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So I was just skimming through the 6th ed rulebook to see if FMCs have Skyfire and on page 49 under swooping hunters it says "Flying monstrous creatures can shoot all around, just like other non-vehicle models."

This makes the game much easier because at my LFGS everyone has played that since 6th ed, you can't move your infantry models in the shooting phase to line up LOS. But this here gives them permission to shoot from any point on there base and not just straight ahead from whichever direction you left them standing in the movement phase.

So I am wondering how does this work, it is not covered in the shooting phase but this rule clearly does give infantry permission to do this.

P10 "Turning and Facing" states that the direction a model is facing won't impact its ability to shoot or assault later in the turn. It is merely "better" to have them facing the enemy for looks. Vehicles have specific additional rules about where you draw line of sight from and weapon firing arcs, but other models do not.

from what I understood, in 6th ed, they removed the permission to to move your models during the shooting phase and you had to draw line of sight from directly behind the model. There was a big thread about it a week or two ago on here about it.

scorpio2069 wrote:
from what I understood, in 6th ed, they removed the permission to to move your models during the shooting phase and you had to draw line of sight from directly behind the model. There was a big thread about it a week or two ago on here about it.

I don't recall that ever being an there in 5th either. You never could "move" your models to line up a shot in 5th, and since True LOS has been around you always sight from behind your models to see what they saw. The big contention was about models not having eyes, which was mostly a RAW just to argue RAW fight I think. As page 10 was point out, specifically states facing does not effect shooting.

I think he is missing the rule that says that models in the same unit don't block LOS from each other. There is no reason to move models to shoot. You can eithor already see it or can't. And more movement would be a blantant rules violation.

I recall a discussion on here earlier saying that you could not pivot models to line up LOS during the shooting phase in 6th ed, and that you had to draw LOS from behind them looking forwards and if they could not see the enemy using this method then you can not allocate any wounds to them since you can only allocate wounds to models you can see and only models that can see the enemy unit are allowed to shoot at it.

I am an ork player and this came up at my FLGS as well because I wanted to charge an enemy unit that was behind my boyz and the rulebook said that they need LOS to charge a unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also on pg 10 with this being a permissive rule set, it doesn't give you permission to shoot at a unit you can reach but can't draw LOS to.

it is intended, but not RAW as far as I know. if someone can show me where (other than what I pointed out) it gives permission to shoot at a unit that you cannot see/draw LOS to, I would be much obliged.

barnowl wrote:
I don't recall that ever being an there in 5th either. You never could "move" your models to line up a shot in 5th, and since True LOS has been around you always sight from behind your models to see what they saw. The big contention was about models not having eyes, which was mostly a RAW just to argue RAW fight I think. As page 10 was point out, specifically states facing does not effect shooting.

It was definitely in 5th, but GW managed to leave it out in 6th.

In the end, it seems like something that was intended to be there, but for whatever reason it was only implied in a few sections (e.g. the FMC section) but never explicitly stated.

The only reason facing matters to a FMC is when you are Swooping, you can only pivot up to 90 degrees.

Where shooting is concerned you can fire in any direction you like, same with all non vehicle models.

The only exception I can think of is Walkers. They have certain degrees of fire, but can pivot to face any target in the Shooting Phase.

My interpretation is that any model can fire in any direction, regardless of where he is facing (unless it has a rule which states otherwise, like vehicle arcs of fire etc...). This represents the fact that in a real life scenario you could do exactly the same thing, you aren't forced to fire directly forwards just because that's the way your head is facing. We're taking control of the models as if they were real people fighting a real war, and logic dictates that these people can turn their heads, bodies and torso's to adjust their firing angle, they wouldn't ignore the unit flanking them from their left because they were facing forward.

I personally would have no problem with a unit which has its back to me declaring a charge. It stands to reason that in a real life scenario they'd simply turn to face me and run at me screaming, which is essentially what the 6th ed rules now allow you to do. I can't think of any time this has ever happened to me though, genereally if i'm getting charged, it's by something that moved towards me first and is therefore generally facing in my direction!

Basically what happened was My deffkoptas flew over one of his units, I faced them so they had LOS to his tank, i popped it, and then in the assault phase I wanted to charge the guys I had just put behind me.

You couldn't anyway then, since you shot the tank.

BRB pg 10 Turning and Facing covers all of this issue.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
You couldn't anyway then, since you shot the tank.

BRB pg 10 Turning and Facing covers all of this issue.

Correct. You can't shoot at one unit then assault another, you have to assault the unit you shot at.

Unless it was a transport he shot open, then he can assualt the passengers.