Leman Russ or Ordnance Batteries?

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**xlEternitylx**

Hey all, I'm trying to figure my way through the IG codex, and am caught between the two heavies. Can you help a guy out and explain which is better for a general all-comers list? I was thinking specifically of the Colossus versus the Leman Russ of different varieties, though any advice on all of them would be appreciated.

Also, side note: if I were to take IG as an ally, which would be better for the heavy slot?

**Living Still**

Depends on the list I'd say. Why not both though? I really like the colossus.... REALLY like it, but I actually think there are better options out there. Including 1 can be a good way to hit some cover huggers long range without too much of a point tax though. What are you planning for the rest of your list? If you need anti tank, take a Medusa or Manticore. If you need some longer range anti horde, take a couple of griffons. Most IG players run Vet spam to max out on special weapons. I would suggest ordinance for this kind of army because there is already a ton of AV saturation. If you are without 5 or 6 chimeras and are still running a gun line I would suggest throwing at least 1 or 2 Russes in. All the questions you are asking are not specific enough IMHO. What is your primary and what are you lacking in that list?

**xlEternitylx**

I was just looking for a pros/cons of each compared to each other. I'm still fudging around with lists and stuff so there isn't much written in stone.

The bit about using a colossus with vet spam is exactly the type of tips/usage I was looking for.

**Ailaros**

Traditionally, the way to figure out if you should go russes or artillery has been to ask yourself "do I need AV14?" If the answer wasn't "yes", then you went artillery, because it did everything russes were capable of, but for cheaper.

That's still true, but it's a little more complicated now. For example, we have HP, now, and russes can't get stunlocked anymore, which means the killing power per point gap has narrowed somewhat. Also, artillery is only capable of firing blast weapons, while russes just became heavy, which means they're better with the multi-shot stuff.

Artillery is still the cheapest way to shoehorn more firepower into your list, and russes really only shine now when you're willing to drop something like 200+ points on them.

Personally, I'm more for russes at the moment. If you want to do artillery, I'd really make a point to spam the hell out of it, to really take advantage of its low price point. Otherwise, I'd just use artillery as filler, because it's cheaper. If I didn't have filler points, though, I'd probably just go for the better armor.

**xlEternitylx**

Alright, that makes sense. Now the question is if there is an advantageous squad to a squad? Should you have 3 LR, or 2? Do I need 9 batteries if I decide AV14 is not needed?

**CaptainGrey**

xlEternitylx wrote:
Alright, that makes sense. Now the question is if there is an advantageous squad to a squad? Should you have 3 LR, or 2? Do I need 9 batteries if I decide AV14 is not needed?

The only advantage to squads is shuffling fully HP'd vehicles to the front to take hits, and vice versa for the ones that have taken hits earlier.

Otherwise, squadroned guard vehicles tend to lean toward overkilling what they're shooting. Obvious exceptions being vehicle slayers (Vanquishers and BB Medusae)

**Ailaros**

Generally you should evenly fill up your HS slots, getting three individual squads before making any squad have more than one tank in it, and so forth.

And no, you don't need nine artillery pieces to make artillery worthwhile. Basilisks are pretty cheap, though, and do cover an awful lot of target types. You can get 6 in your list for only 750 points, which really isn't that bad of a deal. And it's enough to achieve real redundancy and saturation.

And the looks on your opponent's faces would be priceless.

**xlEternitylx**

Ailaros wrote:
And the looks on your opponent's faces would be priceless.

That's reason enough for me!

Time to get cracking on some lists. Thanks for your help guys.

**TheLionOfTheForest**

I'm planning on using 2 basilisks and 2 colluses. Not sure if its better to keep the like together or to make each battery one bassilisk and one colluses. I'll probably take 2 Vanquisher's as my 3rd slot. Add 2 vendettas an aegis and fill the rest with platoons with LC.

**CaptainGrey**

I reckon they should be together; otherwise usually you'll be wasting one shot each time a squadron fires against something it's not too hot against.

**MrMoustaffa**

Running lots of infantry? Bring the pain with a wall of russes and laugh as your opponent's precious autocannons, scatter lasers, and missile launchers become glorified paperweights.

Running chimeras? Bring the thunder with ordnance batteries so your opponent is reduced to tears before a wall of AV 12.

Both choices excel for different reasons, but like all codexes, you choose your heavy support based on the weaknesses of your main list. This holds true whether you're running pure IG, or an allied force. Almost all variants of the Russ and ordnance tanks has a viable use now too, so use the ones that make the most sense for what you need.

I run executioners all the time for example, since I see tons of MEQ and deepstriking units. It absolutely demolishes local lists. Other people swear by punishers, exterminators, vanquishers, or even the humble main battle tank. There are also people who hate some of those variants with a fury of a thousand suns, because they don't need that variant. It's really up to your meta and what your list needs the most.

Never tried the ordnance tanks, but from my initial impressions, they work the same way.