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Great report! It was very exciting.

 djones520 wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

 djones520 wrote:
It's a shame all of you guys live in California. Seem like a great bunch to play with. Looking forward to reading this one.

Consider coming to the Bay Area Open next year. You will find a lot of very cool and very, very good players to play against.

With a bit of luck I'll be living in Europe next year. Alas, it'll probably never be. I'll just continue to live vicariously through your batreps.

Hey, that's not a bad place to live at.

 tuiman wrote:
wow, torks do look like a strong army.

I think that they are. However, just like tyranids, they will have some bad matchups. I don't think they will do well against my wraithwing necrons.

McBain wrote:
Great report, thank you. Some very unlucky charge rolls..

My favourite part of the report though was the giant blue capsicum spore!

Due to reasons of traveling, I didn't want to bring my more fragile spore with me so I took the more resilient fruit with me.


@Yakface

Once again, thanks for taking the time to add your valuable insight into our battle. I think it is both fun and informative for the readers.

Another great report. Hopefully you'll get back to winning ways for the BAO, very unlucky the last two reports. Thanks again for sharing!

 jy2 wrote:



I don't think they will do well against my wraithwing necrons.

I don't know about that. Sure you beat me in that 2500pts Necrons vs. Tau + Ork game (which will never be posted due to camera malfunction), but that was due to insane luck and sneaky usage of multiple flyers in Relic. In the end, I lost a single squad of 30 shoota Boyz, but the other 5 squads were still alive. You did manage to beat both my Nobz Bikers and Warboss though, but you lost all 18 Wraiths and your Scarabs + Spyders. Then again, my dice were also hot rolling so many 6's, but that's nothing compared to how many times you stopped Zogwort turning your Destroyer Lord into a Squig (or sexy Daemonette model).

 jy2 wrote:

McBain wrote:

My favourite part of the report though was the giant blue capsicum spore!

Due to reasons of traveling, I didn't want to bring my more fragile spore with me so I took the more resilient fruit with me.

Matter of interest, what do you actually use to transport your 'nids? So many spikey bits that can easily snap.

It's definitely hard to cross that table on foot against Yak's list. It just has all the firepower he needs to keep most armies at bay. Either focusing down the big target or weight of firing down everything else. The key here is definitely the tetras. If those go down asap, the game becomes much harder for him.

Btw, you going to BAO, Yak?

In that first round where you pinned his fire warriors, and then they failed morale, is that how it works now?

I was under the impression that once pinned, they couldn't fail morale since they were to busy hugging the dirt. Have I been playing that wrong?

Edit: I have been.

It's annoying when your dice betray you but look at this way - you used up more than your fair share of bad luck so you are due some really hot dice.

Haha great report, and im sorry about your terrible rolls

ChimpPimpin wrote:
have you tried running the commander with iridium armour? I've found its been an invaluable upgrade, especially when you have the 2 shield drones too (they have the same armour save as the commander)

I have not tried that. Iridium Armor always just struck me as being too many points...I normally try to keep my points spread around as much as my can in my armies to that I don't feel like I'm sunk if I lose any one thing. But with the way LoS works in 6th edition, having that 2+ save and the ability to pass off AP2 wounds onto Shield Drones does sound like it could be a really nice combination. Losing the extra D6" when thrusting sounds like a problem to me, because the way I use the unit I rely on that extra movement all the time to keep them out of harms way or just to get them across the board when I really need them to move. They'd also be much easier to catch to lock in combat (which is a big concern too).

Certainly seems like something I could consider trying though if it has worked for you.

how are the 12 man fire warrior squads performing? they weren't really mentioned in the bat-rep (apart from being pinned), im tempted to start maxing mine out.

They seem amazing to me in 6th edition. Their Ld is still their Achilles heel, so I think I may start biting the bullet and taking the sgt upgrade to make them Ld8, especially now that you can regroup even under 50%, that Ld8 seems more worth the 10 points than ever.

Do you need that many broadsides? I've found that 3 has been enough in the UK tournament scene, but our meta might be different (mech is pretty dead at the moment).

Well, at 1,500 points I had been running 4 and that seemed about right since I was running them without shield drones. I used to run them with 1 or even 2 shield drones but then I just realized for every 2 shield drones I drop that's practically the points cost right there for another Broadside. So I take them naked with just Blacksun Filters to keep them cheap and take more than I probably need to account for losing one or two or failing a Ld test, etc. With that said, if I had built this list 'legally' I might have dropped the 5th Broadside anyway.

i've been running this list at 1850:

Shas'o Commander: Plasma rifle, missile pod, shield generator, HW multi-tracker, HW drone controller (2 shield drones), HW blacksun filter, Iridium armour

3x Crisis suit team, missile pods, plasma rifle, multi-trackers

6x fire warriors
10x kroot
10x kroot
2x Sensor towers (forgeworld)

2x tetras, 2x targetting arrays, 1x target lock

3x broadsides, multi-trackers, team leader, HW blacksun
2x hammerheads, plasma turret (forgeworld), gun drones, disruption pods, blacksun filters

Aegis defence line

allies:

Ghazghkull

10x lootas

26x ork shoota boys

for 1750 I drop the aegis, the shas'o upgrade & the gun drones on the hammerheads. (going forward I think ill be dropping the aeigs & shas'o upgrade in the 1850 too, swapping them for 3x ork lobbas)

the sensor towers can twin-link & give night vision to any unit within 6", including the orks. Twin linked lootas are amazing! the fireknife squad usually uses the second tower. the plasma hammerheads are brutal (dakka dread stats, but ignoring marine armour, and for the same price as the ion-cannon), and having the gun drones as scoring in the scouring mission can be game winning (and they wont give a vp away unless detached first)

Plus Ghazzy in a big squad of boys as a counterattacking/ bubblewrapping unit is a whole lot of fun!

Yeah, having Ghaz would be one hell of a counter-attack! But that is a LOT of points for basically what amounts to a nasty deterrent.

A regular Warboss with Mega-Armor, Cybork Body, Bosspole & 10 points for a big shoota (if they could take one) is only 125 points. So you're paying that 100 point premium for +1WS, +1W, +1A, +1 bonus attack on the charge and his special Waaagh. That is a lot of stuff for a 100 points, but I don't know if its entirely worth it. It seems like maybe having just a regular Warboss on bike might work for quite a bit less (but I'm not sure).

As for the sensor towers, I totally see the rules basis for allowing them to affect the Orks as their rules simply say 'any unit', but given the fluff behind the Sensor tower (they provide telemetry data to TAU units), I think its safe to say that is simply a loophole that would not stand up to actual scrutiny by any judge or TO who doesn't allow blatant loopholes.

Its one of the reasons I'm probably going to drop the KFF Mek for sure. I was kind of counting on the fact that when they FAQ'd it, they left it as affecting any unit within range, which by the RAW means it affects enemy units (including your allies of convenience)...but again, I think that's almost assuredly a loophole that will eventually be closed so I don't think I should get used to using it.







Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dok wrote:
It's definitely hard to cross that table on foot against Yak's list. It just has all the firepower he needs to keep most armies at bay. Either focusing down the big target or weight of firing down everything else. The key here is definitely the tetras. If those go down asap, the game becomes much harder for him.

Btw, you going to BAO, Yak?

Nope not going.

This is your year to take home the prize! Do it!

Yak is back!

Well played, buddy. Always good to see two good players getting in a good game!

 sudojoe wrote:
I find that 30 shoota boys on overwatch is a pretty good combat deterent as well

I've essentially dropped nobs from my builds. Anything that truely threatens the mob like abbadon or some other super death star of assaults (D.lord + wraiths or harlistar come to mind), I'd just ignore by running away if possible and/or just shoot them with the enhanced power of the tau guns. 30 ork shootas is a lot of death. good odds of taking out a 5 man space marine squad in one go at the very least and is only 180 points of nearly impossible to budge objective camper. (almost no matter what you do, it'll take a pounding and still be on an objective or by the time they are so widdled down and finally run away, it's usually done more than enough damage or sucked up shooting from enough things to allow the other squishy tau to live on)

I tend to stick the commander in with some fire warriors to boost their Ld so I don't fail as hard vs stuff like the doom or even just taking a few casualties. With target lock, I can still have him engage other things from the squad. Also, I generally get the "sarge" for my fire warrior squads taking the BSF, so my warlord won't have to.

In the context of a Tau army with ork allies, I agree that those shoota boys don't really need a PK Nob. Their roles as a cannon fodder, screening/tarpitting unit necessitates for the unit to be 1) cheap and 2) a lot of models. That's why I would much prefer to add more boys instead of a PK Nob in the unit. Anything that is going to tie them down - i.e. walkers and T7+ MC's - should be blown away by the broadsides and fireknives.

I would much rather put the BSF on the commander rather than the squad. This way, I would have the flexibility of joining different squads and providing them with the benefits instead.

ChimpPimpin wrote:
I've been reading jy2s bat reps for a long time now-consistently entertaining, well written, & v v informative!

This is the first time I've been tempted to post though-as yakface is running a similar list to the one i've been running since the start of 6th. Its so rare (i've only come across 1 other person in the UK tournament scene who ran anything even close to similar), its always useful to get someone elses experiences.

Welcome to dakka, and thank you very much.

I'm glad my report has prompted you to get involved. I hope Yak has answered your questions. While I am not an expert in Tau, I will give you my honest advice on your list. The strongest lists have a clear focus. Your list, I'm afraid, does not. Is it a shooty army or an assault one? IMO, you should focus on one or the other. It's true that Ghazghkull is a beast. However, he is expensive and he takes away from what I feel is your true strength - your shooting. I agree with Yak that you can probably get away with a much cheaper warboss and then focus more on your shooting, or perhaps even break up the unit of boys into 2 units. More screening units help because they buy you more time to shoot. Just something for you to consider.

djn wrote:
Another great report. Hopefully you'll get back to winning ways for the BAO, very unlucky the last two reports. Thanks again for sharing!

No worries. I'd rather my string of bad luck and losing streak to happen now than in the tournament.

 SabrX wrote:

 jy2 wrote:



I don't think they will do well against my wraithwing necrons.

I don't know about that. Sure you beat me in that 2500pts Necrons vs. Tau + Ork game (which will never be posted due to camera malfunction), but that was due to insane luck and sneaky usage of multiple flyers in Relic. In the end, I lost a single squad of 30 shoota Boyz, but the other 5 squads were still alive. You did manage to beat both my Nobz Bikers and Warboss though, but you lost all 18 Wraiths and your Scarabs + Spyders. Then again, my dice were also hot rolling so many 6's, but that's nothing compared to how many times you stopped Zogwort turning your Destroyer Lord into a Squig (or sexy Daemonette model).

What necrons will have trouble against is an ork army with a lot of models. Your army was essentially an ork army with Tau allies. But the reverse - Tau army with ork allies - favor the very fast necrons. In short, the more orks (and therefore, the less tau) you have in your army, the tougher it will be for the crons.

On the other hand, with tyranids it is the complete opposite. The more tau you have in your army (and therefore, the less orks), the tougher it will be for the bugs.

 DexKivuli wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

McBain wrote:

My favourite part of the report though was the giant blue capsicum spore!

Due to reasons of traveling, I didn't want to bring my more fragile spore with me so I took the more resilient fruit with me.

Matter of interest, what do you actually use to transport your 'nids? So many spikey bits that can easily snap.

I use KR Multicase to transport my tyranids. It was actually the very first time I have transported them in this fashion and it worked out very well. However, I took it on the plane as carry-on because I'm afraid of sending it with the rest of the checked-in luggage.

Their website is here:

http://www.krmulticase.com/

Here are some pictures:

 Dok wrote:
It's definitely hard to cross that table on foot against Yak's list. It just has all the firepower he needs to keep most armies at bay. Either focusing down the big target or weight of firing down everything else. The key here is definitely the tetras. If those go down asap, the game becomes much harder for him.

Btw, you going to BAO, Yak?

My army can do it. I am confidant of that. It just happened that today was just not my day.

 djones520 wrote:
In that first round where you pinned his fire warriors, and then they failed morale, is that how it works now?

I was under the impression that once pinned, they couldn't fail morale since they were to busy hugging the dirt. Have I been playing that wrong?

Edit: I have been.

Yes. It is entirely possible to be pinned and still have to take morale tests at the end of the turn.

However, for marines (or units with ATSKNF), that is actually a good thing. Say, the ATSKNF unit gets pinned. They then fail morale and fall back. However, because of ATSKNF, next turn they auto-regroup and can act normally.

So it's bad for the xenos (and IG) but good for marines.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
It's annoying when your dice betray you but look at this way - you used up more than your fair share of bad luck so you are due some really hot dice.

I hope so.

Talking of transporting Nids, what do yu do with your gargoyles? Are they placed in deep slots with the stands permanent attached, or do you remove them and put them on every game?

Eldercaveman wrote:
Talking of transporting Nids, what do yu do with your gargoyles? Are they placed in deep slots with the stands permanent attached, or do you remove them and put them on every game?

Later on when I get home, I will take pictures of how I store my tyranids.

It's probably much easier to show rather than to try to explain.

 jy2 wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:
Talking of transporting Nids, what do yu do with your gargoyles? Are they placed in deep slots with the stands permanent attached, or do you remove them and put them on every game?

Later on when I get home, I will take pictures of how I store my tyranids.

It's probably much easier to show rather than to try to explain.

That'd be awesome

 jy2 wrote:

ChimpPimpin wrote:
I've been reading jy2s bat reps for a long time now-consistently entertaining, well written, & v v informative!

This is the first time I've been tempted to post though-as yakface is running a similar list to the one i've been running since the start of 6th. Its so rare (i've only come across 1 other person in the UK tournament scene who ran anything even close to similar), its always useful to get someone elses experiences.

Welcome to dakka, and thank you very much.

I'm glad my report has prompted you to get involved. I hope Yak has answered your questions. While I am not an expert in Tau, I will give you my honest advice on your list. The strongest lists have a clear focus. Your list, I'm afraid, does not. Is it a shooty army or an assault one? IMO, you should focus on one or the other. It's true that Ghazghkull is a beast. However, he is expensive and he takes away from what I feel is your true strength - your shooting. I agree with Yak that you can probably get away with a much cheaper warboss and then focus more on your shooting, or perhaps even break up the unit of boys into 2 units. More screening units help because they buy you more time to shoot. Just something for you to consider.

Thanks for your advice, Its always good to have some constructive criticism. It forces you to take a look at things from a different angle. I will say that the focus is still on shooting, its just that-with Ghazzy-I don't have to run the 5th ed tactic of sacrificing units & trying to break in the right assault phase. I aim to win the combat. I wanted to pull away from the old 5th ed game plan, of layer, block & shoot, mainly because it always felt like 1-2 bad turns of shooting and it was game over. Tau have always had big squads of cannon fodder, but Ghazzy gives the something it never had before: a beat-stick that can actually move towards the enemy lines.

Its easy to underestimate how much shooting the list puts out too, its quality over quantity but with markerlights I'm usually hitting on 2's, wounding on 2's with no armour saves or cover saves.

I don't want to be one of those people that gets all defensive when other people give their opinions though!

I really struggle against all-out assaulty lists like your nids, or daemons . The extra bubble wrap from your suggestion would help massively in those games.

When I finally get round to converting & painting more ork boys (I've modelled them all with kroot heads & 2 guns) Ill be giving your ideas above a try!

Thanks again to both of you!

 yakface wrote:


Nope not going.

This is your year to take home the prize! Do it!

Oh snap, the yakface bump! I'll do my best but I have maybe 4 more 6th games under my belt than you , haha

 DexKivuli wrote:

Matter of interest, what do you actually use to transport your 'nids? So many spikey bits that can easily snap.

Eldercaveman wrote:
Talking of transporting Nids, what do yu do with your gargoyles? Are they placed in deep slots with the stands permanent attached, or do you remove them and put them on every game?

Ok, finally took some pictures of my case and how I stored my tyranids. I was using a case from KR Multi-case:



Termagants in the box. Gargoyles just in plastic bags.



You can customize this tray to fit various sizes of models and/or vehicles.

ChimpPimpin wrote:

Thanks for your advice, Its always good to have some constructive criticism. It forces you to take a look at things from a different angle. I will say that the focus is still on shooting, its just that-with Ghazzy-I don't have to run the 5th ed tactic of sacrificing units & trying to break in the right assault phase. I aim to win the combat. I wanted to pull away from the old 5th ed game plan, of layer, block & shoot, mainly because it always felt like 1-2 bad turns of shooting and it was game over. Tau have always had big squads of cannon fodder, but Ghazzy gives the something it never had before: a beat-stick that can actually move towards the enemy lines.

Its easy to underestimate how much shooting the list puts out too, its quality over quantity but with markerlights I'm usually hitting on 2's, wounding on 2's with no armour saves or cover saves.

I don't want to be one of those people that gets all defensive when other people give their opinions though!

I really struggle against all-out assaulty lists like your nids, or daemons . The extra bubble wrap from your suggestion would help massively in those games.

When I finally get round to converting & painting more ork boys (I've modelled them all with kroot heads & 2 guns) Ill be giving your ideas above a try!

Thanks again to both of you!

No worries. Playing with what you like is definitely more important than playing with the most optimized list. As long as you are happy running Ghazzy, that's all that really matters. Just like me running both Typhus and Abaddon in my CSM list. Would it be better to just run one of those HQ's? Probably....but I just love Abaddon and am having such a blast running the both of them together. In that list, fun definitely takes priority over competitive. Of course when you tire of your HQ, you can always swap him out.