, but seeing as how psykers are extremely easy to identify, they'd examine you, your neighbor, and probably everyone else nearby, which would likely include checking if they had similar dreams, since that sort of thing would indicate either a psyker or warpspawn operating nearby. If there was no issue to be found, they would, at worst lecture you on wasting their time.

Not to mention the Arbites are very particular about the letter of the law so they'd thoroughly investigate the matter rather than taking gossip at face value. No matter how much the Ecclesiarchy harps on about 'faith needs no proof', the Arbites are the ones who ultimately enforce the law, and they're quite professional at that. If it just ends up as mere gossip, they'd either send the dreamer to a shrink or the Senior Arbitrator will give him/her a stiff talking down to.

Ok say it with me now. The IoM is not reasonable. They aren't friendly. They are bat wing crazy and that's how they should be.

Arbitrators are Judge Dredd expies. They will follow Imperial Law to the letter. They're not good. They're not bad either. They are justice embodied, cold and hard, but balanced as far as the law is concerned.

I don't mind if you want to view the Imperium as a 'Lawful Evil' faction, and I can respect that, but I prefer to see it as a 'Lawful Neutral' faction and I'm going to have to ask you to respect that as well.

I can't respect that. I can maybe tolerate that, but people who try to make the IoM reasonable just don't get them.

Such are the fortunes of war, so it would seem

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

They don't have witch trials, however. Being a witch or not is an easily discernible quality. Which is sort of the core problem with criticizing the Imperium for hunting witches: the term "witch hunt", used idiomatically, refers to a hunt for imaginary foes that, as it's fighting nothing but delusions, strikes randomly at innocents; when used in the context of a world where the "witches" in question are real, often insane, possessed of unstable and extremely dangerous powers, and in constant danger of just up and exploding into daemons, it takes on a rather more positive form.

"2496. Place ye suspect in an airloke and remove all air for a period not less than one standard Terran hour. If ye suspect survives, then he is a Witch and should be placed in ye vessel's plasma core until he is reduced to ash.

2497. Chain ye suspect and bury him in a desert up to his neck. Fill his mouth with salt and sew it shut. Observe ye suspect for one week. If ye suspect yet survives, he is a Witch and should be rendered into four parts, burned, and his ashes scattered to ye winds." - Extract from Ye Book of Trials (Page 70, BoM)

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Anything that's banned, is banned for a reason: subversion, xenos influence, warpspawn worship, etc. The Imperium itself doesn't care beyond preventing dangerous ideologies from taking root, though again, local authorities are just as free to do as they will, provided they avoid xenos and daemons, and pay their taxes, so they can impose, or attempt to impose, whatever they feel like upon their citizenry. There's no Imperial thought police, if only because anyone who's qualified for the job has more important things to deal with.

The Imperial Creed directly states that failure to worship the Emperor is heresy. The Imperial Navy lists failure to worship the Emperor as punishable by death.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Would the "purges based on hair/eye color" be from the same era when space marines could be half eldar, and Orks didn't reproduce asexually? Because it sounds like it's either outdated, or else a matter of insane locals freaking out over the prospect of genestealers and killing anyone that looks the least bit odd.

I seem to remember it being in Codex Witch Hunters (don't have the book handy here), so... no, it's fairly modern.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

You're aware that Karamazov was deemed an insane heretic after he burned dozens of worlds in a misguided attempt to produce a dead zone that tyranids couldn't cross, right?

You're aware that was kryptmann, right?

 BaronIveagh wrote:

"2496. Place ye suspect in an airloke and remove all air for a period not less than one standard Terran hour. If ye suspect survives, then he is a Witch and should be placed in ye vessel's plasma core until he is reduced to ash.

2497. Chain ye suspect and bury him in a desert up to his neck. Fill his mouth with salt and sew it shut. Observe ye suspect for one week. If ye suspect yet survives, he is a Witch and should be rendered into four parts, burned, and his ashes scattered to ye winds." - Extract from Ye Book of Trials (Page 70, BoM)

That sounds entirely at odds with current fluff.

I seem to remember it being in Codex Witch Hunters (don't have the book handy here), so... no, it's fairly modern.

First off, codex witch hunters is rather ancient, and second, no it's not. I just read through it to make sure. Unless it's older than the 3e codex, in which case it's not far removed from the time of half-eldar space marines and similar rubbish.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

That sounds entirely at odds with current fluff.

It's a little over a year old.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

First off, codex witch hunters is rather ancient, and second, no it's not. I just read through it to make sure. Unless it's older than the 3e codex, in which case it's not far removed from the time of half-eldar space marines and similar rubbish.

Like I said, I'm trying to remember exactly where it was. It was fairly recent though,