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That APC looks special

And more reason to kick myself for missing the kickstarter

The front does seem kind of bland. Otherwise, it is glorious.

shade1313 wrote:

 sonofruss wrote:
That APC is going to overheat without a grill.

Nah. In the first place, the grill on nearly all modern cars is for appearance. The actual needed area to properly ventilate the radiator is MUCH smaller than what the grill allows, and alternative ways to get airflow would certainly be something I'd work into the design of a vehicle that is going to be shot at. Secondly, if it has some other means of cooling, a liquid cooling system, for example, you certainly wouldn't need any grill at all, and again, the added complexity of such a design my come out ahead when you consider bullets coming towards the vehicle at high speed.

Or, it being the future and all, it has a powerplant that doesn't need to be air-ventilated.

Edit: I'm kicking myself for not buying these during the KS....

bladeiai wrote:

shade1313 wrote:

 sonofruss wrote:
That APC is going to overheat without a grill.

Nah. In the first place, the grill on nearly all modern cars is for appearance. The actual needed area to properly ventilate the radiator is MUCH smaller than what the grill allows, and alternative ways to get airflow would certainly be something I'd work into the design of a vehicle that is going to be shot at. Secondly, if it has some other means of cooling, a liquid cooling system, for example, you certainly wouldn't need any grill at all, and again, the added complexity of such a design my come out ahead when you consider bullets coming towards the vehicle at high speed.

While I agree that it is completely feasible that you wouldn't need the grill, many modern cars need all of that air flow especially more powerful engines like the ones required to move very heavy armored trucks. Also liquid cooling system is what 95% of the vehicles on the market already employ.

If you're talking about regular radiator fluid, which is itself cooled by airflow over the radiator, then yes. If you're talking about more exotic liquid cooling, for example the LCS that we used on our blazing hot radar transmitters on F-15s, then no. Of course, one is used for OUR modern, conventional internal combustion engines (which the Eisenkern APC almost certainly doesn't use), and the other for a high powered radar set, and so it's a little bit of apples and oranges, but the essential point is that there are liquid cooling systems in use which cool VERY high power and temperature components, and don't need what is essentially ram air flow over a radiator to do their cooling job.

Fantastic work Mark. You are building an empire.

You could say he's building a religion ;P (Rusted Faith/Cake joke, dunno if anyone gets what I'm referring to...). I'm still hoping we get a backer coupon for kickstarter prices in the future, I have money now damnit! lol

Oh that Hanomag came out very brilliantly!

Looking forwards to other units.


Mark, all I can say is when they are released for retail is

People seem to forget that even in liquid cooled systems....that liquid is in turn cooled. By air.

But i don't think the APC needs a grill.


PS. If you think the grill on your car is for show...go block it off on a hot day. Dare ya.

I don't think I actually said it earlier, the APC looks fantastic, I can't wait to see one painted up! Much better than other such armored transports I have seen as of late...

 HisDivineShadow wrote:
People seem to forget that even in liquid cooled systems....that liquid is in turn cooled. By air.

But i don't think the APC needs a grill.


PS. If you think the grill on your car is for show...go block it off on a hot day. Dare ya.

Not at all. A point which, if you go and reread, I did make. But a more specialized system, able to step away from what you'd put in a commercially sold and maintained vehicle, often will use a source of air that doesn't come via a big, vulnerable grill on the front.

Oh, and AGAIN go back and reread. I didn't remotely say that the grill on the front of my car is for show. I said it's far larger than it really needs to be. And it is. People routinely block off large portions of the grill the factory put in place with aesthetic accessories, without doing any harm whatsoever.

Folks can deal with that

Or they can deal with this


The Hanomag is maybe slightly longer, but much lower in silhouette which is good for military vehicles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In scale I see the Hanomag as the more appropriate 8ft tall at most

WD cover makes Taurox seem 12-13ft tall, which is harder to use cover with.

I'm happy with the lack of grill, that means I can find some sort of awesome bit to put there

Any chance to reopen the pledge manager? I didn't order any wave three stuff because I was new at kickstarter and didn't think the timing would work out. I was half right , but now I also have the funds for more stuff. Sadly I know I won have it when these become available.

Sniper visor reminds me of this

But the rest is awesome especially the medic

Hekal Xul wrote:


Sniper visor reminds me of this

But the rest is awesome especially the medic

I KNEW it looked familiar somehow thanks.

The design is top notch on the APC, I have never been a fan of the Aliens armored lincoln look myself though. It looks like a Deathrace kit from a larger scale to me, probably because of the car shaped curves. It really does looks like a shelby with armor. However I know TONS of people who love the Aiens APC so I know this will be a big hit.

Your infantry is stunning, really shows how much better grasp on scale and proportions you have when you see that fugly taurox next to one of your models.Bravo sir!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PS, I would never add a grill to that thing, it will definitely push it too close to the armored Lincoln look I was mentioning.

The new replacement for the Hummer has a grill and it looks fine If I get these I will make a grill if it is missing one, and to combat the naysayers they are made with T shaped bars alternating the flat side so the air flow goes in a Z direction to stop most arms fire. I like it and will get some at some point in the future Viva La APC

The Hanomag looks great overall. It doesn't have a front grill because reasons. Reasons being:


The only thing I dislike about it are the side-view mirrors, which seem overly-large, direct-vision blocking, and also unnecessary given that cameras are a thing that exist - including places like modern consumer-level cars, let alone military vehicles and Eisenkern sniper rifles (so they're part of the in-game world). Simple enough to leave off, though.

Then again, if' we're using realism, those front wheel arches (where the cutaway is above the bumper) make for a brilliant shot trap, so as nice as Mark's stuff looks, and it looks a damn sight better than that abomination of a Taurox, we still need to use the "it's 40k - logic and realism have no place here" waiver.

 shasolenzabi wrote:

Spoiler:

Or they can deal with this

Y'know the Taurox was starting to grow on me.

Then I saw the Eisenkern APC and well, the taurox just dropped off my shopping list. Forever.

I'm a bit torn on the grill issue, the blank spot looks great for decal/freehand/bitz but it would be nice to have a grill option or something in the kit to put there.

The flat front will look great once painted and either unit markings, rally stripes or my favorite bull horns are added. If it's a stand in for a taurox it should have bull horns, they may be Germans, but there's a little cowboy in everyone.

Now, although I curved my spending a lot lately, my wife still has trouble following all my kickstarter projects. But she knows one thing: We love Mark. Not the French, but Mark, yes.

 shasolenzabi wrote:
Folks can deal with that

Or they can deal with this


The Hanomag is maybe slightly longer, but much lower in silhouette which is good for military vehicles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In scale I see the Hanomag as the more appropriate 8ft tall at most

WD cover makes Taurox seem 12-13ft tall, which is harder to use cover with.

I'd say they are about the same height. The dreamforge model is much wide and much much longer. I think the Hanomag will be about the size of a land raider (maybe not as wide) and the Taurox will be aboutt he size of a chimare (but about as tall as a land raider). Not a good use for this model at all.

The Taurox is clearly taller. The hanomag looks like it's a bit wider, and I'd also say longer.




Having said that, I don't think the dimensions being exact are all that important. I think the combination of the Taurox looking like a piece of gak and the Hanomag being pretty fething sweet make them an excellent use for this model.

Then again, I play with friends and don't bother playing with people who are going to be uptight about things like this. It's not exactly a case of modelling for advantage, after all.

MOAR!!!!!


My wallet is waiting.

I also simply prefer the aesthetics of the Hanomag as I think just appearance wise the Taurox is a poor design decision in many respects of design.

I like it (the Hanomag). It just doesn't fit in my particular vision for my guard army. Too...sleek I guess. Maybe it's just too realistic for my 40k warped brain.

Can't wait to see a full range of.stuff and a game for these.amazing.kits

So, I will say that, quite clearly, the wait was worth the results.

We're actually still waiting for the results....


I'd want a much more refined and realistic timetable for fulfilment before I considered backing another DFG/WFG project again though. This particular project might well have been better off being three distinct projects - Leviathans, Infantry and Vehicles, so with luck Mark will recognise that when he returns to the well. I'm still hoping that Mark/DFG are able to make good on the coupon and shipping from China for those of us outside the US.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Then I saw the Eisenkern APC and well, the taurox just dropped off my shopping list. Forever.

I'm a bit torn on the grill issue, the blank spot looks great for decal/freehand/bitz but it would be nice to have a grill option or something in the kit to put there.

Buy one and trick it out as a Chapter Master's Pimpmobile.

I'm sure that, next time around, Mark would be able to supply that more realistic timetable.

I'm still not over bothered by the whole kerfuffle, though, since nearly all KS campaigns I've backed have been late (which bespeaks a common pitfall to MOST KS campaigns), and the overall timetable was bound to shift further, as each wave had the shipping estimates based on the same factors, but would be delayed for the same reasons.

Either way, I actually DO expect my wave 3 stuff to get to me in Q2, and I'll be well pleased with it.