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So I am thinking I want to do something a bit different. Instead of running Nids, or IG I want to do demons. Not CSM but strictly demons. My question is can they be competitive?

I am thinking something mildly CC over Dakka. The issue is with 6th edition, CC may be an issue. Any ideas or general tactics that have worked for you guys so far? I find it hard to let my bloodletters drop onto the table only to get shot to bits because they cant assault right outta the box.

Huge quantities of screamers and flamers are inarguably very competitive, especially when combing with Fateweaver, and an aegis with comm array to get the second half of your army quickly.

The Masque is quite nice in combination with assault units, and with flamer and soulgrinder template/blast (respective) shooting.

Actuarlly, Flamer/Screamer spam is actuarlly one of the best armies out there.

My friend plays pure Daemons and he goes with mass Screamers/Flamers as well. He uses Plaguebearer troops because they're pretty damn durable, and the Masque as HQ for the Lash. He also has a special unit consisting of Skulltaker on Juggernaut along with a small pack of Bloodletters (usually 8) that pack a pretty good punch for a relatively cheap price, and they're scoring.

The trouble with Flamer/Screamer spam is that neither are scoring units. Daemon troops often leave something to be desired.

And of course, neither unit does anything against fliers.

Demons can be broken. Fateweaver plus flamers, or even flamers on their own, are obsenely powerful

Having said that, they can still make strong lists that aren't cheese or OP.

 BryllCream wrote:
Demons can be broken. Fateweaver plus flamers, or even flamers on their own, are obsenely powerful

Having said that, they can still make strong lists that aren't cheese or OP.

I get that flamers can be competitive but what about something that isnt so shooty?

Something a little more in your face about stuff.

Screamers are CC and very powerful. Can rip up pretty much every unit type in the game and are cheap as well for what you get.

That and there are loads of monstrous creatures that are awesome in CC.

roxismcha wrote:
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I get that flamers can be competitive but what about something that isnt so shooty?

Something a little more in your face about stuff.

The problem is, in general a CC list =/= competitive. It's far too easy to counter, especially with 6th ed nerfs.


Also to be fair what isn't in your face about flamers?

If you want cc deamons you can get some bloodcrushers, fiend of slaanesh, and possibly deamonettes. None of them are "in your face" though.
Problem with Deamon cc is they are basicly fit for horde tactics, but cost far to much to get a decent horde, and you still need special units to take care of stuff like AV.

Although, two soulgrinders to cover your back ought to be mandatory IMHO. Great allaround machines for a decent cost.

Daemons are extremely good -- definately a top tier codex today.

The problem is everyone assumes that a Daemon army with flamers and screamers is a CC list. 9x Screamers turbo boosting are on average the equivalent to 27 BS 4 bolter shots while flaemrs are - naturally - very shooty. Throw in a pair of grinders and some horrors for troops and you have a very strong shooting army that always gets the first shot off while retaining strong CC potential.

Pure Daemons is very good - I ran them at Da Boyz GT and went 3-1 (lost to the eventual winner game 3, 25-8) before I had to drop. I ran a more diverse list than pure screamer/flamer - also had fiends, horrors, grinders, plagues and fate.

The problem is the Screamers/Flamers will double in price when the codex gets updated so you'd better enjoy spamming them while you can.

Fateweaver with flamers and screamers will do the trick...

The dont need a lot of scoring units because the will most likely kill the enemies army completely. Even flyers can be ignored or taken down by fateweaver (bolt of change).

shogun wrote:

Fateweaver with flamers and screamers will do the trick...

The dont need a lot of scoring units because the will most likely kill the enemies army completely. Even flyers can be ignored or taken down by fateweaver (bolt of change).

I think there is something I am really missing. Screamers are the manta rays guys correct? Why are they good? I will admit there is a severe lack of demon players in my meta so i have never seen one play well. But screamers totally wasnt on my radar when I started this thread.

So can someone explain to me like I am slow(which it seems i currently am being) why screamers rock face?

Now that begs the question. Do you only have the demon codex, or do you also have the updated flamer and screamer rules that were released like 8 months ago in a white dwarf?

Because if you are basing your questions off the codex then I understand your confusion. But screamers are pretty evidently awesome in the update... 2 wounds 3 str 5 ap 2 attacks in close combat, jet bikes with fly over attacks. They are pretty darn cool.

OrdoSean wrote:
Now that begs the question. Do you only have the demon codex, or do you also have the updated flamer and screamer rules that were released like 8 months ago in a white dwarf?

Because if you are basing your questions off the codex then I understand your confusion. But screamers are pretty evidently awesome in the update... 2 wounds 3 str 5 ap 2 attacks in close combat, jet bikes with fly over attacks. They are pretty darn cool.

.........

I need to get the white dwarf codex


Automatically Appended Next Post:

OrdoSean wrote:
Now that begs the question. Do you only have the demon codex, or do you also have the updated flamer and screamer rules that were released like 8 months ago in a white dwarf?

Because if you are basing your questions off the codex then I understand your confusion. But screamers are pretty evidently awesome in the update... 2 wounds 3 str 5 ap 2 attacks in close combat, jet bikes with fly over attacks. They are pretty darn cool.

But after they turbo boost for the fly over attacks they cannot assualt correct?

correct its one or the other. But you can turbo boost to do the fly over attacks on the turn you deepstrike in and then assault next turn. Also they have armor bane so are str 5 + 2d6 against vehicles now too.

Flamers also got cheaper.

The fact that Screamers in an army with Fateweaver can also use their turbo move on the drop to ensure that they're within 6" of FW without any risk is also quite nice. Re-rollable 4+ cover save for turbo-boosting makes them pretty darn durable.

roxismcha wrote:
I think there is something I am really missing. Screamers are the manta rays guys correct? Why are they good? I will admit there is a severe lack of demon players in my meta so i have never seen one play well. But screamers totally wasnt on my radar when I started this thread.

So can someone explain to me like I am slow(which it seems i currently am being) why screamers rock face?

There are a few key reasons they wreck face

* They are 2 wound models with EW for 25 points each. This means your paying 12.5 points per wound -- a very good price.

* When not assaulting, they will be moving flat out for a 4++ cover save. Since their jetbikes, they can move 36" per turn, making them extremely mobile.

* They can fly over units, doing d6 STR 4 AP- hits per model. This means 9 screamers can flyby doing ~18 STR 4 hits on a squad. That's the same as 14 MEQ firing bolters in rapid fire range!

* They are STR 5, AP2 in assault with 3 attacks per model! They will eat TEQ, MANZ, MEQ, or any heavily armored opponent in assault. Since they can move 36" per turn, they are going to get to assault before you can kill them!

* They are armorbane in assault. This means they can tear open any vehicle.

Simply put, they are one of the best units in the game in terms of flexability, durability, and damage capacity.

 labmouse42 wrote:

roxismcha wrote:
I think there is something I am really missing. Screamers are the manta rays guys correct? Why are they good? I will admit there is a severe lack of demon players in my meta so i have never seen one play well. But screamers totally wasnt on my radar when I started this thread.

So can someone explain to me like I am slow(which it seems i currently am being) why screamers rock face?

* They can fly over units, doing d6 STR 4 AP- hits per model. This means 9 screamers can flyby doing ~18 STR 4 hits on a squad. That's the same as 14 MEQ firing bolters in rapid fire range!

.

I thought they were d3 hits on the fly by? Still thats a 27 hit possibility.

Screamers and flamers are currently complete nonsense.

Beyond that, going pure slanessh is pretty brutal. The ablilty to put 90 daemonettes, 18 fiends and 4 hearlds in a 2k list is brutal.

The power of nurgle comes in 3rd, with the old epidemius trick.

Finally khorne comes in last sadly, without good ap 2 on anything besides a MC, they are hurting.

Oh man, I was in a tournament this weekend. Won my other 2 games, but in my third game I got torn apart by flamer/screamer spam. I was playing Orks, so flamers were particularly brutal against me, but it still seemed like a really powerful army. The problem is in 6th I was afraid to assault the flamers because of Wall of Death. so I tried to kite back and shoot them, but they caught up eventually.

Oh, he also brought 2 Soulgrinders. Those also suck.